Happy you voted Tory?

[NorthernBoy]

thinfourth2 said:

Which brings me back to ask.

If the system isn't broken how did he get to be PM?

There are millions of people in the country who'll vote for a monkey as long as it's wearing the right colour rosette, which explains how you get elected to parliament.

To get the nomination, it appears that you can kiss the right arses, grease the right palms, or just serve your time in the ranks of the party. Once you're in, the right amount of politicking, and being in the right place at the right time, and even a lunatic sociopath can once in a while find that they are running the whole show.

[eharding]

dandarez said:

UKIP stands a massive chance next time.

UKIP would have to raise its game by several orders of magnitude in order to get a sniff at any form of power.

Today, UKIP is seen as the refuge of swivel-eyed loonies and a hobby for failed conservatives peers.

I suspect that the sort of makeover required to make UKIP a serious player would result in most of the existing UKIP leadership and activists being locked in a dark room wearing straitjackets and scrawling 'Kill Cameron' on the walls with toe-held crayons, whilst some rather more organised folk got on with the job of making them electable.

[slipstream 1985]

F93 said:

I wish the conservatives had someone as will-powered as Thatcher again (not starting that debate, just her 'i'm gonna do it anyway' attitude). Cameron seems to be good willed, but doesn't seem to have the courage to push for things...

But I guess when he has to please the Liberal Democrats who are essentially opposite to his party's views, he can't really do that much...

Apparently a lot of Tory voters are swinging over to UKIP now, as they're getting tired of the tory's complete inaction on anything to do with the EU. Maybe now the Lib Dems are screwed, the new third largest party will be UKIP? I'd like to see that happen...

ukip and tory coalition

[Mojocvh]

"wants our independence back and only UKIP can supply."

Supply exactly what? More broken dreams whilst the troughs get fuller??

[Life Saab Itch]

KENZ said:

O'h come on winkey wasn't that bad a person. Granted he was a PR disaster at times..

No, really,

[powerstroke]

F93 said:

I wish the conservatives had someone as will-powered as Thatcher again (not starting that debate, just her 'i'm gonna do it anyway' attitude). Cameron seems to be good willed, but doesn't seem to have the courage to push for things...

But I guess when he has to please the Liberal Democrats who are essentially opposite to his party's views, he can't really do that much...

Apparently a lot of Tory voters are swinging over to UKIP now, as they're getting tired of the tory's complete inaction on anything to do with the EU. Maybe now the Lib Dems are screwed, the new third largest party will be UKIP? I'd like to see that happen...

I dont think you can call it inaction... they are pro EU!!!! I see CMD as a latter day Ted Heath = or tosser in plain speak....

[thinfourth2]

eharding said:

UKIP would have to raise its game by several orders of magnitude in order to get a sniff at any form of power.

Today, UKIP is seen as the refuge of swivel-eyed loonies and a hobby for failed conservatives peers.

I suspect that the sort of makeover required to make UKIP a serious player would result in most of the existing UKIP leadership and activists being locked in a dark room wearing straitjackets and scrawling 'Kill Cameron' on the walls with toe-held crayons, whilst some rather more organised folk got on with the job of making them electable.

Would you prefer a two party system?

Where we can choose a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone or a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone

[ewenm]

thinfourth2 said:

Would you prefer a two party system?

Where we can choose a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone or a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone

Which is different to our current system how?

[thinfourth2]

ewenm said:

Which is different to our current system how?

I'll get back to you on that one

[powerstroke]

thinfourth2 said:

Would you prefer a two party system?

Where we can choose a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone or a bunch of middle of the road idiots who are desperate not to upset anyone

Good point but I think thats where we are at the moment labour spent the last 20 ish years trying to be like the consrvatives and they spent their time modeling themselves on new labour .....hence hung parliment and pact with libs....

[Zod]

eharding said:

UKIP would have to raise its game by several orders of magnitude in order to get a sniff at any form of power.

Today, UKIP is seen as the refuge of swivel-eyed loonies and a hobby for failed conservatives peers.

I suspect that the sort of makeover required to make UKIP a serious player would result in most of the existing UKIP leadership and activists being locked in a dark room wearing straitjackets and scrawling 'Kill Cameron' on the walls with toe-held crayons, whilst some rather more organised folk got on with the job of making them electable.

This man speaks sense. UKIP have no talent and no credibility.

[whoami]

Zod said:

eharding said:

UKIP would have to raise its game by several orders of magnitude in order to get a sniff at any form of power.

Today, UKIP is seen as the refuge of swivel-eyed loonies and a hobby for failed conservatives peers.

I suspect that the sort of makeover required to make UKIP a serious player would result in most of the existing UKIP leadership and activists being locked in a dark room wearing straitjackets and scrawling 'Kill Cameron' on the walls with toe-held crayons, whilst some rather more organised folk got on with the job of making them electable.

This man speaks sense. UKIP have no talent and no credibility.

They would appear to be in good company.

[thinfourth2]

Zod said:

This man speaks sense. UKIP have no talent and no credibility.

Once they perfect ignoring people and fiddling expenses they will be perfectly electable

[KenBlocksPants]

I really struggled with my vote this time around. I am usually a Labour voter (Dons flame proof suit round here) and normally dont agree with the majority of the conservative policies.

The reason I struggled for several reasons:

1) The Conservative MP in my area is hopeless and my Labour MP has been very good in recent years. So it made sense locally.

2) Nationally however it really would have been a disaster to keep winky wonky in power and head of the Labour party. He was hopeless and a real disaster for many many reasons.

So I ended up voting Labour for my local reasons and political leanings, the Labour MP got in locally. Also i got my wish nationally in that Winky departed along with many (although not enough) of his cronies.

I thought a Con / Lib coalition would actually be perfect for my current thinking, which is that something needed to be done, but the Libs would temper it and we would get the best of both worlds.

I am sadly mistaken and the Libs seem to be taking it up the Oxo on a regular basis and not having any affect on the harshness of the cuts (Dont get my wrong they are needed, but I think its too much too soon)

My key area of concern is education and I stumbled across this as a very specific (but seemingly representative) example of what is happening on the ground:

http://www.porchester.notts.sch.uk/files/newslette...

Mr Gove is making some terrible mistakes in my opinion.

So all in all I feel in a state of limbo with the whole situation really


EDIT: Link seems to be playing up.

Edited by KenBlocksPants on Friday 4th February 10:51

[thinfourth2]

What an admirable attitude.

Considering who to vote for instead of blindly picking a tie colour

[Mon Ami Mate]

KENZ said:

O'h come on winkey wasn't that bad a person. Granted he was a PR disaster at times..

Edited by KENZ on Wednesday 2nd February 10:21

Absolutely right, he wasn't that bad a person.

He was an utter .

[lockhart flawse]

I don't see how Gove can f*** up education any more than it's already f***** up already. Consider this (from the Economist on Jan 13th) - only 16% of school children managed to pass 5 GCSEs in proper subjects - we all know what these are. If you take out the 7% who are privately educated and you can assume that near enough all of them get those 5 GCSEs that figure falls to 9%. Take out the Grammar Schools (4% of all state schools) whose pupils also probably manage to get 5 proper GCSEs then you are looking at something like only about 5-6% of pupils entering the comprehensive system leaving with 5 decent GCSEs. It's almost beyond belief that we can educate children quite so badly and leave them increasingly ill-equipped to compete for jobs in a Global economy where the old un-skilled jobs have gone and which are mainly taken by immigrants anyway.

The sooner Gove gets cracking the better.

L.F.

[pugwash4x4]

lochart do you have a source- that's a disturbing number if true

[The real Apache]

DJC said:

Zod said:

The inside reports show that Brown was a sociopath; the thrown mobiles, the pens stabbed into the back of the seats of the Jaguars, the barging past staff, the shouting, swearing and then, finally, and most obviously, the Gillian Duffy incident.

His continued absurd belief that he led the world to salvation in 2008 is the extra evidence not needed for the diagnosis.

That isnt a sociopath for God sake. Ive thrown my mobile. Ive thrown and seen many objects thrown in offices. Its why we have little squishy squashy "stress relief" toys in offices now. Ive pounded seat backs, steering wheels, hell I once kicked my straw laundary basket to death. I barge past people, ignore some utterly, swear and generally treat people with complete and utter contempt half the time. I do it on here to most of ph. Ive done it to you more than a few times. The Gillian duffy incident just prooved he was a muppet, not anything more. It doesnt make me a sociopath, it just makes me another fked human with their own problems.

Brown was just a bloke in over his head for the job he had. The rest of the Labour party was weak and spineless for tolerating him.

Not a sociopath perhaps, just socially awkward to the extent it borders on autism?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnist...

[JagLover]

lockhart flawse said:

I don't see how Gove can f*** up education any more than it's already f***** up already. Consider this (from the Economist on Jan 13th) - only 16% of school children managed to pass 5 GCSEs in proper subjects - we all know what these are. If you take out the 7% who are privately educated and you can assume that near enough all of them get those 5 GCSEs that figure falls to 9%. Take out the Grammar Schools (4% of all state schools) whose pupils also probably manage to get 5 proper GCSEs then you are looking at something like only about 5-6% of pupils entering the comprehensive system leaving with 5 decent GCSEs. It's almost beyond belief that we can educate children quite so badly and leave them increasingly ill-equipped to compete for jobs in a Global economy where the old un-skilled jobs have gone and which are mainly taken by immigrants anyway.

The sooner Gove gets cracking the better.

L.F.

To be fair to the comprehensive system that depends on how you define five decent GCSEs (and many in the private sector didn't qualify beacsue they take international GCSEs)

But yes there needs to be massive changes and it was notably that as British pupils achieved ever higher grades under labour our standing in international league tables declined.