Covid 19 Vaccine - will you have it ?
Discussion
A good friend of ours is lecturer at university, lectures in virology etc. Pretty much every nurse in the lectures is against having the untested vaccine and so is she despite the fact that she's meant to be promoting it. To properly develop and test a vaccine it takes 10-12 years. Shockingly this one is being developed in months and the manufacturers will have no liability for any complications caused, completely immune from any prosecutions or lawsuits. The flu vaccine is only about 45% effective anyway.
Screechmr2 said:
A good friend of ours is lecturer at university, lectures in virology etc. Pretty much every nurse in the lectures is against having the untested vaccine and so is she despite the fact that she's meant to be promoting it. To properly develop and test a vaccine it takes 10-12 years. Shockingly this one is being developed in months and the manufacturers will have no liability for any complications caused, completely immune from any prosecutions or lawsuits. The flu vaccine is only about 45% effective anyway.
Correct. Additionally, it will also be excluded from the governments vaccine compensation scheme. Pretty much says it all.
With a low mortality rate for a virus the 'experts' still don't fully understand, you'd be mad to have something injected into your body right now especially with the manufactures having an unusual 'no liability clause'.
Has there ever been been a successful vaccine for any other Coronavirus over the decades? How on earth can they make and fully test something in under a year?
Just look what happened with the Swine flu vaccine (which was later withdrawn after the damage was done) and the problems its causing such as narcolepsy https://www.narcolepsy.org.uk/resources/pandemrix-...
Anyone thinking this vaccine is the magic bullet will be disappointed (or will just re-assure them and give a false sense of security).
Has there ever been been a successful vaccine for any other Coronavirus over the decades? How on earth can they make and fully test something in under a year?
Just look what happened with the Swine flu vaccine (which was later withdrawn after the damage was done) and the problems its causing such as narcolepsy https://www.narcolepsy.org.uk/resources/pandemrix-...
Anyone thinking this vaccine is the magic bullet will be disappointed (or will just re-assure them and give a false sense of security).
Edited by stabilio on Wednesday 30th September 06:20
I've volunteered for a Phase 3 trail as well, just waiting to see I will get accepted.
As for the above, there are still liability and compensation clauses, at least in the documents I've seen. The trial I've signed up for has already been through Phases 1 and 2 with no ill effects reported to date and positive anti-body results.
Either I'll get a placebo and no ill effects or I might get a vaccine that so far has been positive and will give me some limited protection, whichever one I get I'll be helping getting everyone back to some kind of normality.
I can drop out at anytime if I feel the risk is too great to carry on.
As for the above, there are still liability and compensation clauses, at least in the documents I've seen. The trial I've signed up for has already been through Phases 1 and 2 with no ill effects reported to date and positive anti-body results.
Either I'll get a placebo and no ill effects or I might get a vaccine that so far has been positive and will give me some limited protection, whichever one I get I'll be helping getting everyone back to some kind of normality.
I can drop out at anytime if I feel the risk is too great to carry on.
Australia - vaccine suppliers to be given indemnity for 'inevitable' side effects, and no government compensation scheme.
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/morrison-g...
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/morrison-g...
Chris Type R said:
I think front-line staff would be prioritised - by the time it gets to the general population it's likely to have been 'tested'.
They should be, but they aren't currently, so I see no reason that'll change. Covid tests for the general public promise results in 48 hours, whereas healthcare workers go through a different system which is 5-7 days. Doctors and nurses all over the UK are self isolating, and not out treating patients, for days whilst they wait for their test results, and often this can mean the closure of medical facilities for this period. Sounds bizarre, but it's how things are working, at least in our area that's how it is.But......... we'll maybe have a HUGE 2nd wave before the vaccine(s) become a reality, due to the 'spin' put on this by the manufacturers (wow our shares have gone up!) and the media (we bring you the good news!). Only yesterday I heard a member of staff in the builders' merchants say "It'll be ok now we have the vaccine" - I looked to see him grin as he said this (he wasn't wearing a mask) and it became clear he was deadly serious! If many think like this there will be minimal social distancing despite what Boris or Van Tam are advising.
RobM77 said:
Me too, but personally I'd want to see the results of that testing first. So far all we have are the results of a preliminary in-house trial giving its efficacy.
king misery and I get to go back and sit on a beach in Oz. If I end up with an extra toe then fk it, when I eventually sever one doing DIY in flip flops I’ll be sorted.I work in aviation. No one gets on a plane having asked to see the credentials of everyone involved in that flight (a hell of a lot of people) or the data used to determine the safety risks, we just put our faith in the processes. By and large they work.
djc206 said:
RobM77 said:
Me too, but personally I'd want to see the results of that testing first. So far all we have are the results of a preliminary in-house trial giving its efficacy.king misery and I get to go back and sit on a beach in Oz. If I end up with an extra toe then fk it, when I eventually sever one doing DIY in flip flops I’ll be sorted.I work in aviation. No one gets on a plane having asked to see the credentials of everyone involved in that flight (a hell of a lot of people) or the data used to determine the safety risks, we just put our faith in the processes. By and large they work.
The aviation analogy shows this well. As you know, safety standards in aviation are sky high these days (pardon the pun), and all planes go through rigorous testing in development programmes that last years. Covid arrived barely 12 months ago. Imagine if the DH Comet was put back into service days after the string of terrible accidents it had - would you at least want to know what the problem was and how it was fixed before you stepped aboard?
RobM77 said:
That's because all other vaccines have been thoroughly tried and tested over decades. What's happening here is very unusual: the government are pushing a vaccine hard (my wife is a GP partner and she's already been asked to plan to deliver it), without any published results. I can't remember when that's ever happened before. We will get published results before the vaccine gets rolled out, but I just want a quick glance at them first, or at least ask someone trained to read them what they think (like my wife).
Oh there is precedent -https://www.buzzfeed.com/shaunlintern/these-nhs-st...
djc206 said:
Honestly I don’t care. I’ve never asked for the results of any other vaccine tests or drugs or medical procedures before and even if I had I’m woefully under qualified to assess the results. I’ll trust the process and gleefully accept the jab if it ends this fking misery and I get to go back and sit on a beach in Oz. If I end up with an extra toe then fk it, when I eventually sever one doing DIY in flip flops I’ll be sorted.
I work in aviation. No one gets on a plane having asked to see the credentials of everyone involved in that flight (a hell of a lot of people) or the data used to determine the safety risks, we just put our faith in the processes. By and large they work.
That is a great analogy completely agree. I'm on the Oxford vaccine trial, had 2 doses and no extra toe yet, unless I've had a placebo and they're hiding the 6 toed ones somewhere else...king misery and I get to go back and sit on a beach in Oz. If I end up with an extra toe then fk it, when I eventually sever one doing DIY in flip flops I’ll be sorted.I work in aviation. No one gets on a plane having asked to see the credentials of everyone involved in that flight (a hell of a lot of people) or the data used to determine the safety risks, we just put our faith in the processes. By and large they work.
I'll take up the offer as life's too short and ideally I'd hope countries insist on making proof of vaccination as a condition of entry like some African countries did over Yellow Fever. That said how you'd police a registration scheme will be problematic with forgers and those types who refuse to carry confirmation of ID or believe the 'State' will use the data against them 
Those that don't want it can stay at home and I can get off abroad and have freedom of movement.
That said I do remember that MP eating a raw sausage saying there was nowt wrong with British beef just before the BSE crisis
Those that don't want it can stay at home and I can get off abroad and have freedom of movement.
That said I do remember that MP eating a raw sausage saying there was nowt wrong with British beef just before the BSE crisis
The same quality and safety standards will have been met here as any other medicine, and the standards employed to show effectiveness are (I believe) standard. They have also been independently scrutinised on a global scale.
If it gets a licence, you will be guaranteed to be getting a vaccine as safe as any other, and they are very safe.
The only real push here I've seen in work (we have lots of covid-19 related trials and a few vaccines) has been to accrue the data quickly and get the administrative processes accelerated in a carefully designed trial. Actually my biggest problem at work at the moment is trying to get hospitals to do research other than covid-19.
But twelve years I've been trying to get these drugs to market, and I can confidently say that patient/participant safety is at the centre of all of our processes, and it always has been. We are largely composed of parents with healthcare backgrounds, and we are used to working in an extremely transparent manner.
I have four kids, and two elderly parents. I'd give any of the vaccines which get a licence.
It's very disappointing to see how influenced people have been by the "anti-vaxxer" brigade. It really will come back to haunt us all if we don't get good compliance with vaccine roll outs.
If it gets a licence, you will be guaranteed to be getting a vaccine as safe as any other, and they are very safe.
The only real push here I've seen in work (we have lots of covid-19 related trials and a few vaccines) has been to accrue the data quickly and get the administrative processes accelerated in a carefully designed trial. Actually my biggest problem at work at the moment is trying to get hospitals to do research other than covid-19.
But twelve years I've been trying to get these drugs to market, and I can confidently say that patient/participant safety is at the centre of all of our processes, and it always has been. We are largely composed of parents with healthcare backgrounds, and we are used to working in an extremely transparent manner.
I have four kids, and two elderly parents. I'd give any of the vaccines which get a licence.
It's very disappointing to see how influenced people have been by the "anti-vaxxer" brigade. It really will come back to haunt us all if we don't get good compliance with vaccine roll outs.
Edited by Prof Prolapse on Thursday 12th November 09:19
grumbledoak said:
Oh there is precedent -
https://www.buzzfeed.com/shaunlintern/these-nhs-st...
It says a lot that your only argument against vaccines is Pandremix. Oh no, there's a miniscule chance the vaccine might make me fall asleep, the horror!https://www.buzzfeed.com/shaunlintern/these-nhs-st...
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