Honour killings

[smegmore]

Apache said:

I disagree, it is important to highlight the fact that backward savages live among us and their vile behaviour needs to be stopped

Exactly.

These creatures (I refuse to associate them with people) have no regard for human life due to their sky daddy telling them that paradise beckons for the faithful and then all will be hunky-dory for eternity, a tent which stretches from Damascus to Yemen or somesuch nonsense, endless supplies of virgins et al, ad nauseum.

Stone age savages.

[MadMullah]

Pickled Piper said:

You are illustrating my point exactly. Why do you see it as the Governments responsibility to prevent forced marriages? It is largely a Pakistani community problem why lay the blame elsewhere? Also, if the Government takes too strong a stance they are accused of picking on the Pakistani community and spreading Islamaphobia. The Mulsim vote is strong in many areas - just ask George Galloway.

You've mentioned yourself that you have seen the Sikh community sort out it's own problems. The Sikh community is the better for it and as a result well regarded for it by others. Don't you see that the Pakistani community should start looking inwards and sort it's own problems rather than blaming their issues on Islamaphobia?

Sorry, not having a pop at you personally, you just happen to be the one posting.

pp

I'm not blaming the govt - what i'm saying is the govt can minimise this problem. there's a drinking issue in the uk and the govt is addressing that - or should that not be the govt's responsibility either? if there's a known issue within a demographic of uk citizens does not the fact the govt is a ruling party have some say on these issues? what would you have do? the,

and so what if its seen as opposing the pak community - they just have to show the figures that highlight the large percentage of issues coming in from there.

there will be area's whcih no matter what - you will lose to galloway. he'll do fk all for the locals but you would always lose against galloway in a muslim area.

the muslim community should look inwards but wont. they should've looked inwards when 7/7 happened. that was the moment muslim councils around the uk should've united and looked at themselves. but they didnt. this is small fry compared to that. so when the populace doesnt give do anything then other people have to step in on thier behalf. eg the govt.

[Pickled Piper]

MadMullah said:

the muslim community should look inwards but wont. they should've looked inwards when 7/7 happened. that was the moment muslim councils around the uk should've united and looked at themselves. but they didnt. this is small fry compared to that. so when the populace doesnt give do anything then other people have to step in on thier behalf. eg the govt.

We agree. The Pakistani community should look inwards but it doesn't- Instead blames outside factors, Islamaphobia, racism etc. This is what separates it from other south Asian groups.

We live in very politically correct times. The government is reluctant to publish data too overtly. Try googling Educational attainment by ethnic group /religion, prison population, earnings home ownership. The Pakistani community (and Bangladeshi) communities are close to the top in all of them except the earnings and home ownership.

The authorities do take action. i know in my LEA vulnerable children go on a "watch list" - All the Muslim girls (most of which are Pakistani) are on the list. The school teachers keep an eye on the teenage Muslim girls to make sure they don't disappear overnight. You will note that in most of the honour killing / forced marriage cases it has been the school that has raised the alarm.

In terms of taking more direct action what do you think the Government can do? The slightest criticism and the Muslim brotherhood are up in arms claiming victimization and Islamaphobia. The Pakistani community also block votes- say the wrong thing and stray from appeasing the community and you will not get voted back in.

pp

[MadMullah]

Pickled Piper said:

In terms of taking more direct action what do you think the Government can do? The slightest criticism and the Muslim brotherhood are up in arms claiming victimization and Islamaphobia. The Pakistani community also block votes- say the wrong thing and stray from appeasing the community and you will not get voted back in.

pp

First thing is to make it as difficult as possible to send the girls back home and get married. put it across the board where if brits do get married abroad they have spent soem time living with them.

there's far too many guys in Pakistan just waiting for the "valaiti" girl to come so they get their red book - the brit passport. then its kerching. these guys have this on thier minds for so long they seriously dont have any ambition to learn/educate themselves as they'll come to the uk and money will fall from the trees for them. alot of the times the guys are the uncle's son who the girls father feels he has a duty to bring over to help his brothers family too kinda thing.

make sure the guys who are married to a uk girl have a job back home - an educated career. not the village hangout. references from people who can verify this.

give the power to the woman to anonymously send the guy home. the uk govt should be able to say sorry we're withdrawing ur right to stay here. under confidence be able to say to the judges that the wife has requested his deportation due to xyz reason. that'll keep the guys who do get to the uk sharp and committed. the whole get a criminal record and ur off should apply too. no EU right to a family life dependant on the seriousness of the crime.

there's should be several interviews with the girl regarding the circumstances of the marriage etc. it should be upto the married couple to prove this is a marriage done for life not for a red passport.

finally a bit extreme but there should be reliable witnesses or people who can verify that this marriage was done without any grey shades. people who would be willing to put their own reputations on line.

most of this probably will never happen. but if you want to clamp down on this - there's your blue print.

[smegmore]

MadMullah said:

First thing is to make it as difficult as possible to send the girls back home and get married. put it across the board where if brits do get married abroad they have spent soem time living with them.

there's far too many guys in Pakistan just waiting for the "valaiti" girl to come so they get their red book - the brit passport. then its kerching. these guys have this on thier minds for so long they seriously dont have any ambition to learn/educate themselves as they'll come to the uk and money will fall from the trees for them. alot of the times the guys are the uncle's son who the girls father feels he has a duty to bring over to help his brothers family too kinda thing.

make sure the guys who are married to a uk girl have a job back home - an educated career. not the village hangout. references from people who can verify this.

give the power to the woman to anonymously send the guy home. the uk govt should be able to say sorry we're withdrawing ur right to stay here. under confidence be able to say to the judges that the wife has requested his deportation due to xyz reason. that'll keep the guys who do get to the uk sharp and committed. the whole get a criminal record and ur off should apply too. no EU right to a family life dependant on the seriousness of the crime.

there's should be several interviews with the girl regarding the circumstances of the marriage etc. it should be upto the married couple to prove this is a marriage done for life not for a red passport.

finally a bit extreme but there should be reliable witnesses or people who can verify that this marriage was done without any grey shades. people who would be willing to put their own reputations on line.

most of this probably will never happen. but if you want to clamp down on this - there's your blue print.

All very noble but far too late for all this.

Stable door, horse, etc.

They're here, ensconced in the bosom of the UK scial security system and Uncle Mo's kebab shop.

What a crock of ste this country is.

[MadMullah]

smegmore said:

All very noble but far too late for all this.

Stable door, horse, etc.

They're here, ensconced in the bosom of the UK scial security system and Uncle Mo's kebab shop.

What a crock of ste this country is.

oh believe me - you've had a few horses bolt

the herd is still stomping the ground getting ready... this is nothing.

[Raja]

Pickled Piper said:

Raja said:

As for why the Indians or the Sikhs don't do it - my experience is that they do, although it is decreasing. Why its decreasing? - as has been said absolutely to do with awareness raising and women's empowerment projects. I also suspect that there has been a shift in these communities from going back to the 'homeland' to marry their children to their village cousins. I know that this remains if not the norm then at least a common occurrence for UK's Pakistani and indeed Muslim communities.

Wrong - Sikh teachings forbid marriage between close relatives and always have done. Even in the most rural villages, it has always been standard practice and custom for the families of a prospective Sikh couple to carry out genealogy checks going back four or five generations - to make sure there is no potential for marrying a relative. The idea of marrying a cousin is abhorrent to most Sikhs.

Statistics in the Birmingham area show that it is the norm amongst the Pakistani community. It's just that as the wider community start frowning and expressing their distaste at the practice, the Pakistani community just go about it more secretively.

pp

So honour killings in Sikh communities were based upon daughters not marrying who their parents had not picked for them and/or disapproved of, women wanting divorces, bringing shame etc?

It does happen though doesn't it? If i was to draw a link it wouldn't be based upon one single ethnicity or faith but rather on a South Asian cultural feature.

Edited by Raja on Wednesday 23 May 23:27

[vsonix]

singlecoil said:

Pints said:

singlecoil said:

He might be referring to Abraham and Isaac.

That'd be Jewish and I don't really consider that a Western religion.
Just because we've let Israel into the Eurovision contest, doesn't mean they're Western.

I was just guessing about what he might be referring to. Much of the Old Testamment has a bearing on Christianity, and most people would think of that as a Western religion.

Indeed, I was referring to that, and 'Western' Christianity is certainly of a different flavour to the Orthodox, 'Eastern' flavour, it still looks to the old testament as much as the post-Jesus stuff.

[mybrainhurts]

Then there are these nut cases, still killing witches in their own families...

http://somalipeacemaker.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/wit...

[smegmore]

And scum like all of the above are here and here to stay.

FFS.

[odyssey2200]

Can you hear that high pitched humming noise?

That's Enoch, spinning in his grave.

[Meridius]

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

[Mermaid]

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Don't go there unless you are a Pakistani Muslim

[MadMullah]

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Pm me the adress. I'll have that problem resolved for you by the time the next flight to Islamabad takes off.

[mybrainhurts]

Mermaid said:

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Don't go there unless you are a Pakistani Muslim

My wife left me for a Pakistani lad half her age, whose father had arranged a marriage for him. At the time, life was interesting, to put it mildly...

I was advised it would be in order for me to kill her...

[caraddict]

mybrainhurts said:

Mermaid said:

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Don't go there unless you are a Pakistani Muslim

My wife left me for a Pakistani lad half her age, whose father had arranged a marriage for him. At the time, life was interesting, to put it mildly...

I was advised it would be in order for me to kill her...

I get why your brain hurts...


Thanks OP for putting some light on the subject, and thank you for the repliers for a relatively civil tone...!

[Jimbeaux]

caraddict said:

mybrainhurts said:

Mermaid said:

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Don't go there unless you are a Pakistani Muslim

My wife left me for a Pakistani lad half her age, whose father had arranged a marriage for him. At the time, life was interesting, to put it mildly...

I was advised it would be in order for me to kill her...

I get why your brain hurts...


Thanks OP for putting some light on the subject, and thank you for the repliers for a relatively civil tone...!

Here on PH, a civil tone is all we do.

[Deva Link]

Mermaid said:

Meridius said:

I have some Pakistani neighbours up the road from me. Their daughter is well fit.

Don't go there unless you are a Pakistani Muslim

..or you want her parents and brothers to kill her.

[caraddict]

That's great. I really like it here. You guys are so much more civilized than the American boards...

[mybrainhurts]

caraddict said:

That's great. I really like it here. You guys are so much more civilized than the American boards...

We haven't started yet...