Will China be brought to account?
Discussion
fblm said:
BlackLabel said:
China’s greatest strength is that it thinks and plans decades into the future whereas our politicians can’t think any further than the next newspaper headline/opinion poll/election.
I agree. Just imagine how a politician who did have a bold vision and a sensible long term plan, god forbid with some cross party cooperation, well articulated to the public, who's party got behind them to start delivering without infighting and publicly tearing each other apart... just imagine how they would fair at the polls and be remembered. Never going to happen I know. Christ it almost doesn't matter what it is at this point, just something, anything that isn't a complete fvcking s
tshow from the outset. 
BlackLabel said:
China’s greatest strength is that it thinks and plans decades into the future whereas our politicians can’t think any further than the next newspaper headline/opinion poll/election.
That’s a strength is it? Frankly I’d rather have what we have than that, if it involves complete control and lack of freedom for the population, as it does in China. China is a huge scab on the planet at this time, politically and by almost any measure you choose.
REALIST123 said:
BlackLabel said:
China’s greatest strength is that it thinks and plans decades into the future whereas our politicians can’t think any further than the next newspaper headline/opinion poll/election.
That’s a strength is it? Frankly I’d rather have what we have than that, if it involves complete control and lack of freedom for the population, as it does in China. China is a huge scab on the planet at this time, politically and by almost any measure you choose.
Have you ever been to China?
jamoor said:
REALIST123 said:
BlackLabel said:
China’s greatest strength is that it thinks and plans decades into the future whereas our politicians can’t think any further than the next newspaper headline/opinion poll/election.
That’s a strength is it? Frankly I’d rather have what we have than that, if it involves complete control and lack of freedom for the population, as it does in China. China is a huge scab on the planet at this time, politically and by almost any measure you choose.
Have you ever been to China?
BlackLabel said:
China’s greatest strength is that it thinks and plans decades into the future whereas our politicians can’t think any further than the next newspaper headline/opinion poll/election.
Only to an extent.Democratic countries also have long term desires and 'direction' via culture, shared prosperity and competition. Culture also provides a 'world view' and democracies will aim towards that via the voting public and the manifestoes that politicians think will win votes. This therefore doesn't necessarily require a long term government written plan as it is embedded within the voting public and the system of democracy.
GroundZero said:
Tuna said:
China has a financial war chest that means it could crash the entire Western banking system overnight if it wanted to.
.
Heard this mentioned before, how would this work exactly?.
Reminds me of Edward I building his castles in North Wales. The Jews supplying his gold ran out, hence Beaumaris was never finished. He just booted them all out.
We ought to remember that Chinese people are subjugated. We must not conflate the CCP with China?
There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
Trophy Husband said:
We ought to remember that Chinese people are subjugated. We must not conflate the CCP with China?
There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
While standards (earning power, access to meat / food / etc) continues to rise and the middle class continue to grow, I don't think there will be one.There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
A big recession or depression would be a different story.
Trophy Husband said:
We ought to remember that Chinese people are subjugated. We must not conflate the CCP with China?
There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
The prroblem is that technology has advanced alot since the last fall of communism and the CCP has used it extensively to exert control over the population.There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
It would have to be one hell of a revolt for it to be sucecssful.
Trophy Husband said:
GroundZero said:
Tuna said:
China has a financial war chest that means it could crash the entire Western banking system overnight if it wanted to.
.
Heard this mentioned before, how would this work exactly?.
Reminds me of Edward I building his castles in North Wales. The Jews supplying his gold ran out, hence Beaumaris was never finished. He just booted them all out.
fblm said:
Yes it's mostly bo11ocks fueled by a crap book a few years ago called Currency Wars or something. They have about 3 trillion in foreign reserves, 1 trillion in treasuries. Ultimately if they try and dump them to raise US rates the fed could buy the lot in a single ticket (remember qe?). In any event, currency reserves aside the biggest loser from an economic cold war would be wealthy Chinese; think sanctions/UWO's/frozen assets/cancelled visas/espionage charges/export bans/restrictions on $/gbp/euro markets...
The Sword of Damocles is hanging over the CCP in my opinion. They are in a headlong rush now to control the Chinese people as much as possible before it drops. In my estimation and, ironically, this virus, whether man made, deliberately set free or whatever, will be, historically, the worst mistake, disaster or fateful scenario that the CCP will ever have had to deal with. I think it will bring them down within 10 years maximum. Fingers crossed. f
k you Winnie the Pooh.vaud said:
Trophy Husband said:
We ought to remember that Chinese people are subjugated. We must not conflate the CCP with China?
There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
While standards (earning power, access to meat / food / etc) continues to rise and the middle class continue to grow, I don't think there will be one.There will be a revolt against the CCP I believe, in my lifetime (I'm 53). The wealthier Chinese people become in relative terms to their own situations 20 years ago the more they will realise that they are the engine room of their economy, CCP or not.
Communism always fails eventually. It was ever thus.
A big recession or depression would be a different story.
Moneyed people are actively looking to find ways to get their wealth outside China as they can see which way things are going.
Middle classes no longer have the huge disposable incomes they once had and the migrant workers have been hit hard.
The CCP is seen as keeping them all safe during the epidemic (at the moment) but not sure their approval will be long lived.
Trophy Husband said:
The Sword of Damocles is hanging over the CCP in my opinion. They are in a headlong rush now to control the Chinese people as much as possible before it drops. In my estimation and, ironically, this virus, whether man made, deliberately set free or whatever, will be, historically, the worst mistake, disaster or fateful scenario that the CCP will ever have had to deal with. I think it will bring them down within 10 years maximum. Fingers crossed.
fk you Winnie the Pooh.
I'm not sure about that. Irrespective of where and how it originated, the initial cover up, the questions over their real numbers etc... the fact is their response, which may have seemed brutal and repressive at the time was effective in looking after China and they can point at the USA (and everywhere else) now and, with some justification, claim the Chinese system is better. In some ways it is. Throw in some propaganda, a sprinkling of nationalism, teach kids how great you are, control the media, jail anyone who disagrees... jobs a good un. Before you know it the useful idiots in the west will be clamoring to emulate them.f
k you Winnie the Pooh.fblm said:
Yes it's mostly bo11ocks fueled by a crap book a few years ago called Currency Wars or something. They have about 3 trillion in foreign reserves, 1 trillion in treasuries. Ultimately if they try and dump them to raise US rates the fed could buy the lot in a single ticket (remember qe?). In any event, currency reserves aside the biggest loser from an economic cold war would be wealthy Chinese; think sanctions/UWO's/frozen assets/cancelled visas/espionage charges/export bans/restrictions on $/gbp/euro markets...
There are other factors. Whilst the reported gold reserves are in line with expectations, there is reasonable evidence that China has been on a long term buying spree for the last decade. Estimated reserves are significantly higher. Similarly with commodities. China has built up a war chest and can put its finger on the scales should it wish to.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff