Snap General Election?
Discussion
W124 said:
Corbyn, for all his myriad faults, is a blatantly decent bloke.
I am several pages behind (busy day at work) but JC is not "decent". I am of Southern Irish descent but this terrorist supporter (let alone apologist) disgusts me; the Tory dogs of hell have thus far been nibbling at the heels of this loon; they need to go for the jugular before June 8. It does bother me though, because I grew up in an era of great (I mean it) Labour thinkers, like Benn, Castle, Shore, and recently, Frank Field (I have no issue with genuine cross-party collaboration and in time of war or prevailing national interest, such as Brexit, shouldn't that be happening?) TM seems to have misjudged the intelligence of the electorate with regard to elderly care, just as MT did with the so-called Poll Tax. Both were economically absolutely the right thing to do and it saddens me that apparently, there is no proper "thinking" going on, on either side.sidicks said:
Yipper said:
Betting volume on Tories has collapsed by -50% in 2 weeks. People voting with their hard-earned money.
How much of people's hard-earned money has been bet on Labour in the last week and how much has been bet on the Tories?
Normally I'd agree with you Sidicks but I think there is a point here as it is a voting event in which the bettors can participate. One bloke betting £10k has one vote whereas a thousand blokes betting £10 have 1000 votes. I believe this was an indicator prior to the Brexit vote where all the money men were for Remain but the rank and file were for Leave and this was evidenced by the volume of bets and of course in the final result.
Having said that, it's the only slightly positive point Yipper has (if true).
This election coverage strikes me like a boxing PPV event where Antony Joshua is up against the latest Bum of the Month. It's a total mismatch but the media are trying to make out it is close to drum up interest. Just get it over with.
I thought Miliband had about as low leadership qualities as possible for a major Party but both Corbyn and Farron outdo even him. They are just dreadful candidates for PM. Couple that with decent economic indicators and a desire to just get on with Brexit by a vast majority (including Remain voters) and it's a no contest.
DELETED: Comment made by a member who's account has been deleted.
And this is a fundamental misunderstanding of the dynamics as well. The silent majority were silenced by shouty Lefty types on social media and in the MSM but voted for their preferred candidate anyway. So if anything, if the trend in those events is followed it will be worse for Labour than the polls not better.And I'm amazed that the same failed shouty tactics are still being used as evidenced by yet more Celebs popping out telling us how to think (Danny Devito!), the new arrivals on here flirting with sanity plus the dismal Trump thread where the consistently wrong carry on being consistently wrong. They try to play the "I'm considerably cleverer than yow" card yet haven't learnt a thing themselves.
Has the juvenile exchanging of jibes and insults died down now? Has the critique of the beauty pageant when it's only half way through finished? If we were going to vote for who can perform best in front of the camera then we could cut the campaigns down to a series of interviews for the leaders and choose on the basis of who looked and sounded the best rather than content.
What is wrong with being nervous in front of a camera? What does it fundamentally change regarding the content?
Back to the latest policies.
The Tories have made a significant change to their old age care policy whether May will openly admit that or not and is uncomfortable being interviewed over it. The real question is, surely, does it remain a good policy or a bad policy. The fact appears to be that it will help fund an increasingly expensive problem. IMHO the revision will help the richer end of the spectrum and has been spurred on, in some measure, by the Labour Party and lefty media trying to score points rather than analyse the content of the policy revision. Think about that!
The Labour Party is now promising to remove tuition fees for students immediately. They haven't stated how that will be funded in the short term. The fact of the matter is that, currently, those students who go on to lower paid jobs will eventually pay back only a fraction of the debt. Those going on to earn well will pay back the debt in full. Removing this approach favours those that go on to earn well, the better off. A policy that favours the better off to be put in place by a Labour government. Think about that!
What is wrong with being nervous in front of a camera? What does it fundamentally change regarding the content?
Back to the latest policies.
The Tories have made a significant change to their old age care policy whether May will openly admit that or not and is uncomfortable being interviewed over it. The real question is, surely, does it remain a good policy or a bad policy. The fact appears to be that it will help fund an increasingly expensive problem. IMHO the revision will help the richer end of the spectrum and has been spurred on, in some measure, by the Labour Party and lefty media trying to score points rather than analyse the content of the policy revision. Think about that!
The Labour Party is now promising to remove tuition fees for students immediately. They haven't stated how that will be funded in the short term. The fact of the matter is that, currently, those students who go on to lower paid jobs will eventually pay back only a fraction of the debt. Those going on to earn well will pay back the debt in full. Removing this approach favours those that go on to earn well, the better off. A policy that favours the better off to be put in place by a Labour government. Think about that!
Garvin said:
The Labour Party is now promising to remove tuition fees for students immediately.
Hang on - what? Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that:
'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'
........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
Edited by Moonhawk on Monday 22 May 22:56
turbobloke said:
May remains the best of a bad lot, whatever else, and however embarrassingly self-inflicted this episode is she's still well above the level of JC and Tim Who.
This is a line that I keep reading here, and indeed the "I'm not Corbyn" position seems to be the fallback answer to every question for Theresa Maybe.I'm not anti-Corbyn on a personal level, I just don't agree with his politics. He's an old fashioned socialist so at least it's pretty obvious what he stands for.
I'm seeing Tim Who as perferable to May though, who makes him look an eloquent and passionate orator, I don't see her as necessarily being well above his level. What's the specific criticism of him?
As a remainiac I'm voting Lib Dim on the basis of their brexit position alone, but the rest of their manifesto isn't actually too unreasonable and looks more palatable than quite a lot of what's what's on offer from Theresa May's Team.
Farron's practicing christian thing puts me off somewhat but it doesn't seem to interfere with his politics so I'm willing to see past it...
mx-6 said:
This is a line that I keep reading here, and indeed the "I'm not Corbyn" position seems to be the fallback answer to every question for Theresa Maybe.
I'm not anti-Corbyn on a personal level, I just don't agree with his politics. He's an old fashioned socialist so at least it's pretty obvious what he stands for.
I'm seeing Tim Who as perferable to May though, who makes him look an eloquent and passionate orator, I don't see her as necessarily being well above his level. What's the specific criticism of him?
As a remainiac I'm voting Lib Dim on the basis of their brexit position alone, but the rest of their manifesto isn't actually too unreasonable and looks more palatable than quite a lot of what's what's on offer from Theresa May's Team.
Farron's practicing christian thing puts me off somewhat but it doesn't seem to interfere with his politics so I'm willing to see past it...
Such as?I'm not anti-Corbyn on a personal level, I just don't agree with his politics. He's an old fashioned socialist so at least it's pretty obvious what he stands for.
I'm seeing Tim Who as perferable to May though, who makes him look an eloquent and passionate orator, I don't see her as necessarily being well above his level. What's the specific criticism of him?
As a remainiac I'm voting Lib Dim on the basis of their brexit position alone, but the rest of their manifesto isn't actually too unreasonable and looks more palatable than quite a lot of what's what's on offer from Theresa May's Team.
Farron's practicing christian thing puts me off somewhat but it doesn't seem to interfere with his politics so I'm willing to see past it...
Moonhawk said:
Hang on - what?
Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
On R4 this morning they said that the fee abolition would apply to students starting in Sept.Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
OzzyR1 said:
Moonhawk said:
Hang on - what?
Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
On R4 this morning they said that the fee abolition would apply to students starting in Sept.Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
Surely such a huge and important policy point should have been highlighted in their manifesto.......etc etc
How can they possibly expect voters to vote on a policy when they have no idea how the funding with work out.....etc etc
Edited by Moonhawk on Monday 22 May 23:10
sidicks said:
Such as?
Presumably you're already aware of Lib Dem and Team Theresa manifesto pledges? If not give them a squint.For the Lib Dem's besides brexit it basically consists of spend a bit more on public services but not as much as Labour, put income tax up 1%, legalise wacky baccy, from memory... There's obviously a whole load of stuff, most of which seem positive and little of which sound unreasonable.
alfie2244 said:
BigMon said:
DELETED: Comment made by a member who's account has been deleted.
Believe me, I am no right-winger, but I struggling to think of anyone I would prefer less to be in positions of power in this country than Jeremy Corbyn, Dianne Abbot, John McDonnell and Angela Rayner.
t.Moonhawk said:
OzzyR1 said:
Moonhawk said:
Hang on - what?
Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
On R4 this morning they said that the fee abolition would apply to students starting in Sept.Immediately?
It doesn't say that in their manifesto.......ergo using the lefty logic that 'stating something which was not previously stated in your manifesto constitutes a u-turn'........that surely constitutes a u-turn........no?
TheChampers said:
W124 said:
Corbyn, for all his myriad faults, is a blatantly decent bloke.
I am several pages behind (busy day at work) but JC is not "decent". I am of Southern Irish descent but this terrorist supporter (let alone apologist) disgusts me; the Tory dogs of hell have thus far been nibbling at the heels of this loon; they need to go for the jugular before June 8. It does bother me though, because I grew up in an era of great (I mean it) Labour thinkers, like Benn, Castle, Shore, and recently, Frank Field (I have no issue with genuine cross-party collaboration and in time of war or prevailing national interest, such as Brexit, shouldn't that be happening?) TM seems to have misjudged the intelligence of the electorate with regard to elderly care, just as MT did with the so-called Poll Tax. Both were economically absolutely the right thing to do and it saddens me that apparently, there is no proper "thinking" going on, on either side.Garvin said:
Knock it off. It's not a U turn just an advancement of an already declared policy. However, having bleated on all high and mighty like about the Tories not costing their policies, this is one that Labour have not costed properly. They have no idea how many students will now take advantage of the 'free' at the point of delivery university tuition! What they do know, however, is that those students who have already graduated with debt will now have to also pay, via tax, for future students - a double whammy if ever there was!
Unless you're into hypothecation & no one is, then yes, they'll shoulder the burden from general taxation, as we all do for everything the government does. It also supposes Labour will form the next government in order to introduce the policy, which they won't. Unless Theresa keeps fking it up with her dodgy u-turns & shifty interviews & avoid the electorate at all costs strategy, that is.At the end of the day if the cap is say 400k (i.e for a 500k house you must payback 400k and keep 100k) it will still wipe out most normal people - and of course if it is capped it only helps the rich!
The fact is this mention of a cap may make people think twice about voting for someone else when in fact they have no idea what the cap will be until months after the election.
The fact is this mention of a cap may make people think twice about voting for someone else when in fact they have no idea what the cap will be until months after the election.
TheChampers said:
W124 said:
Corbyn, for all his myriad faults, is a blatantly decent bloke.
I am several pages behind (busy day at work) but JC is not "decent". I am of Southern Irish descent but this terrorist supporter (let alone apologist) disgusts me; the Tory dogs of hell have thus far been nibbling at the heels of this loon; they need to go for the jugular before June 8. It does bother me though, because I grew up in an era of great (I mean it) Labour thinkers, like Benn, Castle, Shore, and recently, Frank Field (I have no issue with genuine cross-party collaboration and in time of war or prevailing national interest, such as Brexit, shouldn't that be happening?) TM seems to have misjudged the intelligence of the electorate with regard to elderly care, just as MT did with the so-called Poll Tax. Both were economically absolutely the right thing to do and it saddens me that apparently, there is no proper "thinking" going on, on either side.
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