How do we think EU negotiations will go?

[AC43]

PurpleMoonlight said:

NDA said:

I wonder if David Davies might eventually say 'look, we can't possibly get the deal we want, it's going to take years and quite possibly result in a half in/half out position, we want back in. Sorry electorate, but what you want is impossible to deliver.'

Leaving is not impossible, it's very easy.

The deal we get will by default be the best possible deal and we will have to live with it.

Leaving is easy. So is destroying vast swathes of industry.

Brexiteers moan about foreigners taking "our" jobs.

This will fix it. There wont BE any jobs and therefore none of "them" coming to take them.

I've lived through three recessions wasn't looking forward to the fourth.

But the people have spoken, etc

[PurpleMoonlight]

Rich_W said:

How does castigating Mays (sensible) offer, despite the apparent openness by actual heads of state, HELP the 27?

Especially since if a EU citizen moves to NZ or America or Singapore or Manila or Thailand. The ECJ doesn't have jurisdiction over local laws? Irony being that citizens rights in Manila or Thailand are far worse than in the UK where apparently Eu citizens will require an extra layer of protection. I guess we operate kangaroo courts here

May thinks it's sensible, the EU doesn't agree.

Does that make them bullies?

[rs1952]

PurpleMoonlight said:

17,400,000 odd voted for Brexit. If we don't get Brexit many will protest, some violently.

Using exactly the same logical reasoning, over 16m people voted to stay in the EU.

So, if we don't kick the whole project into touch will many protest, some violently?

[PurpleMoonlight]

rs1952 said:

Using exactly the same logical reasoning, over 16m people voted to stay in the EU.

So, if we don't kick the whole project into touch will many protest, some violently?

Some already are, aren't they?

[Smollet]

turbobloke said:

PurpleMoonlight said:

turbobloke said:

Some of the media have seen it as it is.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/820644/Ther...

I can't take any article seriously if they call people bullies.

There will be people who can't take comments seriously which look the other way when EU bullies are at work.

EU leaders are generally OK with the UK offer, but the EU sent in the clowns (Juncker and Tusk).

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Smollet said:

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

Have any leaders actually said "Yes that's fine with me"?

[FiF]

Smollet said:

turbobloke said:

PurpleMoonlight said:

turbobloke said:

Some of the media have seen it as it is.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/820644/Ther...

I can't take any article seriously if they call people bullies.

There will be people who can't take comments seriously which look the other way when EU bullies are at work.

EU leaders are generally OK with the UK9 offer, but the EU sent in the clowns (Juncker and Tusk).

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

Anyone with any common sense knows this was a fair and reasonable offer, once again EU leaders show they are neither fair nor reasonable. It just hardens my resolve to leave, it still doesn't alter my position on how we should leave, that remains consistent with that proposed from well before EURef. Yes it's suboptimal, and requires compromises on issues that are important to others, however it's consistent with the case that the Leave Alliance were THE only group to set out in any detail what should be shape of our immediate future relationship with the EU.

[///ajd]

FiF said:

Anyone with any common sense knows this was a fair and reasonable offer, once again EU leaders show they are neither fair nor reasonable. It just hardens my resolve to leave, it still doesn't alter my position on how we should leave, that remains consistent with that proposed from well before EURef. Yes it's suboptimal, and requires compromises on issues that are important to others, however it's consistent with the case that the Leave Alliance were THE only group to set out in any detail what should be shape of our immediate future relationship with the EU.

Does that case involve compromises on freedom of movement & SM access T&C? Is it still on line?

Is it a reasonably soft brexit in other words?

Do you think that would lead to civil unrest that some here predict, and how would you feel about that?

[Smollet]

PurpleMoonlight said:

Smollet said:

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

Have any leaders actually said "Yes that's fine with me"?

Merkel has said it's a good start so I would say that probably is one in favour and thus I suspect fine with in general . Far more positive than what the EU leaders have said.

[alfie2244]

///ajd said:

Does that case involve compromises on freedom of movement & SM access T&C? Is it still on line?

Is it a reasonably soft brexit in other words?

Do you think that would lead to civil unrest that some here predict, and how would you feel about that?

You can't be right in the head fella... you post about civil unrest most of yesterday (last at about 10pm).... I've just logged in to find you posted again @ 5am, 6,7,10 & 11am. Do you honestly think your continued banging of the same drum makes people take note of what you say?

Why not take a break............F1 qualifying starts soon.

[hornetrider]

Smollet said:

PurpleMoonlight said:

Smollet said:

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

Have any leaders actually said "Yes that's fine with me"?

Merkel has said it's a good start so I would say that probably is one in favour and thus I suspect fine with in general . Far more positive than what the EU leaders have said.

Polish and Lithuanian positive also, saying we should decide how much jurisdiction we give the ECJ.

[amgmcqueen]

I think negotiations are going to be extremely long, difficult and tedious, both sides are going to fall out very quickly. Juncker likes being awkward for the sake of being awkward. Everything the UK proposes he will criticise, disagree and make negotiations miserable, he should be locked away in his wine cellar until this is over.

I can see it being a 'soft brexit' heavily watered down from what many people expect. I am though looking forward to when this is all over, its no longer in the media every 5minutes and the UK can start getting its head down again and trying to grow the economy and trade with the rest of the World.

[Robertj21a]

///ajd said:

Does that case involve compromises on freedom of movement & SM access T&C? Is it still on line?

Is it a reasonably soft brexit in other words?

Do you think that would lead to civil unrest that some here predict, and how would you feel about that?

How much evidence is there of all this 'Civil unrest' you, and others, carry on about ? - to me, you come over as someone trying to stoke up a fire of hate just to prove a point.

[Tryke3]

Smollet said:

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

What do you think it would be UKs position if another country wanted to leave the EU ?

[turbobloke]

Tryke3 said:

Smollet said:

Now if I've read this correctly so far some elected leaders of European countries are in favour of May's offer yet unelected leaders of the EU are not. Speaks volumes to me and having voted to remain I would now vote to leave if this is how the EU wishes to operate.

What do you think it would be UKs position if another country wanted to leave the EU ?

We'd be ignored as usual.

[jonnyb]

Robertj21a said:

///ajd said:

Does that case involve compromises on freedom of movement & SM access T&C? Is it still on line?

Is it a reasonably soft brexit in other words?

Do you think that would lead to civil unrest that some here predict, and how would you feel about that?

How much evidence is there of all this 'Civil unrest' you, and others, carry on about ? - to me, you come over as someone trying to stoke up a fire of hate just to prove a point.

I think that's his point.

[Tryke3]

turbobloke said:

We'd be ignored as usual.

You know very well that is not true

[///ajd]

Robertj21a said:

///ajd said:

Does that case involve compromises on freedom of movement & SM access T&C? Is it still on line?

Is it a reasonably soft brexit in other words?

Do you think that would lead to civil unrest that some here predict, and how would you feel about that?

How much evidence is there of all this 'Civil unrest' you, and others, carry on about ? - to me, you come over as someone trying to stoke up a fire of hate just to prove a point.

It is not me talking about civil unrest.

I don't think there will be any to speak of, other than from a few shouty EDL/rabid kipper types.

It is some brexiteers here who are threatening civil unrest should their hallowed immigration control not come to pass.

When challenged on whether they personally will be rising up, they get shy and throw back insults. Bit like the school bully.

Its seems there won't be civil unrest and we can Breverse without fear of serious repercussions, which is good.

[s2art]

///ajd said:

Its seems there won't be civil unrest and we can Breverse without fear of serious repercussions, which is good.

Serious repercussion to whom? A lot of MPs would fear for their seats, Breverse would have serious repercussions for those and their associated party.

[b2hbm]

///ajd said:

b2hbm said:

Having read seen TM's offer of residency to EU nationals living in the UK and the response from the EU, how do you think that's going then ? From what I've read (Reuters) the EU appears to want EU nationals living in the UK after we've left to be subject to the EU rather than UK courts. Now that's an interesting one, go live in another country but ignore any rulings they make.
As a champion of the EU cause, what's the comment on that one ///ajd ?

There are always two sides

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com...

What about the rights of brits abroad?

She is trying to look tough for the kipper minded, but looks insular and mean.
Many here said 'they didn't want EU migrants kicked out' - oh no that is just for EDL / extreme kippers. And yet here we now have May leaving more questions than answers about what living in the UK will be like.
This is all hugely damaging to those we do want to come and work here - we need immigration and brexit is making us look a very unwelcoming, bitter place.
This is not what makes Britain Great. She is destroying us.
Contrast with Team GB 2012 Olympics positive feeling.
This is a national embarrassment

Ok, I've got that, read yet another link you've posted which doesn't answer the question I posted. Neither does your comments about UKIP or how you perceive TM to be acting. And the reference to the 2012 Olympics has me completely baffled, I thought this topic was on the EU negotiations ?

So, in simple terms. The EU appear to want any European citizen who is settled in the UK to be governed by the action of European courts and such decisions to override any UK court ruling. This is to continue after the UK has left the EU. I'm unclear whether they mean that the EU rights will be frozen as those in place when we leave or if they will be updated as and when the EU adds other goodies to the bag, but let's leave that for now.

A simple "yes, I agree with the EU, the ECJ should overrule UK courts for EU nationals even after the UK is no longer a member of the EU" or "No, I think they're pushing their luck" answer will suffice.....