PH Losers 2020 - Anyone want to join me?
Discussion
Weight static this past week at 95.5kg which is a little frustrating, but fat continues to go according to clothes and muscle still seemingly growing also according to clothes.
However I've added 55kg to my lat pull downs, 36kg to bent over barbell rows, 21kg to chest fly, 20kg to deadlift and 25kg to my bench press since I started, as well as progressing every session (all based on 4 x 8 reps as opposed to 1rep max).
Not big gains compared to some of the monsters on here, but for little old me, I'm quite chuffed with that.
Getting fitter also allows you to think about doing things that you wouldn't have thought of before. So when I woke up last Friday to freezing fog, I thought that work could wait for a bit whilst I took the dog up a mountain (ok large hill...) straight after dropping my daughter off at school.
Managed to climb above the fog
However I've added 55kg to my lat pull downs, 36kg to bent over barbell rows, 21kg to chest fly, 20kg to deadlift and 25kg to my bench press since I started, as well as progressing every session (all based on 4 x 8 reps as opposed to 1rep max).
Not big gains compared to some of the monsters on here, but for little old me, I'm quite chuffed with that.
Getting fitter also allows you to think about doing things that you wouldn't have thought of before. So when I woke up last Friday to freezing fog, I thought that work could wait for a bit whilst I took the dog up a mountain (ok large hill...) straight after dropping my daughter off at school.
Managed to climb above the fog
ben5575 said:
However I've added 55kg to my lat pull downs, 36kg to bent over barbell rows, 21kg to chest fly, 20kg to deadlift and 25kg to my bench press since I started, as well as progressing every session (all based on 4 x 8 reps as opposed to 1rep max).
Forgive the simple question but what are the pros and cons of going to 4 x 8 vs 1 rep max?I'm currently doing a fairly simple routine of 9 weights exercises, 3 sets with 15 reps per set -
Reverse curls, bent over row, front raise, front squat, overhead press, standing calf raises, shrug triceps extensions and 21s
Given my distinct lack of muscles I've only been using 13.6kg of weights plus the 5kg of the bar. Planning to buy some heavier weights this week as I've not really seen any real gains after a few weeks of doing that routine twice a week.
giblet said:
ben5575 said:
However I've added 55kg to my lat pull downs, 36kg to bent over barbell rows, 21kg to chest fly, 20kg to deadlift and 25kg to my bench press since I started, as well as progressing every session (all based on 4 x 8 reps as opposed to 1rep max).
Forgive the simple question but what are the pros and cons of going to 4 x 8 vs 1 rep max?I'm currently doing a fairly simple routine of 9 weights exercises, 3 sets with 15 reps per set -
Reverse curls, bent over row, front raise, front squat, overhead press, standing calf raises, shrug triceps extensions and 21s
Given my distinct lack of muscles I've only been using 13.6kg of weights plus the 5kg of the bar. Planning to buy some heavier weights this week as I've not really seen any real gains after a few weeks of doing that routine twice a week.
My 1RM on the leg press is 395kg - I'd have no chance of doing 5 sets of 5 reps at that weight however! The loading chart shows that for that I should be pushing approx. 300kg, 5x5. Once you start building that up you'd do a new 1RM down the line which will show your strength progress and also set the new 5x5 target.
AIUI, some exercises (such as chest press etc) are designed to progressively fatigue bigger muscles so you'd do 12 reps, then 10, then 8, then 6 and push the weight up slightly each set. Other exercises are designed for smaller muscles that fatigue more easily (eg. triceps) so they're 10 reps x 2 sets.
My 1RMs show that on the bench press I went up 30% in 8 weeks (from 39kg to 51) on shoulder press I only went from 41kg to 43 (5%), plank went from 43 to 70 sec (63% improvement) and the leg press isn't really valid as I switched machines from 141kg on the horizontal machine to the 395kg on the 45-degree machine. For some reason I found it much easier to do bigger weights on the latter, so it'll be interesting to see what I can push that to; my PT says I should be aiming to get to 500kg over the next 8 weeks...
My PT's also put together a shoulder-specific programme for me which is great as it's my weakest area and the one I need to work on.
Edited by Funk on Monday 10th February 17:33
Firstly there are far, far more experienced and knowledgable people on here than me so anything I say below is caveated accordingly (e.g. I am still very much a beginner).
Very(!) simplistically, there are three types of training; strength, hypertrophy (building muscle and focusing more on what you look like) and muscle endurance. Think world's strongest man vs Hugh Jackman vs endurance athlete. You need to decide what you're after and train accordingly.
So gym wise and in turn:
Strength is something like (google) 'Strong Lifts' that focus on say 5 sets of 5 reps (see @Funk above) various 'compound lifts' three times per week to start with. Where a 'compound lift' is an exercise that uses lots of different muscles (say like a dead lift or your bent over row) as opposed to an 'isolation exercise' (like your front raises/calf raises)
Hypertrophy (what I focus on) is typically 3 or 4 sets of between 6-12 reps on a challenging weight (say 60%-80%). I find 4x8 something that challenges but is doable and doable is important because if it's not, I'm likely to give up!
Endurance is 2 or 3 sets of higher and lighter (say 50/60% of max) 15+ reps
The key thing is something called 'Progressive Overload'. Basically if you start lifting weights, you'll be sore to start with but then your body adapts once it can lift the weights you're using and won't grow anymore because it simply doesn't need to (1000's years of evolution). What you need to do is increase your workout, every workout. So this could be adding a little bit more weight or maybe going from 8 to 10 reps for a set or two for example. This progressively overloads your body and keeps it building muscle.
Diet is the next thing. If you're going for strength, eat a lot more (that's why the world's strongest men look like they do).
Protein is key 1g-1.5g of protein per 1kg of body weight. You need protein to build muscle. Protein is also highly thermogenic which is a fancy way of saying your body has to use a lot of energy to process/digest it vs say sugar. This is good because just by eating it you are burning more calories.
What is difficult however, is trying to lose weight whilst building muscle as the two things are not conducive to one another. If you just diet, then you will lose muscle as well as fat. In the context of this thread, the trick is to try and reduce your muscle loss by lifting weights and eating lots of protein. Muscle burns calories, so the more you have of it, the quicker you'll lose weight if that makes sense? It really depends what you're looking to achieve.
Also the importance of rest; you damage your muscles in the gym, you build/grow them when you rest. If you don't rest, they don't grow (as much as they could).
So that's kind of the basics as far as I can tell, which I am sure people will add to or quite rightly correct me on.
Over and above that, there is how many times per week you train (as a minimum I would aim for three times rather than twice, but then twice is better than none!), how you 'split' those days (full body/upper/lower/push/pull/legs etc etc - google is your friend) and finally what exercises you do - the best bang for buck are the compound exercises.
TLDR: Google Strong Lifts, Hypertrophy, Compound Lifts, Progressive Overload, Weight Training Splits.
All sounds very complicated, but in short, try to train your full body three times per week, using compound lifts as much as/where possible, isolate things you want to work on (say biceps/triceps/shoulders), try a couple more reps/little bit more weight every session and eat lots of protein.
Adapt what your workout to what you can do (your lack of range of motion/mobility can be a massive issue - it is for me), for the equipment you have and which keeps you interested and motivated. All of the above is completely irrelevant to you if you get confused, bored and give up.
ETA: What other people lift is irrelevant. Focus on improving your own performance, beating your last session is the only competition you need. That said, some days you just can't do what you did last time or you're just not feeling it. This is absolutely normal and fine. Just try and do better the next time
Very(!) simplistically, there are three types of training; strength, hypertrophy (building muscle and focusing more on what you look like) and muscle endurance. Think world's strongest man vs Hugh Jackman vs endurance athlete. You need to decide what you're after and train accordingly.
So gym wise and in turn:
Strength is something like (google) 'Strong Lifts' that focus on say 5 sets of 5 reps (see @Funk above) various 'compound lifts' three times per week to start with. Where a 'compound lift' is an exercise that uses lots of different muscles (say like a dead lift or your bent over row) as opposed to an 'isolation exercise' (like your front raises/calf raises)
Hypertrophy (what I focus on) is typically 3 or 4 sets of between 6-12 reps on a challenging weight (say 60%-80%). I find 4x8 something that challenges but is doable and doable is important because if it's not, I'm likely to give up!
Endurance is 2 or 3 sets of higher and lighter (say 50/60% of max) 15+ reps
The key thing is something called 'Progressive Overload'. Basically if you start lifting weights, you'll be sore to start with but then your body adapts once it can lift the weights you're using and won't grow anymore because it simply doesn't need to (1000's years of evolution). What you need to do is increase your workout, every workout. So this could be adding a little bit more weight or maybe going from 8 to 10 reps for a set or two for example. This progressively overloads your body and keeps it building muscle.
Diet is the next thing. If you're going for strength, eat a lot more (that's why the world's strongest men look like they do).
Protein is key 1g-1.5g of protein per 1kg of body weight. You need protein to build muscle. Protein is also highly thermogenic which is a fancy way of saying your body has to use a lot of energy to process/digest it vs say sugar. This is good because just by eating it you are burning more calories.
What is difficult however, is trying to lose weight whilst building muscle as the two things are not conducive to one another. If you just diet, then you will lose muscle as well as fat. In the context of this thread, the trick is to try and reduce your muscle loss by lifting weights and eating lots of protein. Muscle burns calories, so the more you have of it, the quicker you'll lose weight if that makes sense? It really depends what you're looking to achieve.
Also the importance of rest; you damage your muscles in the gym, you build/grow them when you rest. If you don't rest, they don't grow (as much as they could).
So that's kind of the basics as far as I can tell, which I am sure people will add to or quite rightly correct me on.
Over and above that, there is how many times per week you train (as a minimum I would aim for three times rather than twice, but then twice is better than none!), how you 'split' those days (full body/upper/lower/push/pull/legs etc etc - google is your friend) and finally what exercises you do - the best bang for buck are the compound exercises.
TLDR: Google Strong Lifts, Hypertrophy, Compound Lifts, Progressive Overload, Weight Training Splits.
All sounds very complicated, but in short, try to train your full body three times per week, using compound lifts as much as/where possible, isolate things you want to work on (say biceps/triceps/shoulders), try a couple more reps/little bit more weight every session and eat lots of protein.
Adapt what your workout to what you can do (your lack of range of motion/mobility can be a massive issue - it is for me), for the equipment you have and which keeps you interested and motivated. All of the above is completely irrelevant to you if you get confused, bored and give up.
ETA: What other people lift is irrelevant. Focus on improving your own performance, beating your last session is the only competition you need. That said, some days you just can't do what you did last time or you're just not feeling it. This is absolutely normal and fine. Just try and do better the next time
Edited by ben5575 on Monday 10th February 17:31
I'm in a really good place at the moment dieting really hard 6 days a week then being more relaxed on a Saturday so I can enjoy a meal out with friends and family. I've also knocked the drink on the head for 3 months plus which has helped immensely with the diet and particularly the training.
Since New Year I'm down 11.2kg to 126.1kg, the plan is to lose the additional 26kg this year which should see me at around 10% body fat if I manage to keep the majority of my lean body mass throughout the diet.
Having my first child due beginning of June has motivated me massively not to be a fat dad,
Since New Year I'm down 11.2kg to 126.1kg, the plan is to lose the additional 26kg this year which should see me at around 10% body fat if I manage to keep the majority of my lean body mass throughout the diet.
Having my first child due beginning of June has motivated me massively not to be a fat dad,
ben5575 said:
Firstly there are far, far more experienced and knowledgable people on here than me so anything I say below is caveated accordingly (e.g. I am still very much a beginner).
Thanks for the in depth post. I guess hypertrophy is what I’m after with a bit of strength thrown in. When I stick to my meal prep I tend to get in around 100g of protein as a result of just eating grilled chicken in wholemeal wraps. giblet said:
Thanks for the in depth post. I guess hypertrophy is what I’m after with a bit of strength thrown in. When I stick to my meal prep I tend to get in around 100g of protein as a result of just eating grilled chicken in wholemeal wraps.
Yes sorry that was a bit long 
Two scoops of a protein shake would take you to c140/150g of protein.
Maybe switch out the calf raises in your routine for deadlifts if you've got enough weights to make it worth your while. If you've only got small weights, put blocks/books etc under them so you're not squatting when you start the lift.
Perhaps up to four sets of 8 or 10 reps rather than 3 x 15. Weight wise, I've never applied science and done 1RM then calculated 60/80% etc, I just kind of do the 4x8 and I know by the end of it whether I cheated and could have done more, so adjust accordingly it next time.
Play around with it. After a couple of sessions you'll have a feel for where you need to be. After that it's just consistency, progressive overload and diet. Change up the routine every couple of months.
tr7v8 said:
Huntsman said:
Funk said:
32.7kg lost in total
131 blocks of butter! That is a huge effort.
This is quite interesting a read. Even if you only do pages 7-15, it's worth the coffee break it will take I think.
https://phcuk.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Healt...
https://phcuk.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Healt...
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