Teacher decapitated in Paris by enraged parent.
Discussion
I've posted this before.
Brigitte Gabriel nails it - time and time again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Z_RAbOJcu0
There are 1.2 Billion plus Muslims in the world.
It doesn't matter if 99% of them are peaceful.
They are irrelevant.
Just 19 Muslims took the biggest Superpower on the planet to its knees within a couple of hours
As long as the teaching in that book has not changed - nothing will change.
Finsbury Mosque.
Surely Thousands of Muslims who worship there must have thought. "That Imam is just fecking nuts.....And these books look a bit dodgy... Must report this"
Brigitte Gabriel nails it - time and time again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Z_RAbOJcu0
There are 1.2 Billion plus Muslims in the world.
It doesn't matter if 99% of them are peaceful.
They are irrelevant.
Just 19 Muslims took the biggest Superpower on the planet to its knees within a couple of hours
As long as the teaching in that book has not changed - nothing will change.
Finsbury Mosque.
Surely Thousands of Muslims who worship there must have thought. "That Imam is just fecking nuts.....And these books look a bit dodgy... Must report this"
t and report you to the managers.mrporsche said:
That may well be the case, but is it unislamic , is there anything in the scriptures or interpretations thereof.that could lead muslims to believe that islam is a political and social force that is perfect ?
There was an egyptian scholar / politician, cant remember his name but it had a "q" in it, wrote a couple of books saying that if you lived under sharia you didnt need laws and government as it was so perfect it did all of that .
Not all muslims want to live under sharia, but the most perfect man ever would not have invented the most perfect way to live if muslims were not live by it.
This is so disjointed and waffle-like I can't discern anything meaningful from it.There was an egyptian scholar / politician, cant remember his name but it had a "q" in it, wrote a couple of books saying that if you lived under sharia you didnt need laws and government as it was so perfect it did all of that .
Not all muslims want to live under sharia, but the most perfect man ever would not have invented the most perfect way to live if muslims were not live by it.
The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
jamoor said:
You've proven my point again.
I think all muslims should be subjected to this test by the state and if they don't answer correctly they get a black star instead of a green one.
You're engaging in bad faith. I'm unsurprised.I think all muslims should be subjected to this test by the state and if they don't answer correctly they get a black star instead of a green one.
Until and unless moderates who recognise the book must not be taken literally start publicly and loudly attempting to push Islam towards a refomation, we won't move forward.
If you cannot say that you would do any of the things I suggested then either you don't agree that parts of the book should be ignored, or you fear retribution from literalists and Islamists who think those who insult the prophet should be killed.
It's really simple and frankly shows you in a poor light that you cannot stand yourself apart from Islamists and literalists.
I feel I've taken my engagement with you as far as it can go. It's been demonstrative. Thank you.
You are welcome to the final word.
Sam.M said:
This is so disjointed and waffle-like I can't discern anything meaningful from it.
The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
Yes but those aspects you don’t like are part of the religion. The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
Sam.M said:
You're engaging in bad faith. I'm unsurprised.
Until and unless moderates who recognise the book must not be taken literally start publicly and loudly attempting to push Islam towards a refomation, we won't move forward.
If you cannot say that you would do any of the things I suggested then either you don't agree that parts of the book should be ignored, or you fear retribution from literalists and Islamists who think those who insult the prophet should be killed.
It's really simple and frankly shows you in a poor light that you cannot stand yourself apart from Islamists and literalists.
I feel I've taken my engagement with you as far as it can go. It's been demonstrative. Thank you.
You are welcome to the final word.
You just keep proving your point, that I wholeheartedly agree with again and again.Until and unless moderates who recognise the book must not be taken literally start publicly and loudly attempting to push Islam towards a refomation, we won't move forward.
If you cannot say that you would do any of the things I suggested then either you don't agree that parts of the book should be ignored, or you fear retribution from literalists and Islamists who think those who insult the prophet should be killed.
It's really simple and frankly shows you in a poor light that you cannot stand yourself apart from Islamists and literalists.
I feel I've taken my engagement with you as far as it can go. It's been demonstrative. Thank you.
You are welcome to the final word.
Everyone is the victim here apart from the attackers.
We should ensure all Muslims are checked to see if they are moderates and label them accordingly.
fesuvious said:
Jamoor,
You genuinely can't answer those questions can you? Or even just one?
You're starting to validate concerns over Taqqiya. Not too mention validate opinion of Islam being considered greater than country.
It's not difficult. We know you consider yourself Muslim.
Where do you stand on those questions?
See what I mean?You genuinely can't answer those questions can you? Or even just one?
You're starting to validate concerns over Taqqiya. Not too mention validate opinion of Islam being considered greater than country.
It's not difficult. We know you consider yourself Muslim.
Where do you stand on those questions?
I think I’m more concerned if you can’t see my point. It’s very telling.
Sam.M said:
This is so disjointed and waffle-like I can't discern anything meaningful from it.
The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
What you appear to be saying is that Muslims can live in the U.K. and Europe and practise their faith, but only if you follow these verses.The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
If you follow these other verses we will deem you an extremist muslim and there is no place in our country for you.
That is just unworkable.
mrporsche said:
Sam.M said:
This is so disjointed and waffle-like I can't discern anything meaningful from it.
The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
What you appear to be saying is that Muslims can live in the U.K. and Europe and practise their faith, but only if you follow these verses.The issue here is simple. Either people stand apart from Islamists and literalists, or they carry water for them in their silence or worse, their overt public support for medieval ideas.
If you follow these other verses we will deem you an extremist muslim and there is no place in our country for you.
That is just unworkable.
You have to have it all.
Getragdogleg said:
So to take that to its logical conclusion Islam in the West is unworkable.
You have to have it all.
That maybe the logical conclusion.You have to have it all.
The plan can’t be to tell them they can only follow 50% of the word of god. Many in Europe do of their own choosing, but many don’t.
As there is no pope equivalent, who is going to compile the list of parts they can follow and those they can’t ?
Sharia is not just about chopping hands off it also references charity prayer and fasting, but somebody is going to have to go through the rules/laws and pick out the ones we like and ones we don’t .
They will also have to consider ancient scriptures / opinions and interpretations, and try to avoid being killed for blasphemy.
It’s not a job I would relish.
mrporsche said:
What you appear to be saying is that Muslims can live in the U.K. and Europe and practise their faith, but only if you follow these verses.
If you follow these other verses we will deem you an extremist muslim and there is no place in our country for you.
That is just unworkable.
The Abrahamic older brothers of Islam, Christianity and Judaism, stand as avatars disproving your assertion. If you follow these other verses we will deem you an extremist muslim and there is no place in our country for you.
That is just unworkable.
Islam is like an immature teenager, who's not yet gained enough life experience to recognise that certain aspects of the faith are unacceptable in an adult world.
As I said to Jamoor, until and unless moderates who recognise the book must not be taken literally start publicly and loudly attempting to push Islam towards a refomation, we won't move forward.
I'm not advocating labelling anyone, and Jamoor won't like this, but the reality is our security services already label Muslims because far far too many have sympathy for or worse, act on the worst aspects of the faith. That is simply pragmatic reality.
I'm saying it's on Muslims all over the west who believe that certain verses should be ignored to take up the mantle and attempt to reform Islam.
Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 21st November 09:52
fesuvious said:
Jamoor only has to respond with
'you can depict Mohammed, Jesus or any other 'prophet' in as strip club driinking neat JD and getting blown by a doorman for all I care'
t
Excactomundo.'you can depict Mohammed, Jesus or any other 'prophet' in as strip club driinking neat JD and getting blown by a doorman for all I care'
t
They all need to be checked and starred accordingly.
This is almost like a scene out of Borat.
Edited by jamoor on Saturday 21st November 09:55
Sam.M said:
As I said to Jamoor, until and unless moderates who recognise the book must not be taken literally start publicly and loudly attempting to push Islam towards a refomation, we won't move forward.
I have to go and rake leaves in a moment, but ...Edited by Sam.M on Saturday 21st November 09:47
Those that take the book literally are good Muslims, living to the word, the life Mohammed laid down for them, which came directly for god himself.
They are not extremists, just Muslims, the scriptures may well be out of date but I don’t think that matters.
The concept of moderates appears to mean people that don’t live their life to the word of god.
They can try and to push for a reformation, but there is zero chance of that happening, and it would entail rewriting the word of god leaving sections out.
mrporsche said:
I have to go and rake leaves in a moment, but ...
Those that take the book literally are good Muslims, living to the word, the life Mohammed laid down for them, which came directly for god himself.
They are not extremists, just Muslims, the scriptures may well be out of date but I don’t think that matters.
The concept of moderates appears to mean people that don’t live their life to the word of god.
They can try and to push for a reformation, but there is zero chance of that happening, and it would entail rewriting the word of god leaving sections out.
Believing the word of god is one thing. Acting on it is quite another. Those that take the book literally are good Muslims, living to the word, the life Mohammed laid down for them, which came directly for god himself.
They are not extremists, just Muslims, the scriptures may well be out of date but I don’t think that matters.
The concept of moderates appears to mean people that don’t live their life to the word of god.
They can try and to push for a reformation, but there is zero chance of that happening, and it would entail rewriting the word of god leaving sections out.
It's fine to believe that insulting the prophet is wrong.
It's not fine to kill someone for insulting the prophet.
If that needle cannot be threaded by the majority of the Umma, we're in for more death.
jamoor said:
fesuvious said:
Jamoor only has to respond with
'you can depict Mohammed, Jesus or any other 'prophet' in as strip club driinking neat JD and getting blown by a doorman for all I care'
t
Excactomundo.'you can depict Mohammed, Jesus or any other 'prophet' in as strip club driinking neat JD and getting blown by a doorman for all I care'
t
They all need to be checked and starred accordingly.
This is almost like a scene out of Borat.
Edited by jamoor on Saturday 21st November 09:55
As predicted.
Never an answer just more obfuscation.
I'm beginning to think jamoor is an AI or a wind up. Its one of the two. The posts and contributions are not honest.
Getragdogleg said:
See, tumbleweed.
As predicted.
Never an answer just more obfuscation.
I'm beginning to think jamoor is an AI or a wind up. Its one of the two. The posts and contributions are not honest.
At this point, I am surprised you're still expecting answers...As predicted.
Never an answer just more obfuscation.
I'm beginning to think jamoor is an AI or a wind up. Its one of the two. The posts and contributions are not honest.
Still can't see how ridiculous it is - like a Borat scene.
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