How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 11)
Discussion
Murph7355 said:
DeepEnd said:
Well I think Yellowhammer report is probably based on the best prediction of what no deal might mean....
Oh well in that case then...FFS
ClaphamGT3 said:
Yellow hammer is not a risk assessment.
This is what is so maddening about these threads - they are full of people who can’t grasp even the basic facts.
Yes, it lets you get away with murder when it comes to crystal ball gazing and prophesies of disaster. Maddening.This is what is so maddening about these threads - they are full of people who can’t grasp even the basic facts.
Are you going to help DeepEnd out with his understanding of what Yellowhammer is?
You've still not explained how no deal is going to 'prevent access to' EU trade in any meaningful volume and ignore anyone who challenges your bold claims.
ClaphamGT3 said:
The reality is - as we have seen on these threads over three years now - is that Brexiteers will lie and lie and lie again rather than admit the truth about Brexit and what it means. To acknowledge the truth would be to acknowledge that they were taken for fools by the leave campaign
Oh, for goodness sake, you're getting worse.Nobody was 'taken for fools', about 52% want to leave - and the figures suggest that it has stayed about the same for 3 years, despite all the silliness from those determined to stay in the EU. The fact that so many Remainers are happy to ignore a democratic vote is quite incredible. To also know that so many are clearly not democratic at all when it suits them is very depressing.
Robertj21a said:
ClaphamGT3 said:
The reality is - as we have seen on these threads over three years now - is that Brexiteers will lie and lie and lie again rather than admit the truth about Brexit and what it means. To acknowledge the truth would be to acknowledge that they were taken for fools by the leave campaign
Oh, for goodness sake, you're getting worse.Nobody was 'taken for fools', about 52% want to leave - and the figures suggest that it has stayed about the same for 3 years, despite all the silliness from those determined to stay in the EU. The fact that so many Remainers are happy to ignore a democratic vote is quite incredible. To also know that so many are clearly not democratic at all when it suits them is very depressing.
amusingduck said:
DeepEnd said:
amusingduck said:
The key word was trying. As in, it seems to me that trying to maintain existing trade levels with the EU under a no-deal scenario is going to be more difficult, and less beneficial, than focusing on the RoW exports which are growing at a faster rate than EU exports even before we're on no deal terms. It's not either/or, it's a matter of prioritisation. RoW seems an easier win to me, I invited you to argue otherwise and you chose not to.
"trying to maintain existing trade levels with the EU under a no-deal scenario is going to be more difficult"So you are saying focus on RoW and allow EU trade to be damaged if necessary as part of negotiations?
The perception was correct and it is a reckless and ill-informed mindset as it dismisses the impact of damaging EU trade which could be far reaching.
You may believe that focusing on RoW exports will make up the damage, and that damage and lost jobs "will be worth it" but there is no evidence for that, and unfortunately no one with any credibility agrees with you. Your graph doesn't say that anyway as RoW exports are growing whilst we are in the EU. Their growth is not being stopped, is it?
It's simply a case of pragmatism. If focusing on EU is the best route in a no deal landscape, great. If not, we should focus on what is the best route.
As ever you fail to answer the question.
I take it you've moved on to
Or has your argument crumbled to nonsense
Robertj21a said:
Oh, for goodness sake, you're getting worse.
Nobody was 'taken for fools', about 52% want to leave - and the figures suggest that it has stayed about the same for 3 years, despite all the silliness from those determined to stay in the EU. The fact that so many Remainers are happy to ignore a democratic vote is quite incredible. To also know that so many are clearly not democratic at all when it suits them is very depressing.
One has to be incredulous at those who pick up on something and accuse Boris, for example, of saying f**k democracy, when they are in reality doing exactly that, but in shovelfuls. The hypocrisy around the place is just staggering and the hysteria and running round in circles clutching at straws getting ever more fever pitch.Nobody was 'taken for fools', about 52% want to leave - and the figures suggest that it has stayed about the same for 3 years, despite all the silliness from those determined to stay in the EU. The fact that so many Remainers are happy to ignore a democratic vote is quite incredible. To also know that so many are clearly not democratic at all when it suits them is very depressing.
We've not had only 37% voted for Leave so in reality 63% didn't support Leave gambit for a day or too. Slacking. (Or whatever interpretation of any set of random numbers someone wants to spout). Not even comedy gold any longer.
ClaphamGT3 said:
The reality is - as we have seen on these threads over three years now - is that Brexiteers will lie and lie and lie again rather than admit the truth about Brexit and what it means. To acknowledge the truth would be to acknowledge that they were taken for fools by the leave campaign
The Myopic view from that ivory tower !! I think selfish is the best way of describing the average rabid remainer , a sort of short sighted I'm all right jack things are ok for me I don't want change I'm not worried about creeping
bureaucracy etc ... while the rest of us see erosion , decline and short term thinking ....
I'm also sure many remain MP's and people in power don't like Independence as it lays bare their failings and ineptitude
without the EU to blame they won't have many excuses ...
Jeremy will do everything in his power to stop a no deal "Banker's Brexit"
https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
A Winner Is You said:
Jeremy will do everything in his power to stop a no deal "Banker's Brexit"
https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
That’s hilarious, next it’ll be Jezza is stopping a Nazi Brexit to save the Jews https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
Edit: Iphone autocorrected Jezza to Jesus, it’s a conspiracy!
John145 said:
A Winner Is You said:
Jeremy will do everything in his power to stop a no deal "Banker's Brexit"
https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
That’s hilarious, next it’ll be Jezza is stopping a Nazi Brexit to save the Jews https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1166099722...
You know, the same institutions who overwhelmingly backed and funded the remain campaign, and were definitely withdrawing from the UK if we voted to leave. Is that still happening by the way, it's so hard to keep track of all these economic disasters.
Edit: Iphone autocorrected Jezza to Jesus, it’s a conspiracy!
t.Corbyn is a joke
A Winner Is You said:
Jeremy will do everything in his power to stop a no deal "Banker's Brexit"
...
I guess we'll see over the next week or so when the idea of backing either Ken Clark or Harriet Harman is pushed harder for this "government of unity" b...
ks. I can see that working really well for him politically.
Swinson the Idiot is just as bad - will do anything to prevent it... Except back Corbyn as the leader of the GNU.
Money where mouth is "adults"
Robertj21a said:
Quite depressing to see some old school 'Establishment' Remainers on here still happy to ignore democracy. They'd be the very first to shout and rant if others ignored democracy - but it's all ok when it suits them.
I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
Some fairly incendiary writing there.I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
What defines “old school” and “establishment” ?
Specifically what act of democracy is being ignored ?
Robertj21a said:
Quite depressing to see some old school 'Establishment' Remainers on here still happy to ignore democracy. They'd be the very first to shout and rant if others ignored democracy - but it's all ok when it suits them.
I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
So Bob, what do you make of Raab's proposal to prorogue Parliament & Johnson's government, with a majority of one & propped up by taxpayer's money for the DUP seeking legal advice on the idea?I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
banjowilly said:
Robertj21a said:
Quite depressing to see some old school 'Establishment' Remainers on here still happy to ignore democracy. They'd be the very first to shout and rant if others ignored democracy - but it's all ok when it suits them.
I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
So Bob, what do you make of Raab's proposal to prorogue Parliament & Johnson's government, with a majority of one & propped up by taxpayer's money for the DUP seeking legal advice on the idea?I suppose it's those 3 year old blinkers they so love to wear.
Remainers are trying to kill our democracy.
NoNeed said:
The fact that they are having ti cinsider these things is disgusting,we should already have left by now and be in a transition period talking about the future.
Remainers are trying to kill our democracy.
You.......................................................................................................................................The point.Remainers are trying to kill our democracy.
pgh said:
I think recent opinion polls killed the VoNC idea. They need Conservative rebels, who will be made to understand very clearly that they’ll never be part of the party most likely to win the resulting election.
VoNC looks a bit dead at the moment as he can't win it. He probably needs 10 Tories to win but at least 5 to stand a chance. There are probably only 3 or 4 who stand a chance of voting for it and probably zero if the plan is for Corbyn to become PM.confused_buyer said:
pgh said:
I think recent opinion polls killed the VoNC idea. They need Conservative rebels, who will be made to understand very clearly that they’ll never be part of the party most likely to win the resulting election.
VoNC looks a bit dead at the moment as he can't win it. He probably needs 10 Tories to win but at least 5 to stand a chance. There are probably only 3 or 4 who stand a chance of voting for it and probably zero if the plan is for Corbyn to become PM.Coming out this morning with his stupidly unnecessary “banker’s Brexit” does nothing but remind us of his underlying long term mindset rather than position him as trying to effect a short term cross party solution to avert No Deal stupidity.
Cummings must have been laughing into his cornflakes when he read that this morning as it significantly further neuters the prospect of a meaningful challenge.
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