Eco- Warriers. Are They All Hypocrites?
Discussion
rxe said:
OK, let's take Mr Packham. He's very worried about climate change, no doubt that we can accept his work is terribly important, and he has to fly everywhere, but why is he leading groups of tourists on long haul international travel? Here:
https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
I can absolutely see that side of it but over the course of his life and work do you honestly think he's a hypocrite because of a few trips?https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
My guess is he's done massive amounts of good around raising awareness over several decades but as I said before I don't know how you measure it in any meaningful way where you could ever "prove" it one way or the other.
supertouring said:
StevieBee said:
requires the consumption of oil, of which there is around 50 years worth left to use.
I remember being told we only had 50 years left when I was in school 40 years ago and I think our consumption has increased massively since then. bhstewie said:
rxe said:
OK, let's take Mr Packham. He's very worried about climate change, no doubt that we can accept his work is terribly important, and he has to fly everywhere, but why is he leading groups of tourists on long haul international travel? Here:
https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
I can absolutely see that side of it but over the course of his life and work do you honestly think he's a hypocrite because of a few trips?https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
My guess is he's done massive amounts of good around raising awareness over several decades but as I said before I don't know how you measure it in any meaningful way where you could ever "prove" it one way or the other.
Not gonna move the needle much is it?
FNG said:
bhstewie said:
rxe said:
OK, let's take Mr Packham. He's very worried about climate change, no doubt that we can accept his work is terribly important, and he has to fly everywhere, but why is he leading groups of tourists on long haul international travel? Here:
https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
I can absolutely see that side of it but over the course of his life and work do you honestly think he's a hypocrite because of a few trips?https://www.steppestravel.com/people/chris-packham...
Surely the better answer is to say "this is a bad idea, why don't you watch it on telly".
We all know why though - money. It's why we all do it.
The hypocrisy kicks in when we are all being told to change our ways by a bunch of people who think they are far too important to change theirs.
My guess is he's done massive amounts of good around raising awareness over several decades but as I said before I don't know how you measure it in any meaningful way where you could ever "prove" it one way or the other.
Not gonna move the needle much is it?
Biggy Stardust said:
If people say "don't do that" whilst doing it themselves then they are hypocrites.
Anything else is just noise & distraction.
Are they actually doing that? Anything else is just noise & distraction.
Whenever I hear these accusations regarding hypocrisy and you read what the person being vilified has said at best it’s a “we must all” type comment and usually they haven’t told others how to live at all.
105.4 said:
MonkeyMatt said:
Some absolute nonsense being spouted here as usual. To be honest if you aren't interested in the environment and making positive changes, however small, you are short signed moron
If you want me to support getting the most bang for our buck in terms of energy use, I’m all for it.If you want to to support getting the most value out of recycling, I’m all for it.
If you want me to support cleaning up the oceans, I’m all for it.
If you want me to support stopping deforestation and helping to preserve endangered species, I’m all for it.
What I will not support is one set of people telling another set of people how to live, whilst those who spout the rules constantly break them, (Greta Thumberg, Prince Harry, all Politicians, celebrities etc).
In essence, see my post above about the couple who have five children.
bhstewie said:
That's not really what I said.
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good leaps to mind.
I’m not asking for perfect. But what he is doing is the opposite of perfect. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good leaps to mind.
He’s blathering on about climate change, and wants us all to think it is important and take it seriously. Maybe fly less or something.
However, as soon as he is presented with an opportunity to fly across the world and make a few quid doing exactly what he is saying is bad, he just goes “ah fk it, climate change isn’t that bad”.
So either he doesn’t believe the bull st he is spouting, or he’s an absolute hypocrite.
It’s just the same with an acquaintance of mine who has gone on XR demos. 4 foreign holidays a year and a full on excessive consumerist lifestyle. But climate change, yeah.
Randy Winkman said:
How does Greta Thunberg break the rules? And even if she does, do you not think her impact is greater than her environmental footprint?
Let’s see, here’s a few off the top of my head. Jet setting around the world in business / first class to tell the plebs they shouldn’t go abroad on holiday for two weeks every year. Why doesn’t she fly steerage like the rest of us scummers.
Promoting sustainability whilst being driven around in a brand new Tesla and having the latest iPhones. Sustainability would be using a 30 year old car perhaps converted to LPG and an old Nokia.
Transversing the Atlantic in a carbon fibre boat all for a publicity stunt, before flying back from New York.
Whenever anyone asks her a tricky question, she all of a sudden gets all autistic and goes mute. How convenient.
If she wants to save the planet, good for her, but don’t go telling me what to do whilst doing the exact opposite.
bhstewie said:
FNG said:
“Do what the fk you want as long as your contribution is positive overall”
Not gonna move the needle much is it?
That's not really what I said.Not gonna move the needle much is it?
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good leaps to mind.
People shouting "hypocrite" almost always sound rather shrill.
A smoker says "smoking kills". Hypocrite or not, he's right.
ATG said:
bhstewie said:
FNG said:
“Do what the fk you want as long as your contribution is positive overall”
Not gonna move the needle much is it?
That's not really what I said.Not gonna move the needle much is it?
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good leaps to mind.
People shouting "hypocrite" almost always sound rather shrill.
A smoker says "smoking kills". Hypocrite or not, he's right.
A Winner Is You said:
The equivalent in this instance would be someone telling others they must give up smoking, whilst still smoking themselves with the reasoning that it's different because they are raising awareness of the dangers.
Who's doing that though?Chris Packham was given as an example.
I don't see that much of him on TV so what's he telling me I must do that he isn't doing?
I read the article in the OP and it didn't come across as if he was telling me I must stop doing lots of things rather encouraging me (and anyone reading) to think.
Personally I doubt you can get away without leaving any footprint so it's about the size of the one you do leave.
105.4 said:
Randy Winkman said:
How does Greta Thunberg break the rules? And even if she does, do you not think her impact is greater than her environmental footprint?
Let’s see, here’s a few off the top of my head. Jet setting around the world in business / first class to tell the plebs they shouldn’t go abroad on holiday for two weeks every year. Why doesn’t she fly steerage like the rest of us scummers.
Promoting sustainability whilst being driven around in a brand new Tesla and having the latest iPhones. Sustainability would be using a 30 year old car perhaps converted to LPG and an old Nokia.
Transversing the Atlantic in a carbon fibre boat all for a publicity stunt, before flying back from New York.
Whenever anyone asks her a tricky question, she all of a sudden gets all autistic and goes mute. How convenient.
If she wants to save the planet, good for her, but don’t go telling me what to do whilst doing the exact opposite.
irc said:
bhstewie said:
Personally I doubt you can get away without leaving any footprint so it's about the size of the one you do leave.
A bit smaller if you holiday in the UK or Europe instead of flying to Alaska?Or of course it might make you think travelling is awesome and you only live once so you go jetting off all over the world for sts and giggles.
It doesn't look great but if you looked at Attenborough's footprint and didn't consider the way he's raised awareness over the past 50-60 years I think you'd be taking a bit of a narrow view.
All I'm saying is it's not always as simple and black and white as "hypocrites!!!" IMO.
foxbody-87 said:
And a Diesel engine just in case.
Fossil fuels are bad unless you need them to bail you out in the middle of the Atlantic …
I wonder, when she got off the plastic boat did she walk to whatever protest meeting she would be babbling at, or was she driven in one of those ICE powered machines she wants to get rid of.Fossil fuels are bad unless you need them to bail you out in the middle of the Atlantic …
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