Do we need to keep 50,000 British troops in Germany?
Discussion
Papa Hotel said:
davido140 said:
ellroy said:
Also there's very little in the way of exercise areas in the UK where heavy armour can work.
I always thought most of dorset and the salisbury plains were designated for tanks to stretch their legs?jimbobsimmonds said:
50,000 is a lot of people to house...
+1Even though WW2 has been over for 65 years
and the Germans now show us how to run a proper
country, the fact that we haven't got room
for tens of thousands of squaddies, their
leaders and their families means that the tail
end of WW2 continues ad infinitum.
Shame really.
The Cold War has been over for twenty years, too.
I'm still waiting for the peace dividend.
UK spend on the military is 2.4% of GDP,
Germany's military spend is 1.5%.
0.9% of GDP would build a lot of new roads,
schools and hospitals.
ellroy said:
The reason they are there is historic. However, consider it in terms of the ability to house 50,000 men, their families and kit. Is reality this is a large part of the reason they are still there.
A good proportion of them are 7 Armoured Division, for example, and that means lots of kit, Challengers/Warriors/bridgelayers etc. I'm pretty sure they'd find it hard to house more troops and that kind of stuff in the UK anytime soon.
Also there's very little in the way of exercise areas in the UK where heavy armour can work.
A good proportion of them are 7 Armoured Division, for example, and that means lots of kit, Challengers/Warriors/bridgelayers etc. I'm pretty sure they'd find it hard to house more troops and that kind of stuff in the UK anytime soon.
Also there's very little in the way of exercise areas in the UK where heavy armour can work.
They have to go somewhere. There isn't the space or infrastructure in the UK, and there certainly isn't the money to build it.V88Dicky said:
These 50,000 or so troops are still used in a combat role in Afghanistan though, aren't they?
Can't see the problem with having them on the Rhine, its good for Anglo-Germanic relations
Firstly the number of service personnel based in Germany is less than 20,000 these days. They do indeed take their turn in Afghanistan along with UK based units (although they were mainly deployed to Iraq in recent years and the last government wouldn't pay to fly their tanks to Afghanistan).Can't see the problem with having them on the Rhine, its good for Anglo-Germanic relations
Papa Hotel said:
You can't do proper live firing in the UK on any sort of decent scale. Germany is handy for heading over to Poland to do a Brigade or even Division sized exercise with live artillery and getting RAF bombs involved. Try doing that in the UK.
Why would we need a division sized exercise; we don't have the numbers to raise a division, not a fighting one anyway. Even raising a Brigade for GWII was a stretch.BruceV8 said:
ellroy said:
The reason they are there is historic. However, consider it in terms of the ability to house 50,000 men, their families and kit. Is reality this is a large part of the reason they are still there.
A good proportion of them are 7 Armoured Division, for example, and that means lots of kit, Challengers/Warriors/bridgelayers etc. I'm pretty sure they'd find it hard to house more troops and that kind of stuff in the UK anytime soon.
Also there's very little in the way of exercise areas in the UK where heavy armour can work.
A good proportion of them are 7 Armoured Division, for example, and that means lots of kit, Challengers/Warriors/bridgelayers etc. I'm pretty sure they'd find it hard to house more troops and that kind of stuff in the UK anytime soon.
Also there's very little in the way of exercise areas in the UK where heavy armour can work.
They have to go somewhere. There isn't the space or infrastructure in the UK, and there certainly isn't the money to build it.Ayahuasca said:
There doesn't seem much chance of ze Nazis reappearing or Slavic Red Hordes charging over the border so why do we maintain so many troops there?
Apparently they contribute 1.5 million Euro to the German economy that the UK could probably do with being spent on itself.
Time to bring the boys back home?
They have to keep there as the UK Govt sold off all their houses in Britain for 50p. We have no way of housing them but Germany has shed loads of accomodation left over from the Cold War.Apparently they contribute 1.5 million Euro to the German economy that the UK could probably do with being spent on itself.
Time to bring the boys back home?
I doubt many are actually combat troops most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
I would assume that they are involved heavily in Afghanistan etc.
Papa Hotel said:
Jollyclub said:
DonkeyApple said:
most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
REMFsBruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
Jollyclub said:
DonkeyApple said:
most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
REMFsPapa Hotel said:
BruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
Jollyclub said:
DonkeyApple said:
most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
REMFs
If only.BruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
BruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
Jollyclub said:
DonkeyApple said:
most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
REMFs If only.Papa Hotel said:
BruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
BruceV8 said:
Papa Hotel said:
Jollyclub said:
DonkeyApple said:
most will be whatever they call people in the army who don't advance and shoot people in the face.
REMFs If only.The Russian hookers don't seem to mind it too much though
dcb said:
jimbobsimmonds said:
50,000 is a lot of people to house...
+1Even though WW2 has been over for 65 years
and the Germans now show us how to run a proper
country, the fact that we haven't got room
for tens of thousands of squaddies, their
leaders and their families means that the tail
end of WW2 continues ad infinitum.
Shame really.
The Cold War has been over for twenty years, too.
I'm still waiting for the peace dividend.
UK spend on the military is 2.4% of GDP,
Germany's military spend is 1.5%.
0.9% of GDP would build a lot of new roads,
schools and hospitals.
Using your percentages and Wikipedia's GDP figures, the UK spends $52.4 billion on the military and Germany spends $55.5 billion.
Therefore, Germany actually spends more on its military in actual terms than the UK.
youngsyr said:
Be careful comparing percentages; UK GDP is $2.18 trillion and the German GDP is $3.7 trillion (both taken from the ultimate bastion of truth - Wikipedia
Using your percentages and Wikipedia's GDP figures, the UK spends $52.4 billion on the military and Germany spends $55.5 billion.
Therefore, Germany actually spends more on its military in actual terms than the UK.
Also, Herman the german uses his defence vote as a job creation scheme rather than a forceful way of continuing diplomacy by other means. The Bundeswehr don't really do much, there are some in Kosovo and Afghanistan, but they don't come out at night because it's dangerous.Using your percentages and Wikipedia's GDP figures, the UK spends $52.4 billion on the military and Germany spends $55.5 billion.
Therefore, Germany actually spends more on its military in actual terms than the UK.
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