Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 8

[hutchst]

I think the English will carry on buying their's in Calais.

[TheRainMaker]

Garvin said:

However, the rUK desire for good quality single malts might prove to be rUK’s undoing

If the price goes up by 20%, I wouldn’t be so sure.

[simoid]

TheRainMaker said:

If the price goes up by 20%, I wouldn’t be so sure.

Some lovely Japanese malts these days.

[Evercross]

simoid said:

TheRainMaker said:

If the price goes up by 20%, I wouldn’t be so sure.

Some lovely Japanese malts these days.

[simoid]

warch said:

I do wish Scotland well in any future direction it choses to take but it is a risk that in gaining freedom Scotland may well end up less free than it is under the current arrangement. Small countries are fair games for sharks from much bigger nations coming in. I doubt Scotland would be happy with typical American anti-Union and hire 'em and fire 'em business practices.

Chinese embassy appears to be coordinating efforts to curb academic freedom, say MPs

And small countries’ universities dependent on income from foreign students would have greater difficulty in these sorts of issues.

[Welshbeef]

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

[Earthdweller]

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

Ok

The SNP want to remove the nuclear shield from a country they don’t want to be part of

And it’s about 50k jobs supported by Trident in Scotland

[andy_s]

Welshbeef said:

Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

An independent Scotland would spend 4 years negotiating a mutually beneficial and mutually agreeable deal with rUK that would end up being about the same as the one we have now but without the Barnett formula and with some not inconsiderable expense to duplicate certain bodies.

By this stage we will be struck by the strange combination of the nationalist obsessionals and the equally disgruntled unionists hacking each other to bits while the majority will ruefully swill their Scotch condemning the political class for their ignominious behaviour.

Far fetched I know...

[Welshbeef]

Earthdweller said:

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

Ok

The SNP want to remove the nuclear shield from a country they don’t want to be part of

And it’s about 50k jobs supported by Trident in Scotland

50,000 jobs and I’d wager of the higher than average salary variety .


I read a stat recently that the Scottish workforce is notably above 50% public sector - specifically with a proportion of those carrying out public sector work for the entire U.K. clearly come a split those jobs would instantly be redundant.

[glazbagun]

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

SNP in "make impossible demand" shocker. Then they can spend the next five years whinging about Westminster not giving them what they asked for whilst enjoying the benefits, no different to the UKIP/BP lot in the EU parliament. Parasites.

[rossub]

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

Jesus Christ, this lot really need putting back in their box.

Giving up the nuclear deterrent the way things are with Russia and China? Really?

Planet Zog is calling - it wants it’s missing citizens back.

[NickUSA]

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

Can't see CND's Vice President objecting to scrapping trident

[anonymous-user]

Welshbeef said:

SNP will demand labour scrap trident plus give them the right to a vote if they want SNP support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/10/sn...


How many jobs directly and indirectly does this industry give Scptland?
Also if Scotland did become independent do they not realise (just like Kaliningrad) it would be retained part of RUK.

That's all fine...because it's not going to happen,

[Edinburger]

simoid said:

Edinburger said:

I was working in London for a few days this week and a few colleagues were asking about this. Their opinion was that the Scots should get another independence referendum because we voted to remain part of the UK within Europe and that's about to change.

Hard to argue with them.

Not really difficult.

That was a known risk when we voted in our once in a lifetime referendum. Just like oil revenues collapsing, Salmond turning out to be a bare faced liar, Trump getting in and taxing hell out of Whisky, etc. We took the risk that we wouldn’t agree with everything that happened whether we were in or out of UK.

Well, that's subjective.

[Edinburger]

Scotty2 said:

When they are going on about letting 16 year old and Non-UK Citizens have a vote, will they now include ex-pat Scots? Or will they not allow that in case they don't vote the correct way...

As an Ex-Pat Scot myself I also get wound up every time wee Nippy, or Ian Balloonford say "The People of Scotland....." They should be reminded that they represent SOME of the people of Scotland and by no means all !

AND it was a UK wide vote on the EU. The UK in or the UK out, not Dumfries in and Ayrshire out type lottery.

Why should expats get a vote? You made a choice to leave Scotland so why should you have a say in its politics?

Before you get all uppity in your response, I lived overseas for four years (in Hong Kong) and at no point then did I ever think I should have any say in what was happening back home.

[Edinburger]

Earthdweller said:

Edinburger said:

feef said:

Edinburger said:

Welshbeef said:

Edinburger said:

Seriously? I’d expect better from you.

Tell me why you think Welsh, English and Notthern Irish students should qualify for free university education in Scotland.

Because you give it free to ROI and any other country in the EU.

Burger this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union period.

The natural question is if we’re all in the auK given the same tax fund to spend what are you not spending on to get free uni places? (You’ll not be able to answer it though as the answer is you spend way more than you take and the other parts of the auK pay for it...).

What do you mean "...this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union"?

Really? Are English and Welsh students and parents up in arms about this? Really?

Are they equally enraged that we don't pay for bridges and prescriptions?

I'm not sure what you mean by "the same tax fund" but a lot of people in Scotland pay higher rates of tax than elsewhere in the UK and we benefit from 'free' stuff.

TBH around where I live (cambs) I've yet to meet an English person who already knows that Scotland has free higher and further education and free prescriptions. When I mention it, they think it's a great idea.

Thanks for sharing that.

I think “free” education is wonderful.. I think “free” prescriptions are wonderful

Except they are not “free” someone has to pay

I’d like council tax abolished.. and water rates ... and maybe Road Fund Licence, because they don’t spent it on roads ..

In fact “free” stuff is great ..... but it isn’t free

Bang on. Nothing is free. Many rUK people look on in envy at our "free" bridges, "free prescriptions", "free university", etc., but many of us pay higher rates of income tax to subsidise those "freebies".

[Edinburger]

Welshbeef said:

Edinburger said:

feef said:

Edinburger said:

Welshbeef said:

Edinburger said:

Seriously? I’d expect better from you.

Tell me why you think Welsh, English and Notthern Irish students should qualify for free university education in Scotland.

Because you give it free to ROI and any other country in the EU.

Burger this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union period.

The natural question is if we’re all in the auK given the same tax fund to spend what are you not spending on to get free uni places? (You’ll not be able to answer it though as the answer is you spend way more than you take and the other parts of the auK pay for it...).

What do you mean "...this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union"?

Really? Are English and Welsh students and parents up in arms about this? Really?

Are they equally enraged that we don't pay for bridges and prescriptions?

I'm not sure what you mean by "the same tax fund" but a lot of people in Scotland pay higher rates of tax than elsewhere in the UK and we benefit from 'free' stuff.

TBH around where I live (cambs) I've yet to meet an English person who already knows that Scotland has free higher and further education and free prescriptions. When I mention it, they think it's a great idea.

Thanks for sharing that.

I agree it’s a great idea. Why not out the whole UK on it and at the same time reduce some provinces funding in the vein of fairness.

Free persctiptions is a very tight wing policy Harmon the poor for the benenfit of the wealthy.
Free education from a capped pot is again a right wing policy as it saps finding from lower levels of education plus its capped so who misses out? Again free for all .... wealthy folk love these right wing SNP

I think you need to take this up with your MP. if I understood your points, which wasn't easy.

[Edinburger]

REALIST123 said:

Welshbeef said:

Edinburger said:

feef said:

Edinburger said:

Welshbeef said:

Edinburger said:

Seriously? I’d expect better from you.

Tell me why you think Welsh, English and Notthern Irish students should qualify for free university education in Scotland.

Because you give it free to ROI and any other country in the EU.

Burger this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union period.

The natural question is if we’re all in the auK given the same tax fund to spend what are you not spending on to get free uni places? (You’ll not be able to answer it though as the answer is you spend way more than you take and the other parts of the auK pay for it...).

What do you mean "...this is a policy that really does damage relations within our Union"?

Really? Are English and Welsh students and parents up in arms about this? Really?

Are they equally enraged that we don't pay for bridges and prescriptions?

I'm not sure what you mean by "the same tax fund" but a lot of people in Scotland pay higher rates of tax than elsewhere in the UK and we benefit from 'free' stuff.

TBH around where I live (cambs) I've yet to meet an English person who already knows that Scotland has free higher and further education and free prescriptions. When I mention it, they think it's a great idea.

Thanks for sharing that.

I agree it’s a great idea. Why not out the whole UK on it and at the same time reduce some provinces funding in the vein of fairness.

Free persctiptions is a very tight wing policy Harmon the poor for the benenfit of the wealthy.
Free education from a capped pot is again a right wing policy as it saps finding from lower levels of education plus its capped so who misses out? Again free for all .... wealthy folk love these right wing SNP

Could you read through that and edit it into English, Welshbeef.......

Exactly

[Edinburger]

Welshbeef said:

REALIST123 said:

Could you read through that and edit it into English, Welshbeef.......

Sure.

The Scottish position is a farce and utterly unfair to other parts of the U.K.

Why?

You understand the principle of devolution, I assume?

[Edinburger]

amgmcqueen said:

Edinburger said:

simoid said:

Edinburger said:

simoid said:

Edinburger said:

Before any future independence referendum, we need a robust analysis of iScotland's projected economy in the first X years.

That will let Scottish voters make an informed choice and hopefully prevent people posting offensive guff like this,

In my view, that’s a horrendous waste of money. We shouldn’t ever need to do such a thing because we’ve had our referendum.

If someone’s really wanted independence they should have done that the first time round. Clearly the reality was that it would be a vote loser if they were honest in their financial appraisal, and they’d be ripped to shreds if their figures were questionable.

Perhaps. But everything has changed. And we now need to make informed choices.

Nothing has changed.

SNP still dragging their support by the distant independence carrot.

Leaving the UK still means leaving the EU too. We chose to remain in the UK and as a UK we have chosen to leave the EU. All of that was foreseeable. Alex Salmond warned us about it but we still chose the UK.

I was working in London for a few days this week and a few colleagues were asking about this. Their opinion was that the Scots should get another independence referendum because we voted to remain part of the UK within Europe and that's about to change.

Hard to argue with them.

Except it makes no sense because if you vote yes to 'independence' you will also be out of the EU. Scotland does not meet the criteria to re-join. Your deficit is 7% propped up by the rest of the UK, the EU does not want or need another basket case economy on life support.

The EU/Brexit topic is the last barrel scrapping attempt from the SNP to have another once in a lifetime referendum. They have no shame, I feel sorry for the hard working people of Scotland who have to put up with such crap.

No, it's not. Leaving the EU is a fundamental change to what some Scots voted to remain part of in 2014. And more Scots voted to remain the EU so this should be revisited.