"Deeply concerning" number of police accused of abuse
Discussion
Figures released show that hundreds of police officers are being accused of sexually abusing victims and suspects in what a senior police watchdog has called “the most serious corruption issue facing the service”.
Guardian link
Do these findings explain a few things about some recent news stories?
Guardian link
Do these findings explain a few things about some recent news stories?
With 106,311 officers in England and Wales, not counting PCSO or specials, and a total number of staff under investigation as 334 it represents 0.311 of the workforce, or less as some of those complained about are PCSO's
Now that's 334 too many if the allegations are true but that's a bit perspective. I wonder if it's under what the percentage would be in society as a whole?
Now that's 334 too many if the allegations are true but that's a bit perspective. I wonder if it's under what the percentage would be in society as a whole?
HMIC seem to be jumping the gun along with these "victims groups". These figures are for accusations if I'm reading the article correctly, but the opinions seem to read as if every single accusation has foundation, implying along the way that officers and staff are getting away with it wholesale or it's not being investigated fully.
Irresponsible reporting and comments, to my mind.
Irresponsible reporting and comments, to my mind.
I'll need to read the report - I don't think it's publicly available yet.
I fully expect there to be a fair bit that can be done to improve the spotting and detection of people who abuse their position in this manner, and expect some forces will be better than others.
However, the headline isn't talking about a pro-active stance, it's talking about allegations. Let's get some context. There are very few occupations whereby being complained about is part and parcel of doing one's job. Don't like your ticket for wearing a seat belt? Complain. Don't like being told you can't enter a licensed premises because you've been causing trouble? Complain. Don't like being arrested. Complain, etc etc.
There were over 70,000 complaints over same time period. Around 280 allegations per 1,000 employees. Over 5500 were for using excessive force.
"Thousands of police accused of assaulting the public".
Easy headlines to generate.
I know of two officers who were accused of rape by a vulnerable women and without going into detail it was a false allegation. There's two of the complaints there. On the flip side I know of someone who went to prison for abusing his position in such a manner.
Is the data concerning? Of course. Is there more than can be done to detect this sort of behaviour and encourage victims to come forward? Of course, but don't be fooled by a simple complaint number without any context into the remarkable volume of malicious, false and baseless complaints.
I fully expect there to be a fair bit that can be done to improve the spotting and detection of people who abuse their position in this manner, and expect some forces will be better than others.
However, the headline isn't talking about a pro-active stance, it's talking about allegations. Let's get some context. There are very few occupations whereby being complained about is part and parcel of doing one's job. Don't like your ticket for wearing a seat belt? Complain. Don't like being told you can't enter a licensed premises because you've been causing trouble? Complain. Don't like being arrested. Complain, etc etc.
There were over 70,000 complaints over same time period. Around 280 allegations per 1,000 employees. Over 5500 were for using excessive force.
"Thousands of police accused of assaulting the public".
Easy headlines to generate.
I know of two officers who were accused of rape by a vulnerable women and without going into detail it was a false allegation. There's two of the complaints there. On the flip side I know of someone who went to prison for abusing his position in such a manner.
Is the data concerning? Of course. Is there more than can be done to detect this sort of behaviour and encourage victims to come forward? Of course, but don't be fooled by a simple complaint number without any context into the remarkable volume of malicious, false and baseless complaints.
Guardian said:
Despite the large numbers, there is evidence that only 40 officers or staff have been dismissed for abusing authority for sexual gain in a similar period.
If that 40 figure is from the 436 figure, then that's probably one of the highest complaint to dismissal ratios. In Brighton we had a woman complain that she was being targeted by an officer after a burglary. A bit under 36 hours later the chap had resigned. The police wanted to prosecute for crime but the informant did not want to proceed.
As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
There were cases of women involved in pickpocketing grabbing Police Officers hands when arrested. Before doing so they'd rubbed it where the sun doesn't shine. Then claim sexual assault and DNA 'evidence' on said officers hand.
It certainly put the pickpocketing case out of the spotlight.
Accused and guilty are two very different things. The Ines that ARE guilty usually end up in prison where they belong.
It certainly put the pickpocketing case out of the spotlight.
Accused and guilty are two very different things. The Ines that ARE guilty usually end up in prison where they belong.
Elroy Blue said:
There were cases of women involved in pickpocketing grabbing Police Officers hands when arrested. Before doing so they'd rubbed it where the sun doesn't shine. Then claim sexual assault and DNA 'evidence' on said officers hand.
That's amazing. And scary. Clearly the scrotes are clued up.Why doesn't this sort of stuff make the DM?
Derek Smith said:
In Brighton we had a woman complain that she was being targeted by an officer after a burglary. A bit under 36 hours later the chap had resigned. The police wanted to prosecute for crime but the informant did not want to proceed.
As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If I read that right then a serving officer breaking the rules was offered resignation as an alternative to prosecution?As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If so I find that worrying.
stitched said:
Derek Smith said:
In Brighton we had a woman complain that she was being targeted by an officer after a burglary. A bit under 36 hours later the chap had resigned. The police wanted to prosecute for crime but the informant did not want to proceed.
As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If I read that right then a serving officer breaking the rules was offered resignation as an alternative to prosecution?As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If so I find that worrying.
La Liga said:
stitched said:
Derek Smith said:
In Brighton we had a woman complain that she was being targeted by an officer after a burglary. A bit under 36 hours later the chap had resigned. The police wanted to prosecute for crime but the informant did not want to proceed.
As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If I read that right then a serving officer breaking the rules was offered resignation as an alternative to prosecution?As soon as the complaint was received the C.Sup was informed, surveillance was called and set up the woman's home. The officer was on late turn. An inspector was in the kitchen when the PC came to the house. Once sufficient conversation was recorded the inspector told the PC to return to the nick when a D&C sergeant gave the officer the option of resigning.
If so I find that worrying.
Elroy Blue said:
There were cases of women involved in pickpocketing grabbing Police Officers hands when arrested. Before doing so they'd rubbed it where the sun doesn't shine. Then claim sexual assault and DNA 'evidence' on said officers hand.
It certainly put the pickpocketing case out of the spotlight.
Accused and guilty are two very different things. The Ines that ARE guilty usually end up in prison where they belong.
Lovely It certainly put the pickpocketing case out of the spotlight.
Accused and guilty are two very different things. The Ines that ARE guilty usually end up in prison where they belong.
Not heard of that one. At least it is a bit more effort than the usual "he grabbed me tits"
IIRC, certainly in the Rotherham abuse cases, there was some crossover to police officers - there was, apparently, some involvement:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3463517/Po...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3463517/Po...
El stovey said:
Saw this in the news and thought it sounded awful. BUT it's just Romanian gypsy pickpockets forcing innocent plod to grab their crotches?
I don't think you understand the what he was saying with that examples. They'd put their own hand there and put their DNA on the officers. He was giving an example of a false allegation, not that it makes up the bulk of the data. There have been people who've gone to prison / lost their jobs so clearly there are some serious incidents within the data.
steveatesh said:
With 106,311 officers in England and Wales, not counting PCSO or specials, and a total number of staff under investigation as 334 it represents 0.311 of the workforce, or less as some of those complained about are PCSO's
Now that's 334 too many if the allegations are true but that's a bit perspective. I wonder if it's under what the percentage would be in society as a whole?
I agree with you, but shame the same stuff wasn't said and looked at so logically when 50 odd Muslim taxi drivers and kebab workers were abusing girls, it was all "it's a cultural thing" like every single Muslim abused girls as part of their belief system...Now that's 334 too many if the allegations are true but that's a bit perspective. I wonder if it's under what the percentage would be in society as a whole?
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff