A public sector employee's point of view...
Discussion
heebeegeetee said:
randlemarcus said:
Who decides that?
I look at my employer, and weigh up the evidence before me and I decide that for myself, not relying on external influences, be those union or journalist hysteria.
I wouldn't rely on your employer being honest either.I look at my employer, and weigh up the evidence before me and I decide that for myself, not relying on external influences, be those union or journalist hysteria.
heebeegeetee said:
randlemarcus said:
Who decides that?
I look at my employer, and weigh up the evidence before me and I decide that for myself, not relying on external influences, be those union or journalist hysteria.
I wouldn't rely on your employer being honest either.I look at my employer, and weigh up the evidence before me and I decide that for myself, not relying on external influences, be those union or journalist hysteria.
There will be elements of convenience for some employers but since inflation has chiselled more than 10% of value away since 2008, unless a firm is doing more than 10% revenue (and assuming margins are consistent) then the answer is pretty straightforward. Basic arithmetic.
heebeegeetee said:
I wouldn't rely on your employer being honest either.
I don't. In the least.However, as a listed company, there are some things they have to be honest about. Rumour control, and looking at things like current performance metrics and pipeline health will give you a better picture than sitting back and being fed information that they want you to see.
Gosh, a lot like the rest of life then.
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
heebeegeetee said:
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
Given that background I can understand you scepticism.AFAIK, in various parts of the world, telling someone you are "in the Ready Mixed Concrete business" is code for being in some sort of organised criminal gang or another.
The other main one being (Mr Soprano's) "waste managment".
Digga said:
iven that background I can understand you scepticism.
AFAIK, in various parts of the world, telling someone you are "in the Ready Mixed Concrete business" is code for being in some sort of organised criminal gang or another.
The other main one being (Mr Soprano's) "waste managment".
Plus, my wife works for a bank.AFAIK, in various parts of the world, telling someone you are "in the Ready Mixed Concrete business" is code for being in some sort of organised criminal gang or another.
The other main one being (Mr Soprano's) "waste managment".
Another major listed company that is regularly fined for all sorts of mis-deeds. And hers is one of the better ones.
The government's view appears to be to carry on regardless.
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/290463/Bid-to-...
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/290463/Bid-to-...
heebeegeetee said:
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
And just why did you stay there for over 20 years, if it was so bad?During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
REALIST123 said:
heebeegeetee said:
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
And just why did you stay there for over 20 years, if it was so bad?During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
He sold his lorry and went driving for someone else with out all the hassle involved of bein an owner driver.
He did do it for over 10 years thou.
cossy400 said:
REALIST123 said:
heebeegeetee said:
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
And just why did you stay there for over 20 years, if it was so bad?During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
He sold his lorry and went driving for someone else with out all the hassle involved of bein an owner driver.
He did do it for over 10 years thou.
I guess it is true that every man has his price.
Daft PS update from my BIL who visited this weekend.
Won't say which bit of PS he works in, but it's a basic ofice environment. They have 'inherited' a problem from another department. She was one of two temporary workers and had spent a large amount of time off work for alledged (but never substantiated) bullying. The general view being that her uselessness was the cause of her stress and the friction from other staff.
However, when time came to hire one of the two temporary staff on a permanent basis, who got the job? The conscientious worker or the one who'd been off stick. Yep.
She's now transferred into my BIL's team and they have to put up with her uselessness. She is a constant drain on the management - perpetually demanding to see the manager for talks behind closed doors. She turns up for work, clocks in, then__ uses the showers (provided for those who wish to visit the gym or go for a run before work or during lunch hours), and then settles down to her breakfast at her desk __before starting work. To cap it all she leaves her towells drying on the office radiators - nice.
He has a name for these misfits whom the PS seem to wish to nuture; the 'endangered species', because that's pretty much how they're treated.
Won't say which bit of PS he works in, but it's a basic ofice environment. They have 'inherited' a problem from another department. She was one of two temporary workers and had spent a large amount of time off work for alledged (but never substantiated) bullying. The general view being that her uselessness was the cause of her stress and the friction from other staff.
However, when time came to hire one of the two temporary staff on a permanent basis, who got the job? The conscientious worker or the one who'd been off stick. Yep.
She's now transferred into my BIL's team and they have to put up with her uselessness. She is a constant drain on the management - perpetually demanding to see the manager for talks behind closed doors. She turns up for work, clocks in, then__ uses the showers (provided for those who wish to visit the gym or go for a run before work or during lunch hours), and then settles down to her breakfast at her desk __before starting work. To cap it all she leaves her towells drying on the office radiators - nice.
He has a name for these misfits whom the PS seem to wish to nuture; the 'endangered species', because that's pretty much how they're treated.
cossy400 said:
REALIST123 said:
heebeegeetee said:
I was a lorry owner driver for a major listed company (Ready Mixed Concrete) for over 20 years. I was effectively a franchisee.
During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
And just why did you stay there for over 20 years, if it was so bad?During all that time, I came to realise that in a nutshell, hardly one honest word was ever said by the company either to us or the company employees. Indeed, the whole 'owner driver' operation was, and still is by companies operating similar schemes today, one big tax scam.
The whole operation, the whole operating ethos of the company, was dishonest throughout.
Now, given that we reside in a country that has no constitution, an unelected leader and often unelected prime ministers and/or front bench ministers, and the fact that nearly every MP in the land is dishonest- in other words, the country is corrupt from the very top down - why should we think that anyone else or any other major company or organisation is any different?
So it's very worthwhile for Mr Whippy to take his stance, but I just hope he is doing so for genuine reasons and not just because his boss/bosses is lying and stealing from him.
He sold his lorry and went driving for someone else with out all the hassle involved of bein an owner driver.
He did do it for over 10 years thou.
REALIST123 said:
Well, I'd like to see an answer from Heebee, but what you are saying is the pay outweighed the principle?
I guess it is true that every man has his price.
With regards to my 20 years, I didn't say it was so bad (in fact i really enjoyed it for many years), it was just something that I noticed. They were lying to us, we were lying to them and we were all lying to the customers in one way or another, and nothing's changed to this day.I guess it is true that every man has his price.
This country is bent from top to bottom, in this country a contract is pretty much effectively worthless, and like I said before, Mr Whippy needs to take care that he really does know what's going on with his employers.
turbobloke said:
What odds in the private sector she would be at home drying the sack she got early on for being wet?
BIL recons that would pretty much be a dead cert. She is a full house; useless, wet, lazy, socially inept. As he says, an "endangered species" that the PS has taken it upon itself to harbour.Digga said:
Daft PS update from my BIL who visited this weekend.
Won't say which bit of PS he works in, but it's a basic ofice environment. They have 'inherited' a problem from another department. She was one of two temporary workers and had spent a large amount of time off work for alledged (but never substantiated) bullying. The general view being that her uselessness was the cause of her stress and the friction from other staff.
However, when time came to hire one of the two temporary staff on a permanent basis, who got the job? The conscientious worker or the one who'd been off stick. Yep.
She's now transferred into my BIL's team and they have to put up with her uselessness. She is a constant drain on the management - perpetually demanding to see the manager for talks behind closed doors. She turns up for work, clocks in, then__ uses the showers (provided for those who wish to visit the gym or go for a run before work or during lunch hours), and then settles down to her breakfast at her desk __before starting work. To cap it all she leaves her towells drying on the office radiators - nice.
He has a name for these misfits whom the PS seem to wish to nuture; the 'endangered species', because that's pretty much how they're treated.
I'm sorry, but I find these stories hard to believe. Why would they take on the crap temp, rather than the good one? Won't say which bit of PS he works in, but it's a basic ofice environment. They have 'inherited' a problem from another department. She was one of two temporary workers and had spent a large amount of time off work for alledged (but never substantiated) bullying. The general view being that her uselessness was the cause of her stress and the friction from other staff.
However, when time came to hire one of the two temporary staff on a permanent basis, who got the job? The conscientious worker or the one who'd been off stick. Yep.
She's now transferred into my BIL's team and they have to put up with her uselessness. She is a constant drain on the management - perpetually demanding to see the manager for talks behind closed doors. She turns up for work, clocks in, then__ uses the showers (provided for those who wish to visit the gym or go for a run before work or during lunch hours), and then settles down to her breakfast at her desk __before starting work. To cap it all she leaves her towells drying on the office radiators - nice.
He has a name for these misfits whom the PS seem to wish to nuture; the 'endangered species', because that's pretty much how they're treated.
Which PS department is taking on temps, or indeed anyone at all? All the temps went from my wife's office at the backend of Labour's term, never mind what the coalition did (chopped another third of the staff). It's also b
ks to say that poor staff can't be got rid of - in her time she's seen a few put through the process. It's not quick, but it can, and is, done. Digga said:
Won't say which bit of PS he works in, but it's a basic ofice environment. They have 'inherited' a problem from another department. She was one of two temporary workers and had spent a large amount of time off work for alledged (but never substantiated) bullying. The general view being that her uselessness was the cause of her stress and the friction from other staff.
Sounds to me like the "alleged" bullying was her former line manager putting pressure on her to do the job she was being paid to do (contrary to the PH perception that poor performance is always tolerated in the Public Sector )Digga said:
However, when time came to hire one of the two temporary staff on a permanent basis, who got the job? The conscientious worker or the one who'd been off stick. Yep.
This I don't understand 
Any manager worth half his salt would have had a quiet word with her current manager to see what she was like. There is no advantage or benefit to anybody to recruit a PITA over a good worker so why do it ?Deva Link said:
I'm sorry, but I find these stories hard to believe.
Well that's your problem. I'm saying it's true - BIL has mentioned it before too, so I certainly believe him and he is not politically motivated. Either believe my account or get off the fence and call me a liar outright. Deva Link said:
Which PS department is taking on temps, or indeed anyone at all?
As I said, I am not about to reveal where he works as he could be very easily identified. The taking onto full-time was done during the last administration. This is an ongoing HR clusterfk that, in the nature of these things, just keeps giving. HTHETA in honesty, no one knows why she was chose over the other temp. There many of course be reasons - looking better on papaer - or it may just be HR bottled it at a potential (but unsubstantiated) bullying tribunal. Who knows?
Edited by Digga on Monday 19th December 10:50
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