Official 2023 Australian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***

[Sandpit Steve]

NRS said:

super7 said:

Tyre changes are allowed as they can’t guarantee a competitors tyres are not damaged due to the debris on the track.

What they should do is make sure a tyre is replaced with the same compound i.e. not changing from medium to hard.

If a tyre change is required the team should inform the stewards and justify the change.

You shouldn’t get a competitive advantage from it….

The issue can be is when someone is way out in front but killed their tyre to do so but it’s the last few laps so they’re fine… if they can’t change a tyre or can only change it to say a hard then they’re a sitting duck for the car behind if they were on soft. Basically it’s Abu Dhabi 21 all over again where the race is decided based on who got lucky with tyres.

If you don’t allow competitions to change tyres someone will be screwed, changing tyres someone will be screwed. Your suggest is perhaps the most fair though. That said, I think several teams didn’t have any more hard compounds to change to today.

Discussions around changing tyres have to account for the Baku 2021 scenario, where a red flag was shown for safety reasons, after two drivers suffered tyre failures in the closing stages of the race.

One idea might be to copy the F2 rule, which says that the race must feature one pit stop, as well as use both tyre types. Thus a red flag tyre change doesn’t satisfy the pit stop requirement (in a one-stop race). If that rule were in effect yesterday, we might have seen med>med>soft strategies, rather than what was looking like a tyre management race until the last drama.

[GiantCardboardPlato]

Murghee said:

Redbull have made such an amazing car which id bad for f1 viewing..once max goes ahead then there is no point watching. May aswell give him the title and move to the next season

I dunno, pretty sure Max wouldn’t want yet another gifted WDC.

[GiantCardboardPlato]

All of these posts about not being allowed to change tyres under a red flag.

I don’t get it.

What is the problem that you are trying to solve?

[NH-0]

GiantCardboardPlato said:

All of these posts about not being allowed to change tyres under a red flag.

I don’t get it.

What is the problem that you are trying to solve?

Russell being screwed over?

[PhilAsia]

NRS said:

super7 said:

Tyre changes are allowed as they can’t guarantee a competitors tyres are not damaged due to the debris on the track.

What they should do is make sure a tyre is replaced with the same compound i.e. not changing from medium to hard.

If a tyre change is required the team should inform the stewards and justify the change.

You shouldn’t get a competitive advantage from it….

The issue can be is when someone is way out in front but killed their tyre to do so but it’s the last few laps so they’re fine… if they can’t change a tyre or can only change it to say a hard then they’re a sitting duck for the car behind if they were on soft. Basically it’s Abu Dhabi 21 all over again where the race is decided based on who got lucky with tyres.

If you don’t allow competitions to change tyres someone will be screwed, changing tyres someone will be screwed. Your suggest is perhaps the most fair though. That said, I think several teams didn’t have any more hard compounds to change to today.

Have SC starts. On the formation or SC in lap, implement the gaps behind the SC that were in place between the drivers just prior to the incident that caused the flags.....

[GiantCardboardPlato]

OK, so if the problem (generalised) is that events can change the wisdom of your strategic choice after you have made and committed to that choice…

- how do you deal with rain - some people might just have pitted and it wouldn’t be fair on them that they a have to stop twice compared to everyone else just once?
- how do you deal with a safety car - some people might just have pitted and it wouldn’t be fair on them that others would be able to get a quicker stop in race time terms.
- how do you deal with accident damage that results from mistakes by other drivers - if someone crashes into a competitor, shouldn’t they then have to crash into all the competitors to make it fair?

Etc.etc.

[LP670]

PhilAsia said:

NRS said:

super7 said:

Tyre changes are allowed as they can’t guarantee a competitors tyres are not damaged due to the debris on the track.

What they should do is make sure a tyre is replaced with the same compound i.e. not changing from medium to hard.

If a tyre change is required the team should inform the stewards and justify the change.

You shouldn’t get a competitive advantage from it….

The issue can be is when someone is way out in front but killed their tyre to do so but it’s the last few laps so they’re fine… if they can’t change a tyre or can only change it to say a hard then they’re a sitting duck for the car behind if they were on soft. Basically it’s Abu Dhabi 21 all over again where the race is decided based on who got lucky with tyres.

If you don’t allow competitions to change tyres someone will be screwed, changing tyres someone will be screwed. Your suggest is perhaps the most fair though. That said, I think several teams didn’t have any more hard compounds to change to today.

Have SC starts. On the formation or SC in lap, implement the gaps behind the SC that were in place between the drivers just prior to the incident that caused the flags.....

Would agree with that or aggregate timings like in Suzuka 94

[Pflanzgarten]

Sandpit Steve said:

I think it’s the most experienced podium of all time, based on number of race starts, wins, and podium finishes at the time.

1. VER 166 starts, 37 wins, 80 podiums
2. HAM 313 starts, 103 wins, 192 podiums
3. ALO 358 starts, 32 wins, 101 podiums

Total 837 starts, 172 wins, 373 podiums.

(Sources: driver wiki pages)

Also adding to the WDC tally, you had three time champion Stewart presenting the winners trophy.

[RichB]

Pflanzgarten said:

Sandpit Steve said:

I think it’s the most experienced podium of all time, based on number of race starts, wins, and podium finishes at the time.

1. VER 166 starts, 37 wins, 80 podiums
2. HAM 313 starts, 103 wins, 192 podiums
3. ALO 358 starts, 32 wins, 101 podiums

Total 837 starts, 172 wins, 373 podiums.

(Sources: driver wiki pages)

Also adding to the WDC tally, you had three time champion Stewart presenting the winners trophy.

And don't forget the trophy is a representation of Jack Brabham's steering wheel and he's also won three world championships...

[PhilAsia]

GiantCardboardPlato said:

OK, so if the problem (generalised) is that events can change the wisdom of your strategic choice after you have made and committed to that choice…

- how do you deal with rain - some people might just have pitted and it wouldn’t be fair on them that they a have to stop twice compared to everyone else just once?
- how do you deal with a safety car - some people might just have pitted and it wouldn’t be fair on them that others would be able to get a quicker stop in race time terms.
- how do you deal with accident damage that results from mistakes by other drivers - if someone crashes into a competitor, shouldn’t they then have to crash into all the competitors to make it fair?

Etc.etc.

Very true...not easy, but we're getting there quicker than the FIA

[PhilAsia]

LP670 said:

PhilAsia said:

NRS said:

super7 said:

Tyre changes are allowed as they can’t guarantee a competitors tyres are not damaged due to the debris on the track.

What they should do is make sure a tyre is replaced with the same compound i.e. not changing from medium to hard.

If a tyre change is required the team should inform the stewards and justify the change.

You shouldn’t get a competitive advantage from it….

The issue can be is when someone is way out in front but killed their tyre to do so but it’s the last few laps so they’re fine… if they can’t change a tyre or can only change it to say a hard then they’re a sitting duck for the car behind if they were on soft. Basically it’s Abu Dhabi 21 all over again where the race is decided based on who got lucky with tyres.

If you don’t allow competitions to change tyres someone will be screwed, changing tyres someone will be screwed. Your suggest is perhaps the most fair though. That said, I think several teams didn’t have any more hard compounds to change to today.

Have SC starts. On the formation or SC in lap, implement the gaps behind the SC that were in place between the drivers just prior to the incident that caused the flags.....

Would agree with that or aggregate timings like in Suzuka 94

With the sophistication of timing, aggregate timings would be a very good call...

[Deesee]

Seen elsewhere..

Around five years ago, former Renault technical director Pat Symonds – in a column for what is now GP Racing magazine – revealed the details of a psychological study into the behaviour of sports fans.

It strongly suggested, he wrote with much excitement, that the public tend to have much fonder memories of an otherwise dull event when there is an exciting end.

I wonder what he’s up to now?

[Sandpit Steve]

PhilAsia said:

With the sophistication of timing, aggregate timings would be a very good call...

Liberty would hate aggregate timings. How to explain to an American audience, that the action on the track bears no resemblance to what the timing screen shows to be the order of the race? It can just about work when someone is trying to open or close a gap with a 5s penalty, but not with all the cars out of position.

[PhilAsia]

My problem with grid starts in that it is courting a collision. The collision probability increases as the lap countdown decreases, leading to the debacle we witnessed last Sunday.

- it also opens up the possibility for a cynical move that benefits one competitor over another.

- any buffer that has been gained in the preceding laps is deleted.

[PhilAsia]

Deesee said:

Seen elsewhere..

Around five years ago, former Renault technical director Pat Symonds – in a column for what is now GP Racing magazine – revealed the details of a psychological study into the behaviour of sports fans.

It strongly suggested, he wrote with much excitement, that the public tend to have much fonder memories of an otherwise dull event when there is an exciting end.

I wonder what he’s up to now?

......if I had known about the article I would've bought shares in Kleenex. There's profit to be made in the last two years from his tissue strewn room!

[Deesee]

One little gem, and see you all for thank you Baku!

[mat205125]

GiantCardboardPlato said:

All of these posts about not being allowed to change tyres under a red flag.

I don’t get it.

What is the problem that you are trying to solve?

For me, it's not about changing tyres under the red flag, its about that pit stop counting as the mandatory stop that the driver has to take during the race.

[simon_harris]

GiantCardboardPlato said:

Murghee said:

Redbull have made such an amazing car which id bad for f1 viewing..once max goes ahead then there is no point watching. May aswell give him the title and move to the next season

I dunno, pretty sure Max wouldn’t want yet another gifted WDC.

he seems pretty satisfied with the first two, why would a third make a difference too him.

[Jonnny]

mat205125 said:

GiantCardboardPlato said:

All of these posts about not being allowed to change tyres under a red flag.

I don’t get it.

What is the problem that you are trying to solve?

For me, it's not about changing tyres under the red flag, its about that pit stop counting as the mandatory stop that the driver has to take during the race.

This is my point too, you gain an advantage - when the race has effectively been stopped.

[Mark-C]

Didn't get up until 07:20 due to alarm failure so missed a lot but caught all the chaos at the end. To me what needs fixing is making decisions to throw SCs or Red Flags based on spicing things up rather than rationally. The rest of the rules (changing tures during red flag etc) are fine and don't need changing because occasionally someone is unlucky.

Anyway was good to see the Mercs up there, McLaren and Hulk bag some points and mildly amused by Alpine's latest nonsense - are they now officially the Spurs of F1?

Can't believe it's 4 weeks to the next race ...