45th President of the United States, Donald Trump. (Vol 4)

[TheFlyingBanana]

hairykrishna said:

Nobody really knows what the law is on issuing a subpoena to a sitting president so they're attempting to avoid the inevitable massive st storm if they do.

Gameface said:

Perhaps I'm being naive but why should it cause a ststorm?

Becoming president doesn't make you a deity. Above all mortal laws (despite what Trump believes...).

My take on the US Presidential system and office is that it sort of does. It seems quite confused on this point - I cite the apparent ability for Presidents to issue pardons, personally, regardless of the offence.

Gameface said:

One good thing that may come from his time in office is that presidents may become more accountable and not have such sweeping powers in future.

I truly hope this is the case - the entire Trump presidency is an abuse of power and a failing of the consitution. The sooner he is an embarrassing footnote in history the better.

[frankenstein12]

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

[Gameface]

The pardons annoy me. It's just such an obvious abuse of power and process.

Last week Trump basically told Cohen, be quiet and I will get you off.

WTF!

Can't believe Cohen would actually trust Trump on that.

[frankenstein12]

rscott said:

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Would you prefer Rudd got away with lying in the House instead? That seems to be main reason the memo and her letter were leaked - to prove she had either deliberately made an untrue statement to the house or had such a bad memory she shouldn't be in that job (by forgetting that she wrote a letter discussing the targets she later claimed she knew nothing about).

It's strange how you're so troubled by these leaks yet don't seem to show the same concerns about the leaks of the hacked emails or even of the text messages between FBI officers.

People should be held accountable but we are I think on a dangerous path when government staff feel safe handing confidential government information to mop.

It's becoming more and more prevalent.

[RobDickinson]

Gameface said:

Last week Trump basically told Cohen, be quiet and I will get you off.

Trump needs to be really careful with pardons I expect, and it only pardons federal crimes afik not state.

[ScotHill]

minimoog said:

So Giuliani has leaked Mueller's proposed interview questions for Trump to the NYT who have dutifully published them. Interesting move...

Maybe Putin could leak Trump's answers to save actually carrying out the interview.

[Gameface]

RobDickinson said:

Gameface said:

Last week Trump basically told Cohen, be quiet and I will get you off.

Trump needs to be really careful with pardons I expect, and it only pardons federal crimes afik not state.

Does he though? Surely if that were the case he'd have more circumspect with his "coded message" to Cohen.

It could've been passed on via private channels but Trump basically told the whole world what he was planning!

Either he believes he can do whatever he wants or doesn't care either way.

[RobDickinson]

Gameface said:

Does he though?

Yes, once pardoned you loose any rights to the 5th

[minimoog]

frankenstein12 said:

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

OK off you go then. Let us know the answer in the Rudd thread.

[Escapegoat]

RobDickinson said:

Trump has lost a number of legal battles most recently over Trump University.

He uses the legal system to bully anyone he thinks he can get away with.

Yes, but according to someone here, that just makes him "smart".

[andy_s]

Escapegoat said:

RobDickinson said:

Trump has lost a number of legal battles most recently over Trump University.

He uses the legal system to bully anyone he thinks he can get away with.

Yes, but according to someone here, that just makes him "smart".

He's smart in the sense of having a certain native cunning and being classically Machiavellian in his manipulations, but I wouldn't have him design a rocket.

[esxste]

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Russian bot exposed.

Clearly never seen "Yes, Minister".

[IJB1959]

rscott said:

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Would you prefer Rudd got away with lying in the House instead? That seems to be main reason the memo and her letter were leaked - to prove she had either deliberately made an untrue statement to the house or had such a bad memory she shouldn't be in that job (by forgetting that she wrote a letter discussing the targets she later claimed she knew nothing about).

It's strange how you're so troubled by these leaks yet don't seem to show the same concerns about the leaks of the hacked emails or even of the text messages between FBI officers.

I think leaks are OK as the government should be completely transparent (and be held accountable) in its day to day business with the exception of any national security issue/s of course.

[IJB1959]

andy_s said:

Escapegoat said:

RobDickinson said:

Trump has lost a number of legal battles most recently over Trump University.

He uses the legal system to bully anyone he thinks he can get away with.

Yes, but according to someone here, that just makes him "smart".

He's smart in the sense of having a certain native cunning and being classically Machiavellian in his manipulations, but I wouldn't have him design a rocket.

Bullies are not smart, they are generally the Neanderthal type.

[Halmyre]

IJB1959 said:

rscott said:

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Would you prefer Rudd got away with lying in the House instead? That seems to be main reason the memo and her letter were leaked - to prove she had either deliberately made an untrue statement to the house or had such a bad memory she shouldn't be in that job (by forgetting that she wrote a letter discussing the targets she later claimed she knew nothing about).

It's strange how you're so troubled by these leaks yet don't seem to show the same concerns about the leaks of the hacked emails or even of the text messages between FBI officers.

I think leaks are OK as the government should be completely transparent (and be held accountable) in its day to day business with the exception of any national security issue/s of course.

I agree with this. Trouble is, governemnts like to tag issues as 'not in the public interest', which of course is the exact opposite of what it says!

[frankenstein12]

Halmyre said:

IJB1959 said:

rscott said:

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Would you prefer Rudd got away with lying in the House instead? That seems to be main reason the memo and her letter were leaked - to prove she had either deliberately made an untrue statement to the house or had such a bad memory she shouldn't be in that job (by forgetting that she wrote a letter discussing the targets she later claimed she knew nothing about).

It's strange how you're so troubled by these leaks yet don't seem to show the same concerns about the leaks of the hacked emails or even of the text messages between FBI officers.

I think leaks are OK as the government should be completely transparent (and be held accountable) in its day to day business with the exception of any national security issue/s of course.

I agree with this. Trouble is, governemnts like to tag issues as 'not in the public interest', which of course is the exact opposite of what it says!

Of course they do and so on one hand I agree with whistleblowing the concern for me is its becoming almost normal which is dangerous as it's not for individuals within government to assess whether leaking something won't have serious implications.

[IJB1959]

frankenstein12 said:

Halmyre said:

IJB1959 said:

rscott said:

frankenstein12 said:

I am finding all these leaks to the press quite troubling. Both US and UK with this Amber Rudd saga.

It is an offence to make this information available to the public/media yet to me it seems to be becoming more and more common.

In the Rudd case I believe the leak may be a criminal offence but I would need to double check.

Do we really want a situation where people feel it's acceptable to leak confidential government information any time they have their own personal agenda?

Would you prefer Rudd got away with lying in the House instead? That seems to be main reason the memo and her letter were leaked - to prove she had either deliberately made an untrue statement to the house or had such a bad memory she shouldn't be in that job (by forgetting that she wrote a letter discussing the targets she later claimed she knew nothing about).

It's strange how you're so troubled by these leaks yet don't seem to show the same concerns about the leaks of the hacked emails or even of the text messages between FBI officers.

I think leaks are OK as the government should be completely transparent (and be held accountable) in its day to day business with the exception of any national security issue/s of course.

I agree with this. Trouble is, governemnts like to tag issues as 'not in the public interest', which of course is the exact opposite of what it says!

Of course they do and so on one hand I agree with whistleblowing the concern for me is its becoming almost normal which is dangerous as it's not for individuals within government to assess whether leaking something won't have serious implications.

If government business was conducted properly & legally then there are no serious implications to worry about. If not, then we need to, and have the right to know as the electorate.

[Shakermaker]

frankenstein12 said:

Actually you will find I have never claimed not to be racist.

What I have said is my belief of what constitutes racism /sexism/homophobia etc differs from everyone else which is no surprise given we all see things in our own way and I am exceedingly bored of people claiming race/sex at the drop of a hat simply to virtue signal or because they either haven't really thought about things or lack emotional maturity.

So what are your definitions of racism, sexism, and homophobia?

[Halmyre]

frankenstein12 said:

Of course they do and so on one hand I agree with whistleblowing the concern for me is its becoming almost normal which is dangerous as it's not for individuals within government to assess whether leaking something won't have serious implications.

Governments are quite fond of telling the public"nothing to hide, nothing to fear" so hell mend them when it's thrown back at them.

[Byker28i]

and we're off... Donnies woken upset


Donald J. Trump
‏It would seem very hard to obstruct justice for a crime that never happened! Witch Hunt!



Seth Abramson Retweeted Donald J. Trump
If you did nothing wrong, why, per NBC, are you telling friends you're in trouble if Manafort flips on you? Why would you ever be in trouble, and how would it be possible for someone to "flip" on you, if you did nothing wrong? And why are you dangling pardons in front of people?