Owen Jones

[biggbn]

ClaphamGT3 said:

I find Owen Jones intensely irritating. I disagree with almost everything that he says and stands for and I particularly despise his dog-bark blaming of the ‘far right’ - ie everyone less ideologically wedded to Maxism than him - for absolutely every ill in society whilst defending the left and, particularly, Momentum, however patently absurd it makes him look.

He absolutely does not deserve to be assaulted - nobody does - and I hope that the full force of the law is brought to bear on those who did so, irrespective of their motivations.

At the risk of once again raising the dander of the PH elite, well said.

[biggbn]

jakesmith said:

ClaphamGT3 said:

I find Owen Jones intensely irritating. I disagree with almost everything that he says and stands for and I particularly despise his dog-bark blaming of the ‘far right’ - ie everyone less ideologically wedded to Maxism than him - for absolutely every ill in society whilst defending the left and, particularly, Momentum, however patently absurd it makes him look.

He absolutely does not deserve to be assaulted - nobody does - and I hope that the full force of the law is brought to bear on those who did so, irrespective of their motivations.

What if he started it then
What’s the full force of the law that most would expect for lightly grazing someone in a scuffle at 3am outside the pub
Told to go home? That’s not the victim btw but probably rings true.

If he started it he should also feel the full weight of the law. It's not too hard to figure out, is it? Given he must know it is on CCTV and it sounds like there were witnesses, I would hazard a guess that he would not be stupid enough to make a complaint had he initiated the conflict...however, one should never underestimate man's potential for stupidity should one!?

[biggbn]

jakesmith said:

If only you’d been around in the 1930’s BigBen you could have sat Hitler down, called him brother man, given him your life story about walking away from a downward spiral of violence, and told him that his plans for a third reich of 1000 years were just plain wrong. All that kerfuffle with the planes and USA and the global conflict, really the allies lost the argument as soon as Churchill declared that we were at war. If only none of that had happened, Owen Jones, the hard left tosser that he is, would be free as a bird to walk around publishing his antisocial divisive drivel with complete freedom ....

Serious question Jake, how do you feel about freedom of thought, speech and expression?

Edit, in re your quote a downward spiral of violence, that was never my problem. I was, sadly, quite good at it, and worryingly, I enjoyed it. That's when you really realise you have a problem.


Off to put some flowers in gun barrels now, peace, gbn X

Edited by biggbn on Sunday 18th August 04:02

[JagLover]

768 said:

Evanivitch said:

I'd put a tenner on it being some angry Joe Swinson supporters.

Certainly fits an Owen Jones description of the far right.

Deserves a

and from what I have seen Owen Jones is a tw*t, was likely acting like a tw*t while on a night out and that would be the most likely cause of his "horrendous" injury of some light grazing.

[Fast and Spurious]

ClaphamGT3 said:

I find Owen Jones intensely irritating. I disagree with almost everything that he says and stands for and I particularly despise his dog-bark blaming of the ‘far right’ - ie everyone less ideologically wedded to Maxism than him - for absolutely every ill in society whilst defending the left and, particularly, Momentum, however patently absurd it makes him look.

He absolutely does not deserve to be assaulted - nobody does - and I hope that the full force of the law is brought to bear on those who did so, irrespective of their motivations.

+1

[bitchstewie]

Some depressingly predictable replies.

Whatever your view of his politics he doesn't deserve to be beaten up for them.

I would add I'd like to see a little more evidence that it was politically motivated rather than some random attack, but it wouldn't surprise me.

He's posted this kind of thing before which highlights there are some very strange/scary/serious/weird people out there simply because the disagree with you.

[TorqueVR]

My son for beaten up and hospitalised in similar circumstances a few years ago. All the time I thought he was a soldier but it turns out he was a leftie journalist

[jakesmith]

biggbn said:

Serious question Jake, how do you feel about freedom of thought, speech and expression?

Edit, in re your quote a downward spiral of violence, that was never my problem. I was, sadly, quite good at it, and worryingly, I enjoyed it. That's when you really realise you have a problem.


Off to put some flowers in gun barrels now, peace, gbn X

Edited by biggbn on Sunday 18th August 04:02

Morning GdnBn and thanks as always for your upbeat style and interesting line of questioning

Total Freedom of speech and expression are not concepts that exist in UK law neither should they. They are limited already and I support that stance vs say USA where you can racially abuse someone in the street with your freedom of speech.

I don’t believe in the dissemination of the extreme of politics that serves no purpose than to agitate some form of overthrow of the long standing and democratically derived political structure, whether the intentions behind it are honest or not.

I don’t credit the overall population with being particularly critically / forward thinking politically and think they need protection from appealing populism on either side of the political spectrum, whether it be those telling them that immigrants and the Eu are causing their life to be worse, that religions are taking over their town, or that there is a wealthy elite not paying taxes holding them down.

The democracy we have in the UK may not be perfect and it may lead to a general 2 party effect but we are one of the longest existing and most stable countries in the world as a result of this and I’m not supporting of those who rubbish it or try and subvert it. I am not saying this in relation to Owen Jones being pushed outside a pub.

I don’t see the benefit of any of this outweighing the harm, especially when they are often messages propagated by privately owned highly irresponsible businesses, or by scruffy haired politicians who appear all nice, aiming to take power or make money out of the impact of the consequences of these misleading reports.

Not a popular view I’m sure and not an easy one to put into practice of course but my thoughts never the less.

I don’t want the state to be disappearing these people too badly like in 1984 but neither do I want Animal Farm- Maybe in my ideal world, people trying to subvert the political order or undermine the state, like Owen Jones, Corbyn, Farage etc. would be forced to live somewhere like the Welsh Valleys, it’s beautiful countryside with loads of birds but no one would listen to them politically any more especially locally where they’d just be the English Prick.

Edited by jakesmith on Sunday 18th August 08:01

[98elise]

Tryke3 said:

OO Beckton said:

Owen Jones stands with, and for, everyone and everything that is divisive in the Media. He is ideological companions of race-hustlers and professional victims like: Faiza Shaheen, David Lammy, Jonathan Liew, Dawn Butler, Reni Eddo-Lodge, Munroe Bergdorf, Kehinde Andrews, Marina Hyde, Sairo Rao... Every Marxist, antiwhite, feminist and misandrist on Twitter doing politics and activism... Owen is the lynch pin of the Left's most poisonous and spiteful journalism.

...Despite this, it's wrong that he's been physically attacked.

Soon as you use violence against your opponent, you've lost the argument and higher ground.

So you just hate blacks, gays and women that want to be heard ? Well done

Where has he said or implied hatred? You have lazily just assumed it must be hatred because it doesn't fit with your political beliefs.

Well done indeed.

[bitchstewie]

jakesmith said:

Maybe in my ideal world, people trying to subvert the political order or undermine the state, like Owen Jones, Corbyn, Farage etc. would be forced to live somewhere like the Welsh Valleys

Who decides?

I don't like Corybn and my views on Farage are pretty clear and I'd be quite happy if he chose to ask Aaron Banks for money to pay for a plane ticket so he could go to the US tomorrow.

But forced relocation, seriously?

[jakesmith]

bhstewie said:

Who decides?

I don't like Corybn and my views on Farage are pretty clear and I'd be quite happy if he chose to ask Aaron Banks for money to pay for a plane ticket so he could go to the US tomorrow.

But forced relocation, seriously?

You’d be the first to be relocated if Owen Jones got his political way. Why not. fk ‘em. Wales is alright anyway

[98elise]

bhstewie said:

Some depressingly predictable replies.

Whatever your view of his politics he doesn't deserve to be beaten up for them.

I would add I'd like to see a little more evidence that it was politically motivated rather than some random attack, but it wouldn't surprise me.

He's posted this kind of thing before which highlights there are some very strange/scary/serious/weird people out there simply because the disagree with you.

Owen is a part of that world. His far left views include killing, political "corrective facilities", removal of threats to a workers state.

Quoting him...


"In a workers' state, of course, Fascism would not have such soft treatment. Fascist propaganda would be banned. Fascists would have no participation in any elections. Fascist acts would be punished with death. Those people with illusions in Fascism would be sent to corrective facilities until they repent their beliefs. I think it would be sensible to deport all Fascist leaders to an offshore island prison somewhere, to prevent any becoming martyrs and to remove them as a threat to the workers' state. As Trotsky once said, if one cannot make a fascist repent its beliefs through reasonable argument, one should feel free to acquaint its head with the pavement."


https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/marxist-lenini...

Owen, McDonnell and Corbyn all support violence towards political opponents.

Owen has also supported the IRA in the past, but he does claim to have changed his mind.

[ClaphamGT3]

Those suggesting that Owen Jones somehow deserved this because he is "a tt" and seeking to trivialise the attack because it was "a graze/a bump on the head" need to give their heads a wobble.

Someone was assaulted. The fact that you don't like him &/or disagree with his politics in no way makes that alright

[Evanivitch]

jakesmith said:

I don’t credit the overall population with being particularly critically / forward thinking politically and think they need protection from appealing populism on either side of the political spectrum, whether it be those telling them that immigrants and the Eu are causing their life to be worse, that religions are taking over their town, or that there is a wealthy elite not paying taxes holding them down.

...


I don’t want the state to be disappearing these people too badly like in 1984 but neither do I want Animal Farm- Maybe in my ideal world, people trying to subvert the political order or undermine the state, like Owen Jones, Corbyn, Farage etc. would be forced to live somewhere like the Welsh Valleys, it’s beautiful countryside with loads of birds but no one would listen to them politically any more especially locally where they’d just be the English Prick.

Edited by jakesmith on Sunday 18th August 08:01

Just quoting your opening and closing paragraph.

Your idea that democracy is only for the intellectuals, that the common person needs protecting from any alternative views, and that political opponents should be banished to the supposedly apolitical Valleys shows both your ignorance and desire for a Tory Dictatorship. Does it get any less democratic?

[greygoose]

ClaphamGT3 said:

Those suggesting that Owen Jones somehow deserved this because he is "a tt" and seeking to trivialise the attack because it was "a graze/a bump on the head" need to give their heads a wobble.

Someone was assaulted. The fact that you don't like him &/or disagree with his politics in no way makes that alright

Well said.

[jakesmith]

ClaphamGT3 said:

Those suggesting that Owen Jones somehow deserved this because he is "a tt" and seeking to trivialise the attack because it was "a graze/a bump on the head" need to give their heads a wobble.

Someone was assaulted. The fact that you don't like him &/or disagree with his politics in no way makes that alright

Is there anyone in the public eye deserving of a grazed belly? Anyone at all?

[jakesmith]

Evanivitch said:

jakesmith said:

I don’t credit the overall population with being particularly critically / forward thinking politically and think they need protection from appealing populism on either side of the political spectrum, whether it be those telling them that immigrants and the Eu are causing their life to be worse, that religions are taking over their town, or that there is a wealthy elite not paying taxes holding them down.

...


I don’t want the state to be disappearing these people too badly like in 1984 but neither do I want Animal Farm- Maybe in my ideal world, people trying to subvert the political order or undermine the state, like Owen Jones, Corbyn, Farage etc. would be forced to live somewhere like the Welsh Valleys, it’s beautiful countryside with loads of birds but no one would listen to them politically any more especially locally where they’d just be the English Prick.

Edited by jakesmith on Sunday 18th August 08:01

Just quoting your opening and closing paragraph.

Your idea that democracy is only for the intellectuals, that the common person needs protecting from any alternative views, and that political opponents should be banished to the supposedly apolitical Valleys shows both your ignorance and desire for a Tory Dictatorship. Does it get any less democratic?

I made it very clear that I find both ends of the political spectrum abhorrent so don’t misrepresent what I said

History would have done well to have stopped the murderous ideologies of Fascism and Communism before they killed 10’s or even 100’s of millions of people

It’s hardly as though we’ve learned any lessons from them given the current state of global politics.

[banjowilly]

This is pretty simple stuff. If you're gloating over someone whose politics you dislike getting a kicking, then there's something wrong with you.

You don't have to extend the logic very far to see where it leads, yet some of you are unable to do even that.

[psi310398]

ClaphamGT3 said:

Those suggesting that Owen Jones somehow deserved this because he is "a tt" and seeking to trivialise the attack because it was "a graze/a bump on the head" need to give their heads a wobble.

Someone was assaulted. The fact that you don't like him &/or disagree with his politics in no way makes that alright

Nobody has said it is ok but it is worth keeping a sense of proportion- this kind of thing happens every weekend in almost every high street in the country with nary a comment, less still a woke Twitter storm.

The only difference appears to be that in OJ’s febrile mind he was personally seen to by Ernst Rohm when it seems much more plausible that , charmless ahole that he is, he simply wound someone up. Someone who will doubtless rightly end up in the Highbury Mags in due course.

[bitchstewie]

98elise said:

Owen is a part of that world. His far left views include killing, political "corrective facilities", removal of threats to a workers state.

Quoting him...


"In a workers' state, of course, Fascism would not have such soft treatment. Fascist propaganda would be banned. Fascists would have no participation in any elections. Fascist acts would be punished with death. Those people with illusions in Fascism would be sent to corrective facilities until they repent their beliefs. I think it would be sensible to deport all Fascist leaders to an offshore island prison somewhere, to prevent any becoming martyrs and to remove them as a threat to the workers' state. As Trotsky once said, if one cannot make a fascist repent its beliefs through reasonable argument, one should feel free to acquaint its head with the pavement."


https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/marxist-lenini...

Owen, McDonnell and Corbyn all support violence towards political opponents.

Owen has also supported the IRA in the past, but he does claim to have changed his mind.

You've linked to something on a Yahoo list posted in 2000 and Owen Jones is 35 years old.

The same account posted as early as April 1999 which I think would have made him 14 at the time.

Are are you sure it's the same Owen Jones?