UKIP - The Future - Volume 4
Discussion
Strawman said:
If Farage refuses to engage with the organisers why should his supporters be welcomed to take part in their parade?
Personally I would have liked Farage to have answered the Q & A session with Pink News. However, he didn't and as far as I know Pride was about being supportive of LGBT people and showing that gay people shouldn't have to pretend to have different views to conform to social pressure. The LGBT UKIP members have different political views but are being discriminated against. To take part and be part of gay pride you apparently have to conform to the organisers political views. It doesn't seem like the message of tolerance that I hope for. The best way to show someone with an irrational dislike of gay people why they're wrong is for them to meet gay people and see they are just people. I think UKIPs LGBT group are trying to engage with Pride and show they aren't monsters too.
TKF said:
Nice chap
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/tory-mp-matt-hancock-insu...There are of course other Conservative, Labour & Lib Dems who's views are negative about gay people.
I don't see UKIPs policy's as being incompatible with the LGBT members. I do think it's a shame that pressure to conform means there are probably fewer openly gay members in UKIP and consequently the party doesn't benefit as much from their opinions.
Midenginedcoupe: now your back you may have missed this post of mine - any evidence or an apology would be appreciated.
I don't disagree with this. I don't think UKIP do either. If you can show evidence of me disagreeing it will give your opinion more crediblity. Otherwise you are in the same category as Scuffers stats.
brenflys777 said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
That is not only insulting to me, but whilst you are entitled to your opinion, your view of what I think is unsubstantiated in fact.anonymous said:
[redacted]
I don't disagree with this. I don't think UKIP do either. If you can show evidence of me disagreeing it will give your opinion more crediblity. Otherwise you are in the same category as Scuffers stats.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I have never claimed this. you are mistaken. anonymous said:
[redacted]
I hope you re-read that and apply it to what I've written. You have misinterpreted or created opinions attributed to me which are false and then used them to suggest that they represent the difference between a principled viewpoint like yours and a prejudiced one like mine. Edited by brenflys777 on Thursday 4th June 18:07
brenflys777 said:
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/tory-mp-matt-hancock-insu...
There are of course other Conservative, Labour & Lib Dems who's views are negative about gay people.
This is a thread about UKIP. I also don't think that tweet is even in the same ballpark as the deluded comments from Monckton, Dean Burnett, Kerry Smith etc.There are of course other Conservative, Labour & Lib Dems who's views are negative about gay people.
TKF said:
brenflys777 said:
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/tory-mp-matt-hancock-insu...
There are of course other Conservative, Labour & Lib Dems who's views are negative about gay people.
This is a thread about UKIP. I also don't think that tweet is even in the same ballpark as the deluded comments from Monckton, Dean Burnett, Kerry Smith etc.There are of course other Conservative, Labour & Lib Dems who's views are negative about gay people.
Labour:
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/13/labour-mp-acc...
Lib Dems:
http://www.conservativehome.com/localgovernment/20...
Individuals who have unpleasant or ignorant views deserve to have them highlighted to voters and their party. Just because UKIP has had some of these individuals doesn't mean the whole party should be stigmatised IMO. If you want to list some more UKIP @rseholes I'll happily list more Cons, Libs and Labour. If you want to make the point UKIP are as homophobic as those parties it would make sense to carry on.
Just been talking to friend in Colchester who had to go to A&E at the General last night. Pandamonia with migrants, some dead, all hidden in a container at Harwich. Low and behold all over the news now. Two pregnant women amongst the 'many' (apparently) nationalities.
This problem is not going to go away.
This problem is not going to go away.
dandarez said:
This thing about life expectancy and we're 'ALL' living longer.
No we are not 'ALL' living longer! The only ones who are, were obviously born around the First World War or after.
Talking of living longer, a bit off the kipper track, all I have heard about all day is this new 'Death Test'.
What is it with all this crap? Also another thing being pushed today 'get your dna'
https://www.23andme.com/en-gb/
Mind you that's another money-milker, the suckers will be along in a second.
I was asked this afternoon if I had done the 'death test'?
The 'experts' say it's 80 per cent accurate I was told. Well, it ain't bloody accurate then is it! We are now a nation of gullible dim-wits (regardless of who you vote for).
Had years of being told I was high risk and could snuff it.
In 1968 my dad had a coronary. I was 18.
10 years later he had another, his last.
3 years later my mum died of cancer, same age as my dad, 56.
Years of the 'experts' telling me 'you're increased and high risk'. 'You'll be dead by mid 40s if you don't heed (so-called) healthy eating' they told me.
Give up the Gold Top, the butter, the red meat, etc, etc.
I (we as a family) did for a few years, late 80s, and drank that s
t called skimmed milk, ate those crap spreads that make you run (in more ways than one!) instead of butter, and like an idiot entered for the first time the McLibels, the KFCs, the Burgerkings et al, and started drinking something I hadn't since my teens, Coke (yuk!).
Something then went f..... wrong! My waistline increased for the first time in my life.
Penny dropped. Back to Gold Top, butter, red meat et al. Never looked back since. The only thing I looked at was the continuing and increasing number of obese people in this nation.
I wonder why?
AND do you really think these obese people will 'ALL' be living longer?
How long before the new phrase comes in? 'We're 'ALL' dying younger!'
Yeah, I'm still here. I can outrun plenty half my age. I'm the same weight I was when my dad had his first coronary.
Death test? FO!
I'm here and intend to get my congratulatory message from the King on my 100th.
That's a bit off the Kipper message, except I eat them too, you should too even if the thought of Kippers makes you reach!
Oh sod, I have keyed too much. Back to the grindstone and keepthemy economy rolling!
It's sad when they lose their faculties so early. 65 is no age. No we are not 'ALL' living longer! The only ones who are, were obviously born around the First World War or after.
Talking of living longer, a bit off the kipper track, all I have heard about all day is this new 'Death Test'.
What is it with all this crap? Also another thing being pushed today 'get your dna'
https://www.23andme.com/en-gb/
Mind you that's another money-milker, the suckers will be along in a second.
I was asked this afternoon if I had done the 'death test'?
The 'experts' say it's 80 per cent accurate I was told. Well, it ain't bloody accurate then is it! We are now a nation of gullible dim-wits (regardless of who you vote for).
Had years of being told I was high risk and could snuff it.
In 1968 my dad had a coronary. I was 18.
10 years later he had another, his last.
3 years later my mum died of cancer, same age as my dad, 56.
Years of the 'experts' telling me 'you're increased and high risk'. 'You'll be dead by mid 40s if you don't heed (so-called) healthy eating' they told me.
Give up the Gold Top, the butter, the red meat, etc, etc.
I (we as a family) did for a few years, late 80s, and drank that s
t called skimmed milk, ate those crap spreads that make you run (in more ways than one!) instead of butter, and like an idiot entered for the first time the McLibels, the KFCs, the Burgerkings et al, and started drinking something I hadn't since my teens, Coke (yuk!). Something then went f..... wrong! My waistline increased for the first time in my life.
Penny dropped. Back to Gold Top, butter, red meat et al. Never looked back since. The only thing I looked at was the continuing and increasing number of obese people in this nation.
I wonder why?
AND do you really think these obese people will 'ALL' be living longer?
How long before the new phrase comes in? 'We're 'ALL' dying younger!'
Yeah, I'm still here. I can outrun plenty half my age. I'm the same weight I was when my dad had his first coronary.
Death test? FO!
I'm here and intend to get my congratulatory message from the King on my 100th.
That's a bit off the Kipper message, except I eat them too, you should too even if the thought of Kippers makes you reach!
Oh sod, I have keyed too much. Back to the grindstone and keep
dandarez said:
Just been talking to friend in Colchester who had to go to A&E at the General last night. Pandamonia with migrants, some dead, all hidden in a container at Harwich. Low and behold all over the news now. Two pregnant women amongst the 'many' (apparently) nationalities.
This problem is not going to go away.
I agree and one which might get much worst if we leave the EU without agreeing with other members how we deal with illegal immigration.This problem is not going to go away.
Mrr T said:
dandarez said:
Just been talking to friend in Colchester who had to go to A&E at the General last night. Pandamonia with migrants, some dead, all hidden in a container at Harwich. Low and behold all over the news now. Two pregnant women amongst the 'many' (apparently) nationalities.
This problem is not going to go away.
I agree and one which might get much worst if we leave the EU without agreeing with other members how we deal with illegal immigration.This problem is not going to go away.
[quote="BBC"]The pregnant women were among seven people taken to Colchester Hospital suffering from non life-threatening abdominal and chest pains. The remaining 61 were assessed and released to immigration officials.
Edited by Strawman on Friday 5th June 11:16
brenflys777 said:
The point I was tryin to make is that regrettably every party has people with views that I would consider unpleasant about gays. You've give three UKIP examples, here's two more from me, one from Labour one Lib Dem.
Labour:
ttp://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/13/labour-mp-accused-of-shouting-homophobic-abuse-at-footballer/
Lib Dems:
http://www.conservativehome.com/localgovernment/20...
For me those two examples are a bit silly. The second one from the Tory site especially so. I wouldn't consider them homophobic. The Tory site example seems a tad stretchy.Labour:
ttp://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/13/labour-mp-accused-of-shouting-homophobic-abuse-at-footballer/
Lib Dems:
http://www.conservativehome.com/localgovernment/20...
brenflys777 said:
Halb said:
For me those two examples are a bit silly. The second one from the Tory site especially so. I wouldn't consider them homophobic. The Tory site example seems a tad stretchy.
Plenty of other examples if they aren't to your liking...Mrr T said:
dandarez said:
Just been talking to friend in Colchester who had to go to A&E at the General last night. Pandamonia with migrants, some dead, all hidden in a container at Harwich. Low and behold all over the news now. Two pregnant women amongst the 'many' (apparently) nationalities.
This problem is not going to go away.
I agree and one which might get much worst if we leave the EU without agreeing with other members how we deal with illegal immigration.This problem is not going to go away.
Halb said:
I don't like or dislike them, they just seem not to represent any homophobic views. The stuff that Monckton said was something different altogether.
The standard that had those two examples reported as homophobic, is the same standard which has been applied to UKIP members and councillors. I'm not making excuses for Monkton or UKIP, but I would liken the Pride march banning UKIP LGBT members, because of individuals like Monkton, as akin to the NSPCC banning Lib Dems from a function supporting children because of the documented paedophiles who existed within their ranks. brenflys777 said:
The point I was tryin to make is that regrettably every party has people with views that I would consider unpleasant about gays. You've give three UKIP examples, here's two more from me, one from Labour one Lib Dem.
Labour:
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/13/labour-mp-acc...
Lib Dems:
http://www.conservativehome.com/localgovernment/20...
Individuals who have unpleasant or ignorant views deserve to have them highlighted to voters and their party. Just because UKIP has had some of these individuals doesn't mean the whole party should be stigmatised IMO. If you want to list some more UKIP @rseholes I'll happily list more Cons, Libs and Labour. If you want to make the point UKIP are as homophobic as those parties it would make sense to carry on.
Do you think calling someone "his royal gayness" and a "raving poofter" when criticising their ability to do their job, homophobic?Labour:
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/13/labour-mp-acc...
Lib Dems:
http://www.conservativehome.com/localgovernment/20...
Individuals who have unpleasant or ignorant views deserve to have them highlighted to voters and their party. Just because UKIP has had some of these individuals doesn't mean the whole party should be stigmatised IMO. If you want to list some more UKIP @rseholes I'll happily list more Cons, Libs and Labour. If you want to make the point UKIP are as homophobic as those parties it would make sense to carry on.
Scuffers said:
no, it's just you are you're ignorant mates who cannot read and understand what is posted without making huge assumptions and going off on the xenophobe/homophobe/whatever trip.
what you continually fail to do is separate the people from the numbers, it's not about who they are, and to a point, where they come from, so much as the shear numbers and what it's costing us as a country.
Pick another example, the UK birth numbers, some 75% of current births are to immigrants, this is causing huge issues down the line for the infrastructure to support these numbers, hence why 4-5 years on, we have a shortage of infant places in schools etc.
Once again, it's not about where these immigrants have come from, it's the numbers.
you cannot keep importing 600K+ people a year and not expect there to be problem, and before you then go on and tell me that X numbers are leaving, yes that's true, but statistically, the ones leaving have already had children, so if they stayed most are unlikely to add to the population any more.
Please explain in what way any of these points is either racist or xenophobic?
The TL;DR version: The problem is foreigners coming to this country and breeding like rats. Lots of them. And lots of their rat-like breeding. The solution is to stop the foreigners coming to this country. Or stop them breeding once they are here. I don't care which. But we need to do something to save the British people. We need a solution and we need it to be final. PS. I don't like raving poofters either. I don't know why, because they don't breed. I'm confused. And what I just said - it doesn't mean what you think it means. It means what I say it means. Which I will do later. what you continually fail to do is separate the people from the numbers, it's not about who they are, and to a point, where they come from, so much as the shear numbers and what it's costing us as a country.
Pick another example, the UK birth numbers, some 75% of current births are to immigrants, this is causing huge issues down the line for the infrastructure to support these numbers, hence why 4-5 years on, we have a shortage of infant places in schools etc.
Once again, it's not about where these immigrants have come from, it's the numbers.
you cannot keep importing 600K+ people a year and not expect there to be problem, and before you then go on and tell me that X numbers are leaving, yes that's true, but statistically, the ones leaving have already had children, so if they stayed most are unlikely to add to the population any more.
Please explain in what way any of these points is either racist or xenophobic?
Yeah. Nothing racist or xenophobic there. Can't be long before you post something that starts "Look, some of my best friends are immigrants (but not gay)..."
968 said:
Do you think calling someone "his royal gayness" and a "raving poofter" when criticising their ability to do their job, homophobic?
Is that enough information for you to make a reasoned judgement?Context is needed I think.
David Coburn MEP UKIP who is openly gay said that then it would probably be ok in the right circumstance. If I said it, I'd struggle to think of an acceptable circumstance.
A question similar to your would be if I asked if it was ever ok to say the N word? Or is it racist?
tangerine_sedge said:
Mrr T said:
dandarez said:
Just been talking to friend in Colchester who had to go to A&E at the General last night. Pandamonia with migrants, some dead, all hidden in a container at Harwich. Low and behold all over the news now. Two pregnant women amongst the 'many' (apparently) nationalities.
This problem is not going to go away.
I agree and one which might get much worst if we leave the EU without agreeing with other members how we deal with illegal immigration.This problem is not going to go away.
My greater concern was the effect on Ro-Ro services via Dover. At the moment the French allow us to operate passport and customs controls on French soil This means any body caught trying to enter illegally, whether with false papers or hiding in a lorry, is still on French soil. So customs or passport control just push them out the door. If on an EU exit, and using the kipper exit plan its likely, France and the UK reintroduced full customs controls. Its highly lightly France would no longer allow us to operate passport and customs controls on French soil. If that happens any body caught would be caught on UK soil would be subject to all the restriction on return of the HCHR.
This would give us much less control over illegal immigration. It might be very happy as it would help clear their Sandgate problem.
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