Lewis Hamilton G.O.A.T. ?

[Northernboy]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

But that’s the entire point. Every other track has been softened ( or removed ) over the years. Monaco has been ( very slightly) changed in all the years it’s featured. And then only to remove ridiculous safety issues. This is why I regard it as the ultimate yard stick. You put up, or you shut up, it’s really very binary.

So what you are doing here then is to come up with ever more niche reasons to justify why Lewis Hamilton isn’t that good?

And it’s only the black driver that you do this sort of thing with, yes?

Interesting.

[M5-911]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

1985, Senna puts 1.5 seconds into Prost, during qualifying, at Monaco, in the same car. WTF. I’ve watched the quali laps over and over. Senna’s lap was nothing short of super human. I can’t fathom how he did it. When interviewed about it, he couldn’t explain it. He just said he found a whole different ‘plane’, and couldn’t really explain it either. It was just unbelievable. It was at that point, I had to say, that was the greatest performance I’ve ever witnessed in a racing car. Nothing has even remotely come close since.

But you completely ignored that during that qualifying Prost set up his car for race condition like he often did (Well documented). Senna didn't finished the race and Prost won. That is what I call genius...

Edited by M5-911 on Friday 21st May 20:52

[Maximus_Meridius101]

paulguitar said:

It was 1988.

Then, in the race, Senna crashed whilst under no pressure.

How long have you been watching F1, MM?

Nice touch Mr. Librarian. I noticed the typo and corrected it.
And since 1976. You? >gets popcorn out<

Edited by Maximus_Meridius101 on Friday 21st May 21:08

[Maximus_Meridius101]

Northernboy said:

So what you are doing here then is to come up with ever more niche reasons to justify why Lewis Hamilton isn’t that good?

And it’s only the black driver that you do this sort of thing with, yes?

Interesting.

I couldn’t care less what colour he is, that’s not my thing. It’s the table tilting that winds me up.

[CustardOnChips]

M5-911 said:

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

1985, Senna puts 1.5 seconds into Prost, during qualifying, at Monaco, in the same car. WTF. I’ve watched the quali laps over and over. Senna’s lap was nothing short of super human. I can’t fathom how he did it. When interviewed about it, he couldn’t explain it. He just said he found a whole different ‘plane’, and couldn’t really explain it either. It was just unbelievable. It was at that point, I had to say, that was the greatest performance I’ve ever witnessed in a racing car. Nothing has even remotely come close since.

But you completely ignored that during that qualifying Prost set up his car for race condition like he often did (Well documented). Senna didn't finished the race and Prost won. That is what I call genius...

Edited by M5-911 on Friday 21st May 20:52

Don't let facts get in the way of MM making a foolnof themselves.

Sennen got 17% of his wins at one track. Does that suggest that he's not particularly versatile?

[Maximus_Meridius101]

M5-911 said:

But you completely ignored that during that qualifying Prost set up his car for race condition like he often did (Well documented). Senna didn't finished the race and Prost won. That is what I call genius...

Edited by M5-911 on Friday 21st May 20:52

Senna was absolutely wringing the neck of his car in the race. Monaco being Monaco will frig you up the second you make a mistake, or hit debris / oil. Whatever happened during the race happened. It doesn’t detract from the key point though.

[Maximus_Meridius101]

CustardOnChips said:

Don't let facts get in the way of MM making a foolnof themselves.

Sennen got 17% of his wins at one track. Does that suggest that he's not particularly versatile?

“Foolnof” ?

Righto.

[CustardOnChips]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

M5-911 said:

But you completely ignored that during that qualifying Prost set up his car for race condition like he often did (Well documented). Senna didn't finished the race and Prost won. That is what I call genius...

Edited by M5-911 on Friday 21st May 20:52

Senna was absolutely wringing the neck of his car in the race. Monaco being Monaco will frig you up the second you make a mistake, or hit debris / oil. Whatever happened during the race happened. It doesn’t detract from the key point though.

You're not making any sense now.

[Maximus_Meridius101]

CustardOnChips said:

You're not making any sense now.

Rigggghhhht. It’s fairly simple. One driver wrings the neck of the car during the race and stacks it by the entrance to the tunnel, that could be seen as a ‘mistake’. However if the driver is a true ‘great’ that’s exactly what they do. 100 percent, 100 percent of the time. I rate a driver more highly if they wring the neck and bin it, than if they pussy about and win by default.

[lauda]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

CustardOnChips said:

You're not making any sense now.

Rigggghhhht. It’s fairly simple. One driver wrings the neck of the car during the race and stacks it by the entrance to the tunnel, that could be seen as a ‘mistake’. However if the driver is a true ‘great’ that’s exactly what they do. 100 percent, 100 percent of the time. I rate a driver more highly if they wring the neck and bin it, than if they pussy about and win by default.

The cognitive dissonance here is off the chart.

[Maximus_Meridius101]

CustardOnChips said:

Don't let facts get in the way of MM making a foolnof themselves.

Sennen got 17% of his wins at one track. Does that suggest that he's not particularly versatile?

No. If most of the tracks are a bit limp, then look at the challenging tracks to make your judgement. A lot of the proper tracks are long gone, or ‘Tilked’. If you’ve actually been watching / following Grand Prix for more than a couple of years ( discounting most on this thread ) you’ll know which tracks are relevant.

[Northernboy]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

I couldn’t care less what colour he is, that’s not my thing. It’s the table tilting that winds me up.

I don’t believe you. It’s clear that you have a real issue with a non-white driver eclipsing your heroes and you’re becoming more and more ridiculous in trying to find statistics that let you believe that it’s not personal.

Let’s put it this way, can you point to any campaign like this against any of the white drivers, or have you very clearly waited until a black driver started breaking records and then gone to quite some lengths to talk down his achievements?

If you can show me the vast series of posts where you do the same with someone of higher albedo then I’ll happily apologise, but I don’t believe that you can.

So, you’ve fixated on the only black driver, and tried again and again to denigrate him, yes?

Edited by Northernboy on Friday 21st May 21:25

[Northernboy]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

Rigggghhhht. It’s fairly simple. One driver wrings the neck of the car during the race and stacks it by the entrance to the tunnel, that could be seen as a ‘mistake’. However if the driver is a true ‘great’ that’s exactly what they do. 100 percent, 100 percent of the time. I rate a driver more highly if they wring the neck and bin it, than if they pussy about and win by default.

Great drivers overdrive and crash, letting lesser drivers win?

[Pachydermus]

Northernboy said:

I’m wondering whether to take my boy karting once he’s old enough to try, and then whether we’d want to take it a bit more seriously if he enjoys it.

I’ve no reason to assume it’d ever go far, but I do wonder at which point the talent-spotted youngsters are moved ahead of what a parent can afford to cover.

If you want to be competitive you'll still need a fair chunk of cash for the engine rebuild + new tyres for each meeting.

[TheDeuce]

Northernboy said:

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

I couldn’t care less what colour he is, that’s not my thing. It’s the table tilting that winds me up.

I don’t believe you. It’s clear that you have a real issue with a non-white driver eclipsing your heroes and you’re becoming more and more ridiculous in trying to find statistics that let you believe that it’s not personal.

Agree...

As Lewis breaks through all time records some chump finds one that he happens not to have beaten yet - and Vs drivers that have long since retired while Lewis will still race there...!?

That might not prove a racist pov outright - but it doesn't prove anything else either, so why the chart..!?

[lauda]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

CustardOnChips said:

Don't let facts get in the way of MM making a foolnof themselves.

Sennen got 17% of his wins at one track. Does that suggest that he's not particularly versatile?

No. If most of the tracks are a bit limp, then look at the challenging tracks to make your judgement. A lot of the proper tracks are long gone, or ‘Tilked’. If you’ve actually been watching / following Grand Prix for more than a couple of years ( discounting most on this thread ) you’ll know which tracks are relevant.

Or you could look at the results of wet races where the margins for error are far smaller and the performance of the car far less significant.

Oh no, wait. Hamilton is an absolute master in the wet too.

[M5-911]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

No. If most of the tracks are a bit limp, then look at the challenging tracks to make your judgement. A lot of the proper tracks are long gone, or ‘Tilked’. If you’ve actually been watching / following Grand Prix for more than a couple of years ( discounting most on this thread ) you’ll know which tracks are relevant.

Well, you can start with what we will call classic tracks.

Hamilton wins:

Hungaroring: 8 wins
Silverstone : 7 wins
Circuit Gilles vileneuve: 7 wins
Monza: 5 wins
Spa : 4 wins

[Northernboy]

Pachydermus said:

If you want to be competitive you'll still need a fair chunk of cash for the engine rebuild + new tyres for each meeting.

What’s that then, £10k, £20k per season, something like that?

[Pachydermus]

Northernboy said:

Pachydermus said:

If you want to be competitive you'll still need a fair chunk of cash for the engine rebuild + new tyres for each meeting.

What’s that then, £10k, £20k per season, something like that?

I last raced 25 years ago so can't remember the exact costs. I raced a supposedly stock series where the engine + tyres were supposed to do you for a season and the guys at the pointy end were replacing them weekly. My hazy memory tells me it was similar to standard car prices for servicing and tyres which could easily add up to £10k if you're racing every other week.
Of course if you're happy just to do it for fun then there's plenty of that to be had in the back half of the field for a lot less £££.

[CustardOnChips]

Maximus_Meridius101 said:

CustardOnChips said:

You're not making any sense now.

Rigggghhhht. It’s fairly simple. One driver wrings the neck of the car during the race and stacks it by the entrance to the tunnel, that could be seen as a ‘mistake’. However if the driver is a true ‘great’ that’s exactly what they do. 100 percent, 100 percent of the time. I rate a driver more highly if they wring the neck and bin it, than if they pussy about and win by default.

So you rate the driver who ran out of talent and crashed over?