SIPP & Pension guidance - IM Private Clients
Discussion
pingu393 said:
IMCoops said:
Jasey_ said:
I'm not sure this is the real coops - That Adam dude is always going on about how advanced AI is becoming 
You never know 
Good to be back and helping clients again
Coops however...
Coops... When you and my little brother were teenagers, skipping classes, messing about and getting excited about buying cheap larger, I said that one day, if you set your mind to it, someone would use the word intelligence when talking about you.
That day has now come mate, that day has come.
That day has now come mate, that day has come.
A poser for jph and Nik
I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesnt get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesnt get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
dingg said:
A poser for jph and Nik
I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesn't get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
Sound faintly feasible....but is more a question for YOUR specific provider. I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesn't get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
If your pot is with IM, then yes, Nick/JPH/Coops ought to be able to explain the options!
Do you mean you want to take a regular income from the uncrystallised half? Perhaps with 25% of each drawdown being tax-free?
It will likely differ by provider.
mikeiow said:
dingg said:
A poser for jph and Nik
I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesn't get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
Sound faintly feasible....but is more a question for YOUR specific provider. I have emailed Nik with the question but thought it would may be of use to others
Situation :-
I have two pots within my sipp
one crystallised which I am drawing down on
one uncrystallised which doesn't get drawn on
I want to change the way I drawdown , put the pot that is crystallised in abeyance and start drawing down the uncrystallised pot , I do not wish the pots to be merged once the uncrystallised pot reaches 25% drawn , but wish to carry on drawing from that pot till its empty , then and only then recommence drawdown from the pot that was in abeyance
How to do this?
If your pot is with IM, then yes, Nick/JPH/Coops ought to be able to explain the options!
Do you mean you want to take a regular income from the uncrystallised half? Perhaps with 25% of each drawdown being tax-free?
It will likely differ by provider.
Is the value of a pension when valued against lifetime allowance (it doesn't go away until next tax year) related to time?
I have four options and max pension option equates to 4.12% of LTA, max cash equatest to 4.03% of LTA, "so called" level pension equates to 18.71% of LTA and max cash plus reduced level pension(!) is 10.82% of LTA - all from the same size pot!
It is a final salary scheme, not my only one, and it is inflation linked but how can the "value" for lifetime allowance vary so much?
I have four options and max pension option equates to 4.12% of LTA, max cash equatest to 4.03% of LTA, "so called" level pension equates to 18.71% of LTA and max cash plus reduced level pension(!) is 10.82% of LTA - all from the same size pot!
It is a final salary scheme, not my only one, and it is inflation linked but how can the "value" for lifetime allowance vary so much?
I realise that the lifetime allowance is gone (for now) but in the case of unlisted minority shares in a private company in a SIPP, what methodology was used to value them for LTA purposes?
And what were the tax consequences of the proceeds of a sale of the business for more than its original valuation pushing the fund over the LTA?
And now that it has been abolished, and Starmer has said that he will reinstate it, are people nervous about exploiting it?
And what were the tax consequences of the proceeds of a sale of the business for more than its original valuation pushing the fund over the LTA?
And now that it has been abolished, and Starmer has said that he will reinstate it, are people nervous about exploiting it?
otolith said:
I realise that the lifetime allowance is gone (for now) but in the case of unlisted minority shares in a private company in a SIPP, what methodology was used to value them for LTA purposes?
And what were the tax consequences of the proceeds of a sale of the business for more than its original valuation pushing the fund over the LTA?
And now that it has been abolished, and Starmer has said that he will reinstate it, are people nervous about exploiting it?
Good afternoon And what were the tax consequences of the proceeds of a sale of the business for more than its original valuation pushing the fund over the LTA?
And now that it has been abolished, and Starmer has said that he will reinstate it, are people nervous about exploiting it?
email nik.burrows@intelligentmoney.com and he will get back to you on this.
Kindest regards
Coops
IJWS15 said:
Is the value of a pension when valued against lifetime allowance (it doesn't go away until next tax year) related to time?
I have four options and max pension option equates to 4.12% of LTA, max cash equatest to 4.03% of LTA, "so called" level pension equates to 18.71% of LTA and max cash plus reduced level pension(!) is 10.82% of LTA - all from the same size pot!
It is a final salary scheme, not my only one, and it is inflation linked but how can the "value" for lifetime allowance vary so much?
Good afternoon I have four options and max pension option equates to 4.12% of LTA, max cash equatest to 4.03% of LTA, "so called" level pension equates to 18.71% of LTA and max cash plus reduced level pension(!) is 10.82% of LTA - all from the same size pot!
It is a final salary scheme, not my only one, and it is inflation linked but how can the "value" for lifetime allowance vary so much?
email nik.burrows@intelligentmoney.com and he will get back to you on this.
Kindest regards
Coops
IMCoops said:
Good afternoon
email nik.burrows@intelligentmoney.com and he will get back to you on this.
Kindest regards
Coops
I think I have worked it out, they are using 20 times the level pension figure to get the value but it is only paid for 2 years 3 months before dropping to a much lower figure.email nik.burrows@intelligentmoney.com and he will get back to you on this.
Kindest regards
Coops
IJWS15 said:
I think I have worked it out, they are using 20 times the level pension figure to get the value but it is only paid for 2 years 3 months before dropping to a much lower figure.
Response from Pension administrators is to confirm that those are the HMRC rules - use 20 times the pension in first year regardless of the fact that it drops in value in year 3.HMRC asked to look at it earlier in week and waiting for a response.
Effectively I can't wait for an answer so will be taking a different option to avoid losing 15% of LTA. If I took the level pension my dc scheme investments won't have to grow much to push me through the cap.
Thoughts from the crowd please:
My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
M4tt-H said:
Thoughts from the crowd please:
My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
I'm not familiar with those funds but have been in similar situations many times in the past.My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
It's not easy to do, but you have to forget whatever your initial investment was. This is anchoring and is described here:
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/anchoring.asp
The only value that matters is the current value and the only question is whether, if you didn't hold PHO and instead had that value in cash in your bank account then would you buy PHO with it? If not, then sell.
You should do this periodically regardless of performance because your own circumstances, experience and risk tolerances change over time.
M4tt-H said:
Thoughts from the crowd please:
My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
PHO has gone down over time, it's perhaps a fund to drip feed each month rather than bung a lump in and hope for the best.My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
After writing that I have to admit to sticking a lump into the fund a few weeks back!
But this was more to spread my risk over a larger amount of equities, but my holding in PHtech is far greater than the sum of holdings in both Equity and oppotunity at the moment.
I trust JPH/AdamIM to know what they are about and feel that, given time, PHO will come good.
But I'm also a natural loser.....
Im still holding PHO,I invested when it opened. Its the worst of my IM holdings, shame its not doing as well as PHE and PH Tech...and no doubt we would have all loved another PH Recovery fund
I seem to remember one or more of the shares that made up PHO took a big dive and overall the fund has not since recovered (ASOS maybe, its had a huge fall over last 2 years).
The time window for PHO was medium to long term, 3-5 years (or longer). Plenty of time for recovery yet, particularly if a few of the other potential growth stocks come good. So im not selling out yet.
I seem to remember one or more of the shares that made up PHO took a big dive and overall the fund has not since recovered (ASOS maybe, its had a huge fall over last 2 years).
The time window for PHO was medium to long term, 3-5 years (or longer). Plenty of time for recovery yet, particularly if a few of the other potential growth stocks come good. So im not selling out yet.
A few of the PHO selections are on the rise, Fevertree springs to mind, as does Melrose, the latter recently spun off Dowlais which is also doing well.
In general, IM are far better at selecting equities than I am, my selections mostly go down.....Rolls Royce is a good example, bought a few years back at £2.40, covid effect hit, then a rights issue further eroded SP, a current high a few weeks back was £2.10 and SP is now around the £2 mark!
Overall, I would suggest that PHO is a decent risk 'at today's value' and that hanging on is a better option than bailing out and taking a loss.
The above is my personal opinion as an amateur S and S investor/trader and NOT regulated advice. Stocks prices can fall as well as plummet.
In general, IM are far better at selecting equities than I am, my selections mostly go down.....Rolls Royce is a good example, bought a few years back at £2.40, covid effect hit, then a rights issue further eroded SP, a current high a few weeks back was £2.10 and SP is now around the £2 mark!
Overall, I would suggest that PHO is a decent risk 'at today's value' and that hanging on is a better option than bailing out and taking a loss.
The above is my personal opinion as an amateur S and S investor/trader and NOT regulated advice. Stocks prices can fall as well as plummet.
LeoSayer said:
M4tt-H said:
Thoughts from the crowd please:
My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
I'm not familiar with those funds but have been in similar situations many times in the past.My IM pension is split across PH Equity and PH Opportunities and was opened a little under two years ago. Over that time it is valued down £2.5k on reasonable sum.
PH 'Opportunities' seems just to be an opportunity to lose money and has always been trending down since investment. PH Equity is up overall by a reasonable % but PH Opportunities is pulling the overall pension negative having lost 15% of its initial investment value.
Is anyone still holding onto the "Opportunities" as tbh as a Fully Managed fund, I'm starting to worry about its ability to manage itself out of whatever it's up to? I've been quietly biding my time with it as its supposed to be a medium/long term investment, but its just digging itself a deeper hole to climb out of by the looks of it. Wondering about bailing out of it into Equity, but then I crystalise the loss?
Your thoughts?
Cheers,
Matt.
It's not easy to do, but you have to forget whatever your initial investment was. This is anchoring and is described here:
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/anchoring.asp
The only value that matters is the current value and the only question is whether, if you didn't hold PHO and instead had that value in cash in your bank account then would you buy PHO with it? If not, then sell.
You should do this periodically regardless of performance because your own circumstances, experience and risk tolerances change over time.
Specifically I did this some time ago with my PHO holdings I took the bullet at about 6K down selling out , BUT moved the fund straight into my Index100 holding. Doing some back calcs I am recovered just on that loss and more to the point up more than I would had the same money just wallowed in the loss maker .
You pays your money and takes your chances huh .
Gassing Station | Finance | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff