How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 10)
Discussion
carinatauk said:
Sway said:
ES reporting May has pulled back from tabling the "revised" WB - and seemingly is preparing to duck out tomorrow, as she'll be pushed by Brady otherwise.
Times, they are a'changing.
More can kicking Times, they are a'changing.
There’s not much road left to kick the can !
egor110 said:
carinatauk said:
Sway said:
ES reporting May has pulled back from tabling the "revised" WB - and seemingly is preparing to duck out tomorrow, as she'll be pushed by Brady otherwise.
Times, they are a'changing.
More can kicking Times, they are a'changing.
There’s not much road left to kick the can !
JNW1 said:
egor110 said:
carinatauk said:
Sway said:
ES reporting May has pulled back from tabling the "revised" WB - and seemingly is preparing to duck out tomorrow, as she'll be pushed by Brady otherwise.
Times, they are a'changing.
More can kicking Times, they are a'changing.
There’s not much road left to kick the can !
Sway said:
ES reporting May has pulled back from tabling the "revised" WB - and seemingly is preparing to duck out tomorrow, as she'll be pushed by Brady otherwise.
Times, they are a'changing.
It was described as dead on the lunchtime news, and Pickfords have apparently cancelled all forthcoming leave for their employees.Times, they are a'changing.
The last time there was such a divided government was in the 3 years prior to the outbreak of WW1.
The Conservatives risk suffering the same fate as the Liberal party which has never been in power since.
There is interesting parallel with those times. The Liberals were in coalition with the IPP which demanded Home Rule.
The Conservatives have had to get into bed with the DUP since the 2017 GE.
Yet again Ireland is the elephant in the room of UK politics.
The Conservatives risk suffering the same fate as the Liberal party which has never been in power since.
There is interesting parallel with those times. The Liberals were in coalition with the IPP which demanded Home Rule.
The Conservatives have had to get into bed with the DUP since the 2017 GE.
Yet again Ireland is the elephant in the room of UK politics.
digimeistter said:
I have yet to hear any positives FOR staying in the EU?
The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
1. The single market. The concept of it is brilliant. The elimination (broadly) of restrictions on flow of people, goods, cash and services. It's pure capitalism.The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
2. Restrictions on state aid. Brilliant - keeps the socialists and communists at bay. It's why Corbyn wants out.
Not much else I'm afraid. Which is why I couldn't bring myself to vote either way in 2016. Hate the EU but love the 4 freedoms.
oyster said:
digimeistter said:
I have yet to hear any positives FOR staying in the EU?
The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
1. The single market. The concept of it is brilliant. The elimination (broadly) of restrictions on flow of people, goods, cash and services. It's pure capitalism.The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
Shame the application is anything but, with uncompetitive industries protected by import tariffs, and even "maximum product standards"!
2. Restrictions on state aid. Brilliant - keeps the socialists and communists at bay. It's why Corbyn wants out.
Again, in principle superb. In practice it's yet another rule that's broadly ignored. That's excluding the "state aid" of protectionist tariffs and non tariff barriers.
Not much else I'm afraid. Which is why I couldn't bring myself to vote either way in 2016. Hate the EU but love the 4 freedoms.
Sway said:
oyster said:
digimeistter said:
I have yet to hear any positives FOR staying in the EU?
The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
1. The single market. The concept of it is brilliant. The elimination (broadly) of restrictions on flow of people, goods, cash and services. It's pure capitalism.The whole change from within is never going to happen, so come on Remainers, convince us?
Shame the application is anything but, with uncompetitive industries protected by import tariffs, and even "maximum product standards"!
2. Restrictions on state aid. Brilliant - keeps the socialists and communists at bay. It's why Corbyn wants out.
Again, in principle superb. In practice it's yet another rule that's broadly ignored. That's excluding the "state aid" of protectionist tariffs and non tariff barriers.
Not much else I'm afraid. Which is why I couldn't bring myself to vote either way in 2016. Hate the EU but love the 4 freedoms.
Your comment on state aid is irrelevant. And again, Brexit won't solve it.
christian-ohtc3 said:
I heard that rumour last year directly from a Government Minister - and not just any Minister, but one that should know... Still might be b
ks, but it has a whiff of credibility about it. andymadmak said:
christian-ohtc3 said:
I heard that rumour last year directly from a Government Minister - and not just any Minister, but one that should know... Still might be b
ks, but it has a whiff of credibility about it. Alastair MacMillan said:
“I propose that we aim for a trade agreement covering all sectors and with zero tariffs on goods” – Donald Tusk, President of the European Council, 16th March 2018 The above sentiments have in the last week been echoed by the EU’s Chief Negotiator, Michel Barnier. Yet the UK Government continues to cling to its complex and flawed Chequers plan. Instead they should be grabbing the golden key being offered by the EU.
Vanden Saab said:
andymadmak said:
christian-ohtc3 said:
I heard that rumour last year directly from a Government Minister - and not just any Minister, but one that should know... Still might be b
ks, but it has a whiff of credibility about it. Alastair MacMillan said:
“I propose that we aim for a trade agreement covering all sectors and with zero tariffs on goods” – Donald Tusk, President of the European Council, 16th March 2018 The above sentiments have in the last week been echoed by the EU’s Chief Negotiator, Michel Barnier. Yet the UK Government continues to cling to its complex and flawed Chequers plan. Instead they should be grabbing the golden key being offered by the EU.
jsf said:
Vanden Saab said:
andymadmak said:
christian-ohtc3 said:
I heard that rumour last year directly from a Government Minister - and not just any Minister, but one that should know... Still might be b
ks, but it has a whiff of credibility about it. Alastair MacMillan said:
“I propose that we aim for a trade agreement covering all sectors and with zero tariffs on goods” – Donald Tusk, President of the European Council, 16th March 2018 The above sentiments have in the last week been echoed by the EU’s Chief Negotiator, Michel Barnier. Yet the UK Government continues to cling to its complex and flawed Chequers plan. Instead they should be grabbing the golden key being offered by the EU.
Not according to the article I linked...
christian-ohtc3 said:
It’s true that Steve Baker is saying it.It’s not true that it was deliverable, as it did not fix the NI issue, and was around the time Davis was making his unrealistic mutual recognition of standards offer which was obviously never going to be acceptable to the EU.
Steve Baker is just trying to write history as if he has done nothing wrong and has not been proven to have misjudged the whole EU negotiation with all his promises exposed as completely flawed and erroneous.
It’s pretty obvious he will never bring himself to admit that so it’s also fairly easy to see why he is peddling this particular fantasy. He knows that many want to hear what he is saying. The express know that is what their readers want to read, it brings comfort that “it could have been so good if it was not for that remainer May”.
If it was that good and that easy with the EU, why would May not have done it? Simple - it was a unicorn.
DeepEnd said:
It’s true that Steve Baker is saying it.
It’s not true that it was deliverable, as it did not fix the NI issue, and was around the time Davis was making his unrealistic mutual recognition of standards offer which was obviously never going to be acceptable to the EU.
Steve Baker is just trying to write history as if he has done nothing wrong and has not been proven to have misjudged the whole EU negotiation with all his promises exposed as completely flawed and erroneous.
It’s pretty obvious he will never bring himself to admit that so it’s also fairly easy to see why he is peddling this particular fantasy. He knows that many want to hear what he is saying. The express know that is what their readers want to read, it brings comfort that “it could have been so good if it was not for that remainer May”.
If it was that good and that easy with the EU, why would May not have done it? Simple - it was a unicorn.
You realise you are confirming that the Backstop will be in place for ever don't you? Rather than being temporary until a FTA is agreed...It’s not true that it was deliverable, as it did not fix the NI issue, and was around the time Davis was making his unrealistic mutual recognition of standards offer which was obviously never going to be acceptable to the EU.
Steve Baker is just trying to write history as if he has done nothing wrong and has not been proven to have misjudged the whole EU negotiation with all his promises exposed as completely flawed and erroneous.
It’s pretty obvious he will never bring himself to admit that so it’s also fairly easy to see why he is peddling this particular fantasy. He knows that many want to hear what he is saying. The express know that is what their readers want to read, it brings comfort that “it could have been so good if it was not for that remainer May”.
If it was that good and that easy with the EU, why would May not have done it? Simple - it was a unicorn.
DeepEnd said:
christian-ohtc3 said:
It’s true that Steve Baker is saying it.It’s not true that it was deliverable, as it did not fix the NI issue, and was around the time Davis was making his unrealistic mutual recognition of standards offer which was obviously never going to be acceptable to the EU.
Steve Baker is just trying to write history as if he has done nothing wrong and has not been proven to have misjudged the whole EU negotiation with all his promises exposed as completely flawed and erroneous.
It’s pretty obvious he will never bring himself to admit that so it’s also fairly easy to see why he is peddling this particular fantasy. He knows that many want to hear what he is saying. The express know that is what their readers want to read, it brings comfort that “it could have been so good if it was not for that remainer May”.
If it was that good and that easy with the EU, why would May not have done it? Simple - it was a unicorn.
https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-rel...
DeepEnd said:
christian-ohtc3 said:
It’s true that Steve Baker is saying it.It’s not true that it was deliverable, as it did not fix the NI issue, and was around the time Davis was making his unrealistic mutual recognition of standards offer which was obviously never going to be acceptable to the EU.
Steve Baker is just trying to write history as if he has done nothing wrong and has not been proven to have misjudged the whole EU negotiation with all his promises exposed as completely flawed and erroneous.
It’s pretty obvious he will never bring himself to admit that so it’s also fairly easy to see why he is peddling this particular fantasy. He knows that many want to hear what he is saying. The express know that is what their readers want to read, it brings comfort that “it could have been so good if it was not for that remainer May”.
If it was that good and that easy with the EU, why would May not have done it? Simple - it was a unicorn.
The Norway/Sweden customs processing approach was "impossible" prior - no one else had done anything like it at the time. Difference being, it was something both sides wanted to sort, and they put their best efforts in creating as frictionless as possible a customs process based on the technology available at the time.
Time, and technology, have moved on. The EU and RoI have never once accepted that any solution to the Irish border requires two solutions - one on the UK border, one on the RoI border.
They've acknowledged they weaponised the border. From the documentary, I have my suspicions that Verhofstadt's visit was orchestrated by his two Irish aides - as some of the things shown and discussed are patently untrue.
All this despite the BA not having a single reference to goods controls at the border. They did for human controls, despite a then 70 year old Treaty being in force with no sign of it being rescinded.
Red Devil said:
The last time there was such a divided government was in the 3 years prior to the outbreak of WW1.
The Conservatives risk suffering the same fate as the Liberal party which has never been in power since.
There is interesting parallel with those times. The Liberals were in coalition with the IPP which demanded Home Rule.
The Conservatives have had to get into bed with the DUP since the 2017 GE.
Yet again Ireland is the elephant in the room of UK politics.
I wouldn't call the end of the Tories so soon - look at the state Labour were in the last time they left power and just before the last election.The Conservatives risk suffering the same fate as the Liberal party which has never been in power since.
There is interesting parallel with those times. The Liberals were in coalition with the IPP which demanded Home Rule.
The Conservatives have had to get into bed with the DUP since the 2017 GE.
Yet again Ireland is the elephant in the room of UK politics.
They left a crippled economy and had a hugely unpopular and illegal war hanging around their neck. More recently they were rock bottom in the opinion polls, yet here they are again, seemingly with rising popularity.
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