Visited the UK a few weeks back, wasn't so bad
Discussion
James6112 said:
Sounds like the Australian news outlets are as depressing/fake news, as the Uk ones…
Probably owned by the same people that slag off Australia here !
In Australia the majority of the news media is owned by Murdoch's NewsCorp (approx 65%) with the lions share of the rest owned by the Packer's Nine Entertainment (about 25%). The ABC probably takes most of the remainder with a few independent papers in isolated cities accounting for a % or so. Probably owned by the same people that slag off Australia here !
Kermit power said:
The immigration is front and centre in this respect.
We've got an ageing population, yet people don't want to work for longer, so we simply have no choice but to allow immigration.
The problem is that quite a lot of those people who don't want to work longer also don't want immigration, so how does the government square that circle? !
ageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
robm3 said:
As the title says, I was in London, Warwick and then North Wales.
To be honest I was expecting worse.
In Australia we hear a lot about your issues with crime, illegal immigration and rising costs. But from my two weeks there, all seemed to be ticking along as it always was (I lived there 20 years back for 8 years).
If I was to be picky I found the unrelenting speed cameras on the motorway a bit of pain, and there seems to be a bit more traffic, aside from that, it was 'as you were'.
Just pointing out maybe it's not as bad as many on PH and the media seem to think.
I love this country. It’s not perfect, but it’s still fTo be honest I was expecting worse.
In Australia we hear a lot about your issues with crime, illegal immigration and rising costs. But from my two weeks there, all seemed to be ticking along as it always was (I lived there 20 years back for 8 years).
If I was to be picky I found the unrelenting speed cameras on the motorway a bit of pain, and there seems to be a bit more traffic, aside from that, it was 'as you were'.
Just pointing out maybe it's not as bad as many on PH and the media seem to think.
king awesome. Glad you had a nice time! Nethybridge said:
We do have a choice, Australia manages, they also have an
ageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
From the horse’s mouth, 29.5% of Australia’s population was born overseasageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/populatio...
funinhounslow said:
Nethybridge said:
We do have a choice, Australia manages, they also have an
ageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
From the horse’s mouth, 29.5% of Australia’s population was born overseasageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/populatio...
Seems like the English are trying to get away from something.
funinhounslow said:
Nethybridge said:
We do have a choice, Australia manages, they also have an
ageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
From the horse’s mouth, 29.5% of Australia’s population was born overseasageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/populatio...
People got spun this farce as part of the Brexit campaign!
Whatever way you look at it if we don't have immigration, over the next 15 years, a million more people will leave the workforce through retirement than will join it through coming of age.
Cloudy147 said:
I love this country. It’s not perfect, but it’s still fking awesome. Glad you had a nice time!
Yep, life is actually pretty pleasant, but patently aware that for others the complete opposite is the case. No need to emphasise why life and this country is good from a personal perspective, but like any country there is a dark underbelly. Nothing a glass of wine and a hug can’t sort when wifey gets home shortly after a shift. king awesome. Glad you had a nice time! Kermit power said:
Skeptisk said:
The problem with national borders is that it gives the false impression of uniformity. The U.K. is very diverse with huge differences in wealth, class, ethnicity and culture between (and even within), areas, towns and cities. Those differences seem much larger than many other countries I’ve lived in. If you went to some sleepy village in Surrey full of city types, thatched cottages, village pubs and £5 million houses then went to the poor areas of former industrial towns up north there doesn’t seem much in common apart from the language (and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
Why do people keep coming out with this ludicrous hyperbole? 
In the 2021 census, 91.1% of residents in England & Wales spoke English or Welsh as their first language. That leaves 7.1% who speak English either well or very well, 1.5% who speak it poorly and just 0.3% who couldn't speak it at all.
Even if that 7.1% chose in their entirety not to speak English despite doing so well, I'd question whether 8.9% of the population is enough to constitute many places as opposed to some places, and once you factor in the relatively large number of people living here from Western European countries who don't tend to congregate in specific communities, the reality is that the place most of these non English-speaking communities are living is rent free inside the heads of the UKIP and GB News brigage.
Go to my hometown and the truth is English is not the first language heard in the town centre.
Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
Kermit power said:
funinhounslow said:
Nethybridge said:
We do have a choice, Australia manages, they also have an
ageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
From the horse’s mouth, 29.5% of Australia’s population was born overseasageing population and a similar low birth rate, but don't
feel the need to give thousands of Sri Lankans and Nigerians
Australian passports to work in their care homes and hospitals.
https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/people/populatio...
People got spun this farce as part of the Brexit campaign!
Whatever way you look at it if we don't have immigration, over the next 15 years, a million more people will leave the workforce through retirement than will join it through coming of age.
Problem sorted
Thanks
C70Rev said:
Go to my hometown and the truth is English is not the first language heard in the town centre.
Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
Why would anyone be intimidated even if they weren't a heavily-built PH Director-type? Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
I'm 5ft 6in and 65kg - I was 59kg when I was dating an Indian Muslim girl at 20 during the Apartheid years in SA and visited her in an Indian area. I was the only white guy for miles around. No intimidation. In SA.
I certainly would not feel intimidated by a walk through Bradford or Birmingham!
The street my girlfriends house is on is predominantly folks from Afghanistan and China and they are lovely - her neighbours in particular. She's sad to leave them when she moves in with me.
Yeah, the UK is increasingly cosmopolitan. Good.
Skeptisk said:
If you went to some sleepy village in Surrey full of city types, thatched cottages, village pubs and £5 million houses then went to the poor areas of former industrial towns up north there doesn’t seem much in common apart from the language (and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
All sounds very anecdotal to me.C70Rev said:
Kermit power said:
Skeptisk said:
The problem with national borders is that it gives the false impression of uniformity. The U.K. is very diverse with huge differences in wealth, class, ethnicity and culture between (and even within), areas, towns and cities. Those differences seem much larger than many other countries I’ve lived in. If you went to some sleepy village in Surrey full of city types, thatched cottages, village pubs and £5 million houses then went to the poor areas of former industrial towns up north there doesn’t seem much in common apart from the language (and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
Why do people keep coming out with this ludicrous hyperbole? In the 2021 census, 91.1% of residents in England & Wales spoke English or Welsh as their first language. That leaves 7.1% who speak English either well or very well, 1.5% who speak it poorly and just 0.3% who couldn't speak it at all.
Even if that 7.1% chose in their entirety not to speak English despite doing so well, I'd question whether 8.9% of the population is enough to constitute many places as opposed to some places, and once you factor in the relatively large number of people living here from Western European countries who don't tend to congregate in specific communities, the reality is that the place most of these non English-speaking communities are living is rent free inside the heads of the UKIP and GB News brigage.
Go to my hometown and the truth is English is not the first language heard in the town centre.
Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
Jonathan27 said:
C70Rev said:
Kermit power said:
Skeptisk said:
The problem with national borders is that it gives the false impression of uniformity. The U.K. is very diverse with huge differences in wealth, class, ethnicity and culture between (and even within), areas, towns and cities. Those differences seem much larger than many other countries I’ve lived in. If you went to some sleepy village in Surrey full of city types, thatched cottages, village pubs and £5 million houses then went to the poor areas of former industrial towns up north there doesn’t seem much in common apart from the language (and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
Why do people keep coming out with this ludicrous hyperbole? In the 2021 census, 91.1% of residents in England & Wales spoke English or Welsh as their first language. That leaves 7.1% who speak English either well or very well, 1.5% who speak it poorly and just 0.3% who couldn't speak it at all.
Even if that 7.1% chose in their entirety not to speak English despite doing so well, I'd question whether 8.9% of the population is enough to constitute many places as opposed to some places, and once you factor in the relatively large number of people living here from Western European countries who don't tend to congregate in specific communities, the reality is that the place most of these non English-speaking communities are living is rent free inside the heads of the UKIP and GB News brigage.
Go to my hometown and the truth is English is not the first language heard in the town centre.
Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
MC Bodge said:
Skeptisk said:
(and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
Many places?Can you show these vast swathes of not-English speaking?
Even Wales is mostly English speaking.
Similarly I went back to my home town recently (a bit of a dump not far from London). There were very few non whites there when I was growing up, some Indians and a very few from the Caribbean, so English was completely dominant. Yet I heard quite a lot of different languages on my most recent trip.
It all depends upon perspective too. Take Luton (not far from my home town). I don’t have the percentages for the past but I suspect that English was the first languages of nearly 100% in the 1970s. Now it is down to 75%. Some might say that 75% is a lot as still a clear majority but then for others it is a massive drop from 100% (you would probably have to go back nearly a 1000 years to see a large number of non local language speakers).
C70Rev said:
Kermit power said:
Skeptisk said:
The problem with national borders is that it gives the false impression of uniformity. The U.K. is very diverse with huge differences in wealth, class, ethnicity and culture between (and even within), areas, towns and cities. Those differences seem much larger than many other countries I’ve lived in. If you went to some sleepy village in Surrey full of city types, thatched cottages, village pubs and £5 million houses then went to the poor areas of former industrial towns up north there doesn’t seem much in common apart from the language (and even then in many places you don’t hear much English these days).
Why do people keep coming out with this ludicrous hyperbole? In the 2021 census, 91.1% of residents in England & Wales spoke English or Welsh as their first language. That leaves 7.1% who speak English either well or very well, 1.5% who speak it poorly and just 0.3% who couldn't speak it at all.
Even if that 7.1% chose in their entirety not to speak English despite doing so well, I'd question whether 8.9% of the population is enough to constitute many places as opposed to some places, and once you factor in the relatively large number of people living here from Western European countries who don't tend to congregate in specific communities, the reality is that the place most of these non English-speaking communities are living is rent free inside the heads of the UKIP and GB News brigage.
Is that to do with the hotels not taking bookings due to being full?
Hyperbole, I think not. This is from experience of not being able to book a local hotel to visit my 94 year old mother and when I venture to the town centre it is full of foreign speaking men.
I’m 6ft and fairly large so am not intimidated. However it is not pleasant for others.
It's easy to nominate it as one of these "many places" if you don't name it, so nobody else can provide their perspective.
Skeptisk said:
Many is a poorly defined word, open to interpretation. It doesn’t mean the majority and I didn’t mean to imply that. It is also relative. When I used to travel into central London as a teenager I don’t recall hearing foreign languages being spoken. I am very interested in languages (working on my eighth at the moment) so it would have been something I noticed. Some months back I took my wife and daughter to see an art exhibition and we all commented upon the number of different languages we were hearing and the relative absence of English.
Similarly I went back to my home town recently (a bit of a dump not far from London). There were very few non whites there when I was growing up, some Indians and a very few from the Caribbean, so English was completely dominant. Yet I heard quite a lot of different languages on my most recent trip.
It all depends upon perspective too. Take Luton (not far from my home town). I don’t have the percentages for the past but I suspect that English was the first languages of nearly 100% in the 1970s. Now it is down to 75%. Some might say that 75% is a lot as still a clear majority but then for others it is a massive drop from 100% (you would probably have to go back nearly a 1000 years to see a large number of non local language speakers).
Yes, "many" is open to interpretation, but it certainly isn't synonymous with "a tiny minority", which is far closer to the truth when it comes to places in the UK where you don't hear English spoken!Similarly I went back to my home town recently (a bit of a dump not far from London). There were very few non whites there when I was growing up, some Indians and a very few from the Caribbean, so English was completely dominant. Yet I heard quite a lot of different languages on my most recent trip.
It all depends upon perspective too. Take Luton (not far from my home town). I don’t have the percentages for the past but I suspect that English was the first languages of nearly 100% in the 1970s. Now it is down to 75%. Some might say that 75% is a lot as still a clear majority but then for others it is a massive drop from 100% (you would probably have to go back nearly a 1000 years to see a large number of non local language speakers).
As for an art exhibition in London, that hardly means anything, considering that in any ranking you care to look at London is in the top three destinations for global tourism, and things like art exhibitions are always a lure for tourists! According to Mastercard, visitors with cards issued in other countries spend almost $20Bn per annum in London, so long may it continue!
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