Brewdog shares

[Russ T Bolt]

Not really sure where to post this, please move if not the right section.

I bought some Brewdog shares in 2013, mostly for the discounts.

I have just noticed they have reduced the (my) online discount to 10%. It was a while ago but I don't recall seeing anything in the paperwork at the time that allowed them to reduce or remove the 'lifetime benefits'.

I know there are a few Brewdog investors on here, did you have the same ?

[Russ T Bolt]

MisanoPayments said:

I think it's the same for everyone - I believe they stopped it last year quite early into lockdown to help the bottom line and to have all customers (shareholders or not) on the same level.

If you keep an eye on your emails, I usually get discount codes from them - which I use to top up the supply!

You made a wise investment choice in 2013, that's for sure!

I haven't received any discount codes from them.

I only bought them for the discount not really expecting them to be an investment in the proper sense.

[Russ T Bolt]

Bert Cheese said:

Isn't this more of a crowdfunding scheme than true shareholding though?

From what I gather Brewdog shares are type B which can only be sold via the Brewdog internal platform where some sort of commission applies.

Aside from the discounts for dedicated drinkers of their product it doesn't seem like worth buying more than the minimum 2 shares.

I've followed Brewdog from the start when they only had a handful of beers in the range, and still rate their dark ales in particular...was never tempted by the share scheme though.

The 'shares' do have voting rights, so not sure really.

Yes they aren't listed so only way to sell them is via Brewdog or their agent, at a lower than market price from what I have seen after a brief look today. They have talked about an IPO, not sure what that will mean for the current 'shareholders', but I may stay with it just to see what happens.

I am pretty annoyed as I bought enough to get the maximum discount, I seem to recall it was tiered based on number of shares bought.

I could have bought fewer shares and ended up with the same discount.

I only like their Stouts/Abstrakt beers, but they seem to have cut right back on choice and sdon't seem to brew Abstrakt anymore, so not a lot for me to buy anyway at the moment.

I don't much like their normal offerings.

[Russ T Bolt]

corinthian said:

Those Abstrakt beers and stouts are a proper treat, I do hope they keep them going, they’re very strong though, sends me off to sleep!
Can’t help with the shares I’m afraid, no idea.

Indeed, I have a couple of bottles of an imperial stout of theirs at 15% really nice.

I normally buy a load at once and they last me a year or so. Went in yesterday to stock up but they only had a choice of 3.

I Also have a couple of bottles of Tactical Nuclear Penguin.

[Russ T Bolt]

itlab said:

MisanoPayments said:

I think it's the same for everyone - I believe they stopped it last year quite early into lockdown to help the bottom line and to have all customers (shareholders or not) on the same level.

The problem was that they said something silly like 90% of orders on their online shop were by EFP members.

To me it certainly felt like price’s were artificially high to allow for this. Scrapping the discount allowed them to lower prices for everyone to make them more competitive at a time when all of their wet sales had vanished.

Have they though ?

They don't have any of the beers I normally buy in stock, don't know if that is timing or they have abandoned strong Stouts.

However last time I ordered I did buy some Jet Black Heart (4.7%) at £1.80 per 330ml bottle (adjusted for size would be £2.19 for 402ml)

Closest they have now is Jet Black Heart Nitro (6.0%) which is slightly stronger but £11.95 for 4x402ml cans, which is £2.99 per can.

[Russ T Bolt]

MisanoPayments said:

Russ T Bolt said:

I haven't received any discount codes from them.

We can't have that! The next time I get one I'll send it across!

Cheers

[Russ T Bolt]

itlab said:

Russ T Bolt said:

Have they though ?

They don't have any of the beers I normally buy in stock, don't know if that is timing or they have abandoned strong Stouts.

However last time I ordered I did buy some Jet Black Heart (4.7%) at £1.80 per 330ml bottle (adjusted for size would be £2.19 for 402ml)

Closest they have now is Jet Black Heart Nitro (6.0%) which is slightly stronger but £11.95 for 4x402ml cans, which is £2.99 per can.

There will be exceptions and I think jet black heart was one of the core(“headliner”) beers (along with punk, dead pony etc) but they have moved it to be a side act. They no longer have a stout in the main range.

they now try and compete with the supermarkets

https://www.brewdog.com/uk/price-pledge

They seem far more focused on shipping 48 can packs of punk at sub £1 a can than the bottle shop approach they had before.

Previously you could pick up a 4 pack of punk from Asda most days for £4 but the brewdog online store was £1.5 to £2 a can depending on volume so even with discount was dearer than Asda

So they haven't reduced the prices for everyone.

I can't compare the other beers I normally buy from them because they either don't have them or have stopped brewing them. BJH isn't one of my preferred beers, it is just the closest to something they have in stock to compare.
Not really sure I understand your point about BJH being a core beer yet they have increased the price for its slightly more powerful replacement.

I still have some bottles of Dog B, Dog F, Paradox Islay, Cocoa Psycho, various Abstrakt etc. At the moment I won't be able to replace those.
If they do get some in will be interesting to see what the prices are, I will be surprised if they are cheaper. I suspect that as some of these beers were £10+ a bottle and Brewdog appear to have switched to selling in fours they won't be coming back.

I don't buy their other beers so don't benefit from them trying to compete with supermarkets.

On that point, I don't work in retail, but is trying to compete with supermarkets a smart move ? I would have thought let them sell volume of the stuff they sell and focus on customers looking for something different.

I don't think I have ever seen a 15% Stout in a supermarket, hence I bought from Brewdog, but sadly no more.

[Russ T Bolt]

Al Gorithum said:

BTW, Nuclear Penguin is utterly vile IMO.

I do like Penguin.

Sink the Bismarck however I thought tasted like burnt treacle

[Russ T Bolt]

Thought I would update this with my findings in case anybody is interested.

I contacted Brewdog questioning their right to change the percentage discount, given that when I purchased the shares it was a tiered offering, the more you bought the bigger the discount.

I have received a response explaining in detail why there is no breach of contract and that the rights attached to B shares are laid down in the Articles of Association. At the AGM in 2019 the majority vote was in favour of allowing the Company to alter the rights attaching to “B” Shares, including the discount levels.

[Russ T Bolt]

Driver101 said:

Russ T Bolt said:

Thought I would update this with my findings in case anybody is interested.

I contacted Brewdog questioning their right to change the percentage discount, given that when I purchased the shares it was a tiered offering, the more you bought the bigger the discount.

I have received a response explaining in detail why there is no breach of contract and that the rights attached to B shares are laid down in the Articles of Association. At the AGM in 2019 the majority vote was in favour of allowing the Company to alter the rights attaching to “B” Shares, including the discount levels.

That's not a fair way of explaining it. There wasn't a vote at the AGM. It only takes the major shareholders to vote to outweigh everyone else. This was pushed through without the minor shareholders knowledge or agreement.

As per earlier the prices of the core beers are cheaper than before. Although your discount is smaller the price of the beer is less. The shop used to be used by nearly only shareholders. The prices were too high. Now the prices of the beers are lower and the shop sells the majority of beer to unconnected customers now.

That was copied from the (lengthy) email they sent me. That is how Brewdog explained it.

I disagree regarding the prices of the beers, I have already posted an example above of the closest match for the type of beer I drink, that has actually gone up.

I can't compare their other beer prices as I have never bought them.

[Russ T Bolt]

Driver101 said:

Russ T Bolt said:

Driver101 said:

Russ T Bolt said:

Thought I would update this with my findings in case anybody is interested.

I contacted Brewdog questioning their right to change the percentage discount, given that when I purchased the shares it was a tiered offering, the more you bought the bigger the discount.

I have received a response explaining in detail why there is no breach of contract and that the rights attached to B shares are laid down in the Articles of Association. At the AGM in 2019 the majority vote was in favour of allowing the Company to alter the rights attaching to “B” Shares, including the discount levels.

That's not a fair way of explaining it. There wasn't a vote at the AGM. It only takes the major shareholders to vote to outweigh everyone else. This was pushed through without the minor shareholders knowledge or agreement.

As per earlier the prices of the core beers are cheaper than before. Although your discount is smaller the price of the beer is less. The shop used to be used by nearly only shareholders. The prices were too high. Now the prices of the beers are lower and the shop sells the majority of beer to unconnected customers now.

That was copied from the (lengthy) email they sent me. That is how Brewdog explained it.

I disagree regarding the prices of the beers, I have already posted an example above of the closest match for the type of beer I drink, that has actually gone up.

I can't compare their other beer prices as I have never bought them.

Comparing Jet Black Heart and Jet Black Heart Nitro isn't a fair comparison. It's not the same beer, the same strength and the Nitro is brewed and shipped in from the USA.

Jet Black Heart Nitro is £3 per can in the supermarket. You can buy 4 cans directly from Brewdog for less and that's before discount. In the past is was cheaper buying from the supermarket even after discounts.

Given how much Brewdog have reduced the Stout range, that was the closest comparison I could make to beers I have bought previously.

Your figures aren't impressive to be honest, buying from Brewdog saves 5p for 4 tins potentially with postage on top.

I guess the whole thing is moot, if they have stopped brewing the strong stout beers I won't be buying from them anyway so the discount doesn't matter. They seem to be heading towards being a mainstream brewer of session beers. Would be interested to know what they think their USP is now.

[Russ T Bolt]

Driver101 said:

I'm just telling what the costs are and what they used to be.

Edited by Driver101 on Friday 2nd April 12:30

I clearly missed that, can you repeat what the prices are now compared to what they used to be.

[Russ T Bolt]

Driver101 said:

I could spend my life researching and documenting all the old v new prices. You sound like the type of guy that will try to make an argument regardless.

Ordering direct from Brewdog used to be considerably more expensive than buying from the supermarket. That's no longer true. The beers are either similarly priced or even cheaper. All the spirits are also now priced exactly the same as the supermarket. You've got your discount on top of those prices.
In the past everything was a good bit more expensive than the supermarket after discounts.

A few guys have tried to make an effort to explain things. I don't think it can be made any clearly.

Edited by Driver101 on Friday 2nd April 13:45

My mistake, i thought you said you had provided that information.

Do you work for Brewdog ? You are very defensive in responding to any negative post about them.

My issue is that they offered a level of discount to early investors in return for A greater investment.

They have reneged on that. Assuming the detail they sent me in their email is correct, they went to a lot of trouble from the start to make sure they could do that but not in a transparent manner.

I expect companies to honour lifetime benefits if offered in return for an increased investment.

You can sing their praises as much as you like, I don’t share your view.

[Russ T Bolt]

Basically i chose to invest based on level of discount, i wasn’t expecting growth and the prospectus made much of how high the risk was of losing all of the investment.

I could have invested less and received a 10% discount, i chose not to. Yet I now find myself with the same discount.

There was no point in the uplift in investment it has transpired.