Extensions - Build Overs, Sewers, Building Control etc.
Discussion
Hi all – I’m after peoples experience with obtaining ‘Build Over’ agreements from their utility (specifically Yorkshire Water).
We have a house that is perfect for extending with the only stumbling block being we have a number of drains/sewers cris-crossing the land, some of which we would want to build over. I am aware that this makes things more difficult, adds costs and may limit exactly where we can build however I’m also aware that it does not mean we cannot extend – so long as we approach it the right way.
The obvious first thing I need to do is to get some proper plans/maps of my land – It looks like I can buy these via a portal from YW, Would you advise PDF, Paper maps, DXF maps etc? Bear in mind I’m likely to do a lot of initial design work myself so I’m inclined to say .DXFCAD files!
Then I can confirm exactly what exists underground, and where it serves. Any advice of what to do after that is appreciated…!
We have a house that is perfect for extending with the only stumbling block being we have a number of drains/sewers cris-crossing the land, some of which we would want to build over. I am aware that this makes things more difficult, adds costs and may limit exactly where we can build however I’m also aware that it does not mean we cannot extend – so long as we approach it the right way.
The obvious first thing I need to do is to get some proper plans/maps of my land – It looks like I can buy these via a portal from YW, Would you advise PDF, Paper maps, DXF maps etc? Bear in mind I’m likely to do a lot of initial design work myself so I’m inclined to say .DXFCAD files!
Then I can confirm exactly what exists underground, and where it serves. Any advice of what to do after that is appreciated…!
Can't help with the planning issues.We generally get issued with PDF,s of services from water boards. When we receive these, in pdf format, we use a conversion tool. There are plenty of free/trial versions on the internet, that convert PDF's into DWG's. Whilst the conversion is not as useful as a CAD file
(it converts the linework into a series of vector dots) it allows you to reference the services into your cad file to coordinate around. Hope that helps a bit.
(it converts the linework into a series of vector dots) it allows you to reference the services into your cad file to coordinate around. Hope that helps a bit.
I assume you've already found Yorkshire Water's basic information page on building over sewers, which is available here
You will therefore probably need a Build-Over agreement, and Yorkshire Water will relieve you of £623.28 for the privilege of this.
Your architect/plans drawer will be able to handle the application for you, if you ask them.
Some Water Authorities operate a system of 'deemed consent', whereby you are allowed to build over without a formal agreement, provided certain conditions are met ( for example). It might be worth inquiring with YW if they operate such a system, though I can't see any details from a quick Google.
If you need a build over agreement, the precise requirements of the work will depend on your proposals and the arrangement of the sewers to build over, but expect to be required to use specialist foundations designs (eg. piles and ground beams) if require to avoid imposing any additional loads on the sewers. You may therefore need to get a Structural Engineer involved to assist with the design.
Yes, get the OS map details of your property in .dxf format (or better still, if you download them from Promap, you can now also get them as full colour .dwg files).
Failing that (if the PDF has no retained geometry), I usually just insert it into AutoCAD, scale and align it to match the Promap OS data, and trace the relevant information. No need for third party software, if your CAD is up to snuff.
You will therefore probably need a Build-Over agreement, and Yorkshire Water will relieve you of £623.28 for the privilege of this.
Your architect/plans drawer will be able to handle the application for you, if you ask them.
Some Water Authorities operate a system of 'deemed consent', whereby you are allowed to build over without a formal agreement, provided certain conditions are met ( for example). It might be worth inquiring with YW if they operate such a system, though I can't see any details from a quick Google.
If you need a build over agreement, the precise requirements of the work will depend on your proposals and the arrangement of the sewers to build over, but expect to be required to use specialist foundations designs (eg. piles and ground beams) if require to avoid imposing any additional loads on the sewers. You may therefore need to get a Structural Engineer involved to assist with the design.
Yes, get the OS map details of your property in .dxf format (or better still, if you download them from Promap, you can now also get them as full colour .dwg files).
hogg968 said:
Can't help with the planning issues.We generally get issued with PDF,s of services from water boards. When we receive these, in pdf format, we use a conversion tool. There are plenty of free/trial versions on the internet, that convert PDF's into DWG's. Whilst the conversion is not as useful as a CAD file
(it converts the linework into a series of vector dots) it allows you to reference the services into your cad file to coordinate around. Hope that helps a bit.
Slightly off-topic, but if you use any half-decent CAD software (eg. AutoCAD) and the PDF has been created using CAD software, you will frequently find that the PDF 'remembers' the CAD geometry... so that if you insert it into your CAD drawing, you can snap to vector points on the PDF just as you could if it was a vector CAD file.(it converts the linework into a series of vector dots) it allows you to reference the services into your cad file to coordinate around. Hope that helps a bit.
Failing that (if the PDF has no retained geometry), I usually just insert it into AutoCAD, scale and align it to match the Promap OS data, and trace the relevant information. No need for third party software, if your CAD is up to snuff.
Thanks all. I've started by purchasing some electronic plans for Yorkshire Water - the first step is to see whether what they have mapped, matches what is actually present in my garden.
There are 3 metal manhole covers which I believe relate to a fresh/surface water drain - as you can hear it flowing very quickly when it rains. it 'sounds' like a very large diameter pipe. There is a covered beck running under the next street 100m or so away, I imagine this flows into that.
Then there are three concrete type covers running in the perpendicular direction, which from their directions and the location of our downpipes etc I assume to be the sewers. Again, I'm pretty sure these will be 'public' sewers, I.E. with more than just my house draining into them, as we are at the end of the run of houses.
I'm tempted to have a go at opening them up too for a look, see what I can learn from the directions of pipe runs.
I'll share the map once it turns up!
There are 3 metal manhole covers which I believe relate to a fresh/surface water drain - as you can hear it flowing very quickly when it rains. it 'sounds' like a very large diameter pipe. There is a covered beck running under the next street 100m or so away, I imagine this flows into that.
Then there are three concrete type covers running in the perpendicular direction, which from their directions and the location of our downpipes etc I assume to be the sewers. Again, I'm pretty sure these will be 'public' sewers, I.E. with more than just my house draining into them, as we are at the end of the run of houses.
I'm tempted to have a go at opening them up too for a look, see what I can learn from the directions of pipe runs.
I'll share the map once it turns up!
Bear in mind that the YW maps may be incomplete: there was new legislation a few years ago that basically put all shared private drainage into the Water Authorities' hands and turned them into 'public' sewers.
The Water Authorities themselves do not have complete records of this drainage network, but they still need to be treated as public sewers in terms of build-over agreements.
The Water Authorities themselves do not have complete records of this drainage network, but they still need to be treated as public sewers in terms of build-over agreements.
Edited by Equus on Friday 3rd August 10:26
snotrag said:
Thanks all. I've started by purchasing some electronic plans for Yorkshire Water - the first step is to see whether what they have mapped, matches what is actually present in my garden.
Well done, a surprising amount of people trust the plans which are regularly wrong IMEIt can be helpful as they can't prove you've moved something if they didn't know it was there !
I ran a project where according to the UU maps the public 150mm SW sewer was 6m away from the proposed extension and running alongside the site boundary.
Work commenced and the drain was in fact smack bang below the extension at 2.5m depth. It was a royal pain in the arse dealing with the officious UU people who at first said you can't build it - the contract had been let by then and the work was on site so I asked them whether they would like to buy the builder out of his £200k contract and compensate my client. There was a breakout of common sense and they insisted on before and after camera survey. We ended up with ground beams and concrete pillars to bridge the drain.
It all ended okay buy since then I have always taken utility maps with a large bag of salt.
Work commenced and the drain was in fact smack bang below the extension at 2.5m depth. It was a royal pain in the arse dealing with the officious UU people who at first said you can't build it - the contract had been let by then and the work was on site so I asked them whether they would like to buy the builder out of his £200k contract and compensate my client. There was a breakout of common sense and they insisted on before and after camera survey. We ended up with ground beams and concrete pillars to bridge the drain.
It all ended okay buy since then I have always taken utility maps with a large bag of salt.
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