Jeremy Corbyn Vol. 2
Discussion
Leroy902 said:
Bias against the Labour Party, and pro tories!? Surely not!. It'll throw the theories 99% of people have on here out of the window!
NOIt's the WRONG type of Labour. The older err New Labour was great for the people your referring to. They were the clever types. This NEW old old Labour isn't what they wanted. Remember the clever types thought it would "widen the debate" "ask full questions" if they sanctioned/ stamped Corbys application papers. He was never expected to win.
The clever types were so very very clever that not only did they invite the stranger in for a meal, they gave him their house keys and moved into the garage
techiedave said:
Leroy902 said:
Bias against the Labour Party, and pro tories!? Surely not!. It'll throw the theories 99% of people have on here out of the window!
NOIt's the WRONG type of Labour.
For a while now, on my facefart feed, I've been signed up to "The People vs The Tory Government" if only to gauge alternative views and not exist in a confirmation bias "bubble". Make no mistake, much of it is specious and poisonous with many posts preceded by #toriesarecancer (which is difficult to deal with when my Dad passed away recently from the disease).
But, yes, it would appear that Blairite Labour was the "wrong" type of Labour as the FB feed I mention above is equally as scathing of Blair as it is of the current Government.
Russian Troll Bot said:
If they can produce photos of JRM giving a speech in front of the Nazi flag, and him appointing the previous leader of the British Nazi Party to a senior position, they would have a point.
It's a mystery why we (that is the majority liberal west), quite rightly, vehimently reject Nazism, ex-Nazis and sympathisers yet tolerate Communists, 'ex-communists' and their apologists. Both are failed ideologies that invariably lead to brutal repression, mass murder and abject misery for millions. Time we as a society stopped tolerating these fvcking idiots and started holding them in the same contempt we do Nazis.Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 19th March 00:00
For a pacifist he's got some incredibly violent people he calls friends.esxste said:
Did he hate his country when he opposed the Iraq war?
He's a pacifist, and has always been so. It's a cheap tactic to accuse him of being a traitor just because he doesn't fall in line the moment the war drums start up.
He's right to be questioning the Prime Minister and her Government on this. It's been mis-handled, and its not good enough that the Leader of the Opposition should be told to shut up and blindly support the Government.
Missed this at the timeHe's a pacifist, and has always been so. It's a cheap tactic to accuse him of being a traitor just because he doesn't fall in line the moment the war drums start up.
He's right to be questioning the Prime Minister and her Government on this. It's been mis-handled, and its not good enough that the Leader of the Opposition should be told to shut up and blindly support the Government.
if he is indeed a pacifist then I take it he is vehemently opposed to the Russian annexation of the Crimea, or the Syrian government imposing control on the rest of the country by force, or the violent campaigns of the IRA, Hamas and Hezbelloh?
He is not in fact a pacifist he merely opposes any attempt by a western country to defend its interests, which is something very different.
Their is a long tradition on the far left of supporting an enemy of the country as part of opposing the establishment. It was there when France was under control of the Jacobites and there when we faced soviet Russia.
Do not mistake disarming ourselves to allow free reign to the enemies of the west for pacifism.
fblm said:
Russian Troll Bot said:
If they can produce photos of JRM giving a speech in front of the Nazi flag, and him appointing the previous leader of the British Nazi Party to a senior position, they would have a point.
It's a mystery why we (that is the majority liberal west), quite rightly, vehimently reject Nazism, ex-Nazis and sympathisers yet tolerate Communists, 'ex-communists' and their apologists. Both are failed ideologies that invariably lead to brutal repression, mass murder and abject misery for millions. Time we as a society stopped tolerating these fvcking idiots and started holding them in the same contempt we do Nazis.Stalin ended up as an ally in WWII. Russia was instrumental in us winning the war (or perhaps, attacking Russia was the mistake that lost Hitler the war). As such, it was difficult to paint our ally as a brutal dictatorship that rivalled (and in some ways exceeded) the disgusting Nazi regime. Mao never really directly bumped up against our interests (except through proxy wars in South East Asia). So we never fought either directly as we did with the Nazis.
However, in the competition for who deliberately killed more of their own people, the communists are run away winners. I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
Murph7355 said:
Russian Troll Bot said:
It's been photoshopped to make his hat look darker. Bias confirmed!
It's been 'shopped but it looks more like to make the overall picture of him blend with the background better. I'm not convinced the actual type of hat makes him look less like a trot' 
Got know what sort of bias that shows.
KingNothing said:
AstonZagato said:
I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
Because what's been tried in the past is not real communisim according to everyone I've ever seen try champion it in the modern day 
They threaten the media and individuals when taken to task now, when they have no power. Just imagine what they'd be like if they ever got into power!
Edited by chris watton on Monday 19th March 10:13
chris watton said:
KingNothing said:
AstonZagato said:
I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
Because what's been tried in the past is not real communisim according to everyone I've ever seen try champion it in the modern day They threaten the media and individuals when taken to task now, when they have no power. Just imagine what they'd be like if they every got into power!
Russian Troll Bot said:
chris watton said:
KingNothing said:
AstonZagato said:
I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
Because what's been tried in the past is not real communisim according to everyone I've ever seen try champion it in the modern day They threaten the media and individuals when taken to task now, when they have no power. Just imagine what they'd be like if they every got into power!
The Internet said:
12. Did the Nazis plan to murder the Jews from the beginning of their regime?
Answer: This question is one of the most difficult to answer. While Hitler made several references to killing Jews, both in his early writings (Mein Kampf) and in various speeches during the 1930s, it is fairly certain that the Nazis had no operative plan for the systematic annihilation of the Jews before 1941. The decision on the systematic murder of the Jews was apparently made in the late winter or the early spring of 1941 in conjunction with the decision to invade the Soviet Union.
Still, it's obviously absolutely fine that 68 million people died under Communism if it wasn't intended. Accidents happen. Answer: This question is one of the most difficult to answer. While Hitler made several references to killing Jews, both in his early writings (Mein Kampf) and in various speeches during the 1930s, it is fairly certain that the Nazis had no operative plan for the systematic annihilation of the Jews before 1941. The decision on the systematic murder of the Jews was apparently made in the late winter or the early spring of 1941 in conjunction with the decision to invade the Soviet Union.
Fastdruid said:
Still, it's obviously absolutely fine that 68 million people died under Communism if it wasn't intended. Accidents happen.
As I pointed out to them, I'm sure all the millions of people lined up against the wall in the purges, thrown in the gulags to starve or made to clear mines with their bare hands were really thankful that it hadn't been the plan in 1917.Fastdruid said:
Russian Troll Bot said:
chris watton said:
KingNothing said:
AstonZagato said:
I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
Because what's been tried in the past is not real communisim according to everyone I've ever seen try champion it in the modern day They threaten the media and individuals when taken to task now, when they have no power. Just imagine what they'd be like if they every got into power!
The Internet said:
12. Did the Nazis plan to murder the Jews from the beginning of their regime?
Answer: This question is one of the most difficult to answer. While Hitler made several references to killing Jews, both in his early writings (Mein Kampf) and in various speeches during the 1930s, it is fairly certain that the Nazis had no operative plan for the systematic annihilation of the Jews before 1941. The decision on the systematic murder of the Jews was apparently made in the late winter or the early spring of 1941 in conjunction with the decision to invade the Soviet Union.
Still, it's obviously absolutely fine that 68 million people died under Communism if it wasn't intended. Accidents happen. Answer: This question is one of the most difficult to answer. While Hitler made several references to killing Jews, both in his early writings (Mein Kampf) and in various speeches during the 1930s, it is fairly certain that the Nazis had no operative plan for the systematic annihilation of the Jews before 1941. The decision on the systematic murder of the Jews was apparently made in the late winter or the early spring of 1941 in conjunction with the decision to invade the Soviet Union.
IMO Communism (and maybe national socialism) are excuses for governments to be evil, not the reason why governments are evil.
I don't want this country to become communist or national socialist, but I am also not as daft as many on here to think that would turn me into a mass murderer.
Seriously would you guys get a f
king grip!AstonZagato said:
fblm said:
Russian Troll Bot said:
If they can produce photos of JRM giving a speech in front of the Nazi flag, and him appointing the previous leader of the British Nazi Party to a senior position, they would have a point.
It's a mystery why we (that is the majority liberal west), quite rightly, vehimently reject Nazism, ex-Nazis and sympathisers yet tolerate Communists, 'ex-communists' and their apologists. Both are failed ideologies that invariably lead to brutal repression, mass murder and abject misery for millions. Time we as a society stopped tolerating these fvcking idiots and started holding them in the same contempt we do Nazis.Stalin ended up as an ally in WWII. Russia was instrumental in us winning the war (or perhaps, attacking Russia was the mistake that lost Hitler the war). As such, it was difficult to paint our ally as a brutal dictatorship that rivalled (and in some ways exceeded) the disgusting Nazi regime. Mao never really directly bumped up against our interests (except through proxy wars in South East Asia). So we never fought either directly as we did with the Nazis.
However, in the competition for who deliberately killed more of their own people, the communists are run away winners. I'm not sure why any educated person would consider communism as anything other than a murderous ideology.
irocfan said:
Indeed, a point I have made on many occasions. I guess that the one thing that the nazis had was the whole 'racial purity' thing to kill for. The communists were far more even handed and just killed anyone who disagreed with them!
We can already witness a more moderate take on that today, due to the growing cancer that is cultural Marxism (which I think has now gone too far, meaning this ideology is winning, regrettably). Have you noticed anyone who disagrees and puts up a coherent argument against these loons are labelled, in effect de-humanising their opponents. When in power, what is the purpose of this tactic and how does it always end, historically?We have allowed ourselves to sleepwalk into this, and I cannot see a way out, not peacefully anyway - which would never happen in our lifetimes.
Efbe said:
Just because the USA drops nuclear bombs on japan doesn't make democracy bad. It only applies to that government/regime.
IMO Communism (and maybe national socialism) are excuses for governments to be evil, not the reason why governments are evil.
I don't want this country to become communist or national socialist, but I am also not as daft as many on here to think that would turn me into a mass murderer.
Seriously would you guys get a fking grip!
The hole in this argument is that the ideology (whether fascism or communism) requires that there is no dissent. Therefore, anyone who threatens the ideology needs to be 'dealt with' in some way: re-education, labour camps, prison, execution. It is a slippery slope.IMO Communism (and maybe national socialism) are excuses for governments to be evil, not the reason why governments are evil.
I don't want this country to become communist or national socialist, but I am also not as daft as many on here to think that would turn me into a mass murderer.
Seriously would you guys get a f
king grip!And I don't think anyone is saying that being a communist or fascist makes that individual a murderer. However, their support for a regime has, almost without exception, led to the persecution of large parts of their own people (notwithstanding the economic hardship).
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