Private schools, times a changing?
Discussion
Harry Flashman said:
I would love to replicate your approach, but it would involve my children not being able to foster an innately superior arrogance. That pretence, expectation and snobbery are, after all, what the whole point of private schooling is, right? Right?
Indeed - white, upper class privilege doesn't just 'happen' - somebody's got to work hard for itClaphamGT3 said:
Harry Flashman said:
I would love to replicate your approach, but it would involve my children not being able to foster an innately superior arrogance. That pretence, expectation and snobbery are, after all, what the whole point of private schooling is, right? Right?
Indeed - white, upper class privilege doesn't just 'happen' - somebody's got to work hard for itAstonZagato said:
Boom78 said:
On top of all this they come out as balanced teenagers who understand the world without pretence, expectation or snobbery.
What about inverted snobbery?
Good on them if they can (and want to) do better than a stuck up Rupert who’s been pampered, bank rolled and had everything laid on for them all their lives. Probably a massively sweeping generalisation (but that’s what PH is all about) but all the lads I’ve met who went to private or boarding schools turned out to be either entitled limp wristed toffs or went totally off the rails in a race to the bottom. Very little in between and none of them even marginally successful
Edited by Boom78 on Sunday 14th May 09:02
Edited by Boom78 on Sunday 14th May 09:02
Boom78 said:
AstonZagato said:
Boom78 said:
On top of all this they come out as balanced teenagers who understand the world without pretence, expectation or snobbery.
What about inverted snobbery? Good on them if they can (and expect to) do better than a stuck up Rupert who’s been pampered, bank rolled and had everything laid on for them all their lives. Probably a massively sweeping generalisation (but that’s what PH is all about) but all the lads I’ve met who went to private or boarding schools turned out to be either entitled limp wristed toffs or went totally off the rails in a race to the bottom. Very little in between.
I’ve always found that there are enough toffs in the country to compensate for the failures. It’s definitely an unfair system but it’s natural to want the best education you can give and there’s no doubt it gives an advantage.
I’ve relatives in other countries. Some systems are worse than here, some are very much better. But I can’t envisage it changing here. There are too many vested interests.
Boom78 said:
Probably a massively sweeping generalisation (but that’s what PH is all about) but all the lads I’ve met who went to private or boarding schools turned out to be either entitled limp wristed toffs or went totally off the rails in a race to the bottom. Very little in between and none of them even marginally successful
Edited by Boom78 on Sunday 14th May 09:02
Entirely understandable to receive criticism/incredulity/ridicule for spending so much money on your kids. We probably all have created a spreadsheet forecasting the fees at the beginning, uttered a string of expletives under our breath and then as the years go by resolutely refuse to reopen the thing. None of us want to shell out what could buy a variety of very nice cars in the prime of our lives.
But we do. Mainly because somehow, either by luck, judgment or a combination of both, we can, and we find it hard to deny the opportunity of what we judge a better education to our children.
I have three dyslexic, sporty and musical kids. Learning support, sports facilities and musical tuition are in theory things I could try to find outside school life. But f
k me its so much easier to have it within along with small class sizes etc etc.
But we do. Mainly because somehow, either by luck, judgment or a combination of both, we can, and we find it hard to deny the opportunity of what we judge a better education to our children.
I have three dyslexic, sporty and musical kids. Learning support, sports facilities and musical tuition are in theory things I could try to find outside school life. But f
k me its so much easier to have it within along with small class sizes etc etc.
I wonder how many of those of us thinking/sending kids to private options went themselves.
A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
okgo said:
I wonder how many of those of us thinking/sending kids to private options went themselves.
A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
Your parents would have had to have been very careful about the choice of private school for you - many show the door to kids who are going to mess up the school’s exam stats.A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
Sheepshanks said:
Your parents would have had to have been very careful about the choice of private school for you - many show the door to kids who are going to mess up the school’s exam stats.
The time to go was obvious to me, early secondary years if not from the start of secondary. By the time I was a teenager the rot had set in. The problem was that my dad showed attitudes like the ones above - self made, only ever worked for himself and therefore why can’t anyone else, survivorship bias (and a tight git too so paid school wouldn’t have appealed). Well, that didn’t work out so well for me!
I know a very wide range of people.
Some went to private schools (including some very famous, old, private schools), some went to the local comprehensive school, with everything in-between.
Some are wealthy, some are very wealthy, some are fairly poor, most have enough (although an angst-ridden PHer would probably not think so). The wealthy ones are not necessarily the ones who went to fee-paying schools.
Happiness doesn't appear to correlate with school fees.
NB. The people that I have remained friendly with are the inquisitive, active, ones with a broad range of interests - and the time to take part in them.
Some went to private schools (including some very famous, old, private schools), some went to the local comprehensive school, with everything in-between.
Some are wealthy, some are very wealthy, some are fairly poor, most have enough (although an angst-ridden PHer would probably not think so). The wealthy ones are not necessarily the ones who went to fee-paying schools.
Happiness doesn't appear to correlate with school fees.
NB. The people that I have remained friendly with are the inquisitive, active, ones with a broad range of interests - and the time to take part in them.
MC Bodge said:
I know a very wide range of people.
Some went to private schools (including some very famous, old, private schools), some went to the local comprehensive school, with everything in-between.
Some are wealthy, some are very wealthy, some are fairly poor, most have enough (although an angst-ridden PHer would probably not think so). The wealthy ones are not necessarily the ones who went to fee-paying schools.
Happiness doesn't appear to correlate with school fees.
NB. The people that I have remained friendly with are the inquisitive, active, ones with a broad range of interests - and the time to take part in them.
All of the people I know who went to private school have all gone a bit loopy around 40Some went to private schools (including some very famous, old, private schools), some went to the local comprehensive school, with everything in-between.
Some are wealthy, some are very wealthy, some are fairly poor, most have enough (although an angst-ridden PHer would probably not think so). The wealthy ones are not necessarily the ones who went to fee-paying schools.
Happiness doesn't appear to correlate with school fees.
NB. The people that I have remained friendly with are the inquisitive, active, ones with a broad range of interests - and the time to take part in them.
It’s about 40% private school folk at my work, they all seem hard work to deal with
okgo said:
The time to go was obvious to me, early secondary years if not from the start of secondary. By the time I was a teenager the rot had set in.
The problem was that my dad showed attitudes like the ones above - self made, only ever worked for himself and therefore why can’t anyone else, survivorship bias (and a tight git too so paid school wouldn’t have appealed). Well, that didn’t work out so well for me!
And yet, here you are, on this thread about school fees (and other threads talking about wealth).The problem was that my dad showed attitudes like the ones above - self made, only ever worked for himself and therefore why can’t anyone else, survivorship bias (and a tight git too so paid school wouldn’t have appealed). Well, that didn’t work out so well for me!
okgo said:
MC Bodge said:
And yet, here you are, on this thread about school fees and others talking about wealth.
I’d say that shows a level of awareness that my father didn’t have. Survivorship bias is a dangerous thing when it comes to children’s lives. Spare tyre said:
All of the people I know who went to private school have all gone a bit loopy around 40
It’s about 40% private school folk at my work, they all seem hard work to deal with
I wonder if there is a correlation between state/private schooling and mongrel/ pedigree dogs? Your state school pupil/mongrel (me), nothing flashy or special but well rounded with no specific negative physical of mental traits, compared to private pupils/pedigree dogs, flashy, distinctive and on the face of it having all the advantages but beset by health and behavioural problems? It’s about 40% private school folk at my work, they all seem hard work to deal with
okgo said:
I wonder how many of those of us thinking/sending kids to private options went themselves.
A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
I'm not aware of anyone in my family who went to state school before my children's generation.A large part of the reason I considered it in the first place was because of the state secondary I attended (which I’m sure is miles better than most) didn’t have the capacity to help kids who were not very self motivated/interested. I left there with a handful of pants GCSE’s and no further qualifications despite being quite bright in primary.
My children and my eldest brother's children have been privately educated throughout (although my eldest is making noises about wanting to go to a state 6th form college because she's worried about positive discrimination in her university applications)
My second eldest brother sent his two to the maintained sector for primary school, managing things very carefully to make sure they were at an OFSTED outstanding faith-based primary. His son then went into the independent sector on a sports scholarship and his daughter went to a highly selective, non fee-paying faith secondary school.
My third eldest brother, who is married to a very politically militant teacher, sent his four to the local primary and the local comp. No attempt at going for any schools other than the ones 'the system' threw up but lots of support to the children from Mum and tutors.
All eleven of them are much of a muchness academically but the self confidence, the ambition and - increasingly as they get older - the achievement of the privately educated ones is night and day compared to the four who went to state schools. Even Claudia, who went to what my brother always refers to as a free independent school, is noticeably less self confident and rounded than her brother who went to Millfield.
My eldest brother who lives in Norfolk wonders whether it was worth paying for pre-prep and whether they should have sent theirs to the village primary until the age of eight. Living in London, that wasn't an option for us.
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