2019 Retailers in trouble thread

[anonymous-user]

elanfan said:

impose customs duties on foreign based internet retailers to try to create a more level playing field our town centres will only comprise of charity shops, betting shops and coffee shops and even those will close without footfall.

They already do when I buy a high price item from America, customs take a hefty chunk.
I think a lot of towns have already become like you describe.
I never understood how a council would rather have an empty shop and no rates coming in rather than a shop open with reduce rates.

[Vanden Saab]

jakesmith said:

Argos have certainly made serious moves to keep up. 10 years ago you’d think amazon would have killed them but they have invested and grown

Computers in all their stores to check stock
Massive promotional activity
WOW deals that offer genuinely exclusive products at low prices in many categories
Move to digital advertising attempting to copy Amazon but at least picking up revenue there
Move to omnichannel using Sainsbury’s estate as pick up points with an upgraded logistics capability to support fast delivery to larger number of stores
Complete store rebrand

The beauty with Argos is that they actually have what they sell in stock normally the same as John Lewis.... so you can walk out with the item you buy... I went to CurrysPCWorld to buy 3 electrical items and despite having all three items on display they don't now stock anything it seems as none of the items were available. Bought all 3 from John Lewis and will get some vouchers as Mrs VS has a John Lewis CC. CurrysPCWorld is my pick for 2019 along with every other shop that doesn't actually hold stock of what they sell...It is like going to a petrol station to buy fuel and being expected to pay for the fuel but to come back tomorrow to fill up.

[anonymous-user]

Agree on Curry's PC World. Awful shops. Awful experience. No customer service. No stock. No hope.

[eccles]

janesmith1950 said:

Agree on Curry's PC World. Awful shops. Awful experience. No customer service. No stock. No hope.

I really don't understand them, several times we've tried to use them and they never have stock, but you can't order it in store, and they don't know when they'll be getting new stock! Twice I've had the same guff from management types in store, and they really came across as if they didn't care.

[ambuletz]

I think argos are still relevant. being able to check stock AND reserve it is a big benefit to me. reserving is free and i know ill be able to pick that item up at any point during my day. I actually prefer going to argos to pick up a video game on release day than having to go to the likes of GAME because

- there wont be a massive line in argos, unlike GAME.
- someone in GAME won't try and sell me offers for a video game we both know is st and nobody would ever want
- i dont need to create an account
- i can go at any time during that day to pick it up and dont need to speak to anyone.
- more reliable than ordering it online and the game not turning up on release day.

[jakesmith]

eccles said:

I really don't understand them, several times we've tried to use them and they never have stock, but you can't order it in store, and they don't know when they'll be getting new stock! Twice I've had the same guff from management types in store, and they really came across as if they didn't care.

I have worked for that business before and have friends who work there. It is not inside information to say they are in serious trouble. Not only did the acquisition of Carphone not deliver the goods after just a few years as consumers move to buying from networks directly and keeping handsets for 2 or more years, but their massive store estate requires a huge investment to keep adequately staffed and modernised.
I wonder if they paid their staff £2 an hour more to get better staff, at a cost of about £20m (300 stores, 15 staff per store, working 2000 hours a year each), they would recoup some of this in better customer experience and maybe ensure better longevity.
It is not easy or maybe even that possible, to manage a huge retail chain and make it profitable and have a good customer experience, as the margins are thin now the internet is really taking over

[eccles]

jakesmith said:

eccles said:

I really don't understand them, several times we've tried to use them and they never have stock, but you can't order it in store, and they don't know when they'll be getting new stock! Twice I've had the same guff from management types in store, and they really came across as if they didn't care.

I have worked for that business before and have friends who work there. It is not inside information to say they are in serious trouble. Not only did the acquisition of Carphone not deliver the goods after just a few years as consumers move to buying from networks directly and keeping handsets for 2 or more years, but their massive store estate requires a huge investment to keep adequately staffed and modernised.
I wonder if they paid their staff £2 an hour more to get better staff, at a cost of about £20m (300 stores, 15 staff per store, working 2000 hours a year each), they would recoup some of this in better customer experience and maybe ensure better longevity.
It is not easy or maybe even that possible, to manage a huge retail chain and make it profitable and have a good customer experience, as the margins are thin now the internet is really taking over

I'm not sure that paying the staff more will help when it seems to be their model that you can see something in the shop, but they have no stock, you can't order it there and then, and they don't know when they'll have stock in. This happened in shops on opposite sides of the country, so it's not as if it's a local issue.
Perhaps paying staff more would make them seem to care a bit more when they can't supply you something they have on show and advertise in the press!

[miniman]

Quick timeline of emerging competitors to HMV's core business.

[jakesmith]

eccles said:

jakesmith said:

eccles said:

I really don't understand them, several times we've tried to use them and they never have stock, but you can't order it in store, and they don't know when they'll be getting new stock! Twice I've had the same guff from management types in store, and they really came across as if they didn't care.

I have worked for that business before and have friends who work there. It is not inside information to say they are in serious trouble. Not only did the acquisition of Carphone not deliver the goods after just a few years as consumers move to buying from networks directly and keeping handsets for 2 or more years, but their massive store estate requires a huge investment to keep adequately staffed and modernised.
I wonder if they paid their staff £2 an hour more to get better staff, at a cost of about £20m (300 stores, 15 staff per store, working 2000 hours a year each), they would recoup some of this in better customer experience and maybe ensure better longevity.
It is not easy or maybe even that possible, to manage a huge retail chain and make it profitable and have a good customer experience, as the margins are thin now the internet is really taking over

I'm not sure that paying the staff more will help when it seems to be their model that you can see something in the shop, but they have no stock, you can't order it there and then, and they don't know when they'll have stock in. This happened in shops on opposite sides of the country, so it's not as if it's a local issue.
Perhaps paying staff more would make them seem to care a bit more when they can't supply you something they have on show and advertise in the press!

Sorry I wasn't responding directly to your specific issue more the abysmal in store experience contributed to by demotivated staff who don't care about good customer service

[kev1974]

Argos is great. I only know about London because that's where I live, so they may be doing it in other areas of the country as well, but as well as the "click and collect next day" thing, they've had the sense to arrange their daily truck schedules to include early afternoon deliveries to many stores, which if you get your order in in the morning, allows them to offer "click and collect *today* from 4pm" on many products. I certainly find it a lot easier to go and pick something up at my convenience than having to wait in all day for Amazon who are totally unpredictable what time they'll show (and sometimes get to 8pm and give up until the next day anyway).

[HTP99]

I'm in the motor trade and on my most recent training course some of the subject matter was online sales and how many people purchase and research their purchases now and how the motor trade and dealerships needs to adapt to more online interaction.

Anyway Argos came up, the trainer was saying how they had adapted spectacularly to the changing market and even though they didn't directly sell online and still had outlets, the way that the whole business model worked; purchased by JS and having small outlets in large JS stores with a larger out of town outlet nearby, to supply said smaller in-store outlet, with pretty much every product available for an instant or next day pick up; crucially at your leisure and with no awkward parking and/or charges, so no waiting about in, for your replacement telly to arrive.

I think Argos are very secure.

Edited by HTP99 on Saturday 29th December 13:48

[alock]

HTP99 said:

I think Argos are very secure.

I've started using Argos more for things I don't trust Amazon with. Amazon haven't done enough to make me 100% confident that many electrical items are genuine and not some Chinese ripoff.

[Sixpackpert]

alock said:

HTP99 said:

I think Argos are very secure.

I've started using Argos more for things I don't trust Amazon with. Amazon haven't done enough to make me 100% confident that many electrical items are genuine and not some Chinese ripoff.

I used Argos to buy my new Echo Show. Amazon were quoting 4 week delivery time. My local Argos (in a Sainsbury's) had one for immediate collection. Job jobbed, picked up dinner at the same time.

aaahhh, The laminated book of dreams!

[jakesmith]

alock said:

I've started using Argos more for things I don't trust Amazon with. Amazon haven't done enough to make me 100% confident that many electrical items are genuine and not some Chinese ripoff.

That's a very good point, they really do sell some crap on Amazon, dashcams that stop working after 3 weeks. I bought some for our fleet and they were rubbish. They had good reviews but the problem is Amazon reviews only highlight if a product was in line with the purchaser's expectations.
Argos by contrast pick a range of products
Amazon should have a 'validated' or 'authentic' certification scheme but it would be like trying to moderate Facebook

[MitchT]

elanfan said:

I think unless the government acts to properly tax online retailers and/or impose customs duties on foreign based internet retailers to try to create a more level playing field our town centres will only comprise of charity shops, betting shops and coffee shops and even those will close without footfall.

It's not just having a fair playing field across online/physical retail that needs to happen, there needs to be joined-up thinking across multiple areas...

I spend less on things I can avoid buying because I'm having to spend more on things I can't avoid buying, such as council tax, energy bills and food, thanks to these rising in cost so much faster than wages. Physical businesses have challenges like high rents and business rates, not just the online threat. When I do want to buy something from a physical store I get bent over for parking. If I want to get the train to my nearest major city I get bent over for parking at the train station - if there's even any available - and then I get bent over again for train fares which, like council tax, energy bills and food, have risen far faster than wages. I like to set off out for the day, visit stores and have a bite to eat while I'm out but, increasingly, the peripheral costs are making me think "sod that" and head online to buy things. There needs to be joined-up thinking across taxing retailers' profits, applying business charges, car parking, train fares ad the wider cost of living issues that are leaving people with less to spend to begin with.

[eltawater]

HTP99 said:

I'm in the motor trade and on my most recent training course some of the subject matter was online sales and how many people purchase and research their purchases now and how the motor trade and dealerships needs to adapt to more online interaction.

Anyway Argos came up, the trainer was saying how they had adapted spectacularly to the changing market and even though they didn't directly sell online and still had outlets, the way that the whole business model worked; purchased by JS and having small outlets in large JS stores with a larger out of town outlet nearby, to supply said smaller in-store outlet, with pretty much every product available for an instant or next day pick up; crucially at your leisure and with no awkward parking and/or charges, so now waiting about in, for your replacement telly to arrive.

I think Argos are very secure.

That's almost right. Argos have sold directly online for a long time with what are known as one man (kettles, toys etc) and two man (tvs, furniture, white goods) being fulfilled out of regional distribution centres. I worked for Home retail group for 4 years during the transition period.

What your trainer described is the hub and spoke model which was introduced with stock being concentrated in larger stores and being shuttled out to smaller stores by vans several times a day. This coincided with the introduction of the fast track delivery option to load smaller lines onto said vans and deliver them to customer houses the same day. It was just concentrating the cost of running the vans and beating Amazon at their own game.

The collection point concept was actually precipitated by the digital stores concept which had smaller pop up stores in a couple of London train stations during Christmas and the small digital stores in Homebase. These had to come out when Homebase was sold off but transitioned into collection points at Sainsbury's. The big IT costs of these were the infrastructure to enable customers to order items, neatly bypassed by the collection points as they rely on the customers having placed their orders earlier in the day.

That's not to say that Argos don't continue to face challenges, as they're constantly in a battle with Amazon and AO who are strong on the front of delivering white goods same day. Margins are pretty tight on consumer goods when you can buy the same thing from multiple retailers, something which toys r us never recovered from.

[wjwren]

Homebase.


Argos wont be going anywhere

[TRIUMPHBULLET]

I suspect Currys will last a couple of years yet,people still seem to think they are ok,they must like having extended warranties rammed down their throats
Their days are numbered though,as stated before it's no good advertising good deals if they don't have the items in stock.
I have always rated Argos as mediocre but they do seem to have upped their game in terms of actually having items in stock.
I don't think anyone will notice if Homebase goes under though.

[bloomen]

Whoever's been running Argos deserves a pat on the balance sheet. Their alignment with Ebay was a wise move too.

I find the whole Currys process irritating as hell. I want to go into somewhere, find something, pay for it, leave. I don't want to have to find someone strolling around, ask permission to buy something and have them wander away and back to find out they ain't got it.

I've no idea who set that process up, but they're tts. It's the least appealing way to shop possible.

Edited by bloomen on Saturday 29th December 17:59

[Murph7355]

Lemming Train said:

Raygun said:

No people like time checks and latest news with radio so they know what's going on in the world so I can't see radio DJ's disappearing for quite a while yet.

No-one under the age of 40 listens to commercial radio.

Not convinced...

https://www.rajar.co.uk/docs/news/RAJAR_DataReleas...