Sebastian Vettel
Discussion
WindyCommon said:
I think that the outcome is quite humiliating and damaging for Vettel, specifically as he has been required to admit fault. In the end I don't think that the sincerity (or otherwise) of the attached apology matters. Vettel has acknowledged publicly that he transgressed the rules and spirit of the sport by trying to cheat. For drivers of his level/status it's not just about winning this years championship - he will know that the bad odour of this will stick permanently. An off-track victory for Hamilton in effect.
I respectfully disagree. There is no such thing as a moral victory in sport. You either win or you don't.Edited by WindyCommon on Tuesday 4th July 08:57
Nobody remembers the asterisks.
Mr_Thyroid said:
swisstoni said:
I respectfully disagree. There is no such thing as a moral victory in sport. You either win or you don't.
Nobody remembers the asterisks.
Isn't this whole forum dedicated to remembering the asterisks..... endlessly ... over, and over, and over......Nobody remembers the asterisks.
Crafty_ said:
If the WDC gets dirty I think Hamilton knows all he has to do is stay within the rules, wind Vettel up and let him explode.
yes, but Vettel didn't explode, did he? He just roughed Hamilton up a little bit. He was pretty firm with Hamilton earlier in the season (shoved him off iirc), so possibly Vettel has decided the only way to beat LH is to boss him.Didn't explode ? what would you call it then?
He drove alongside another car flapping his hands around, swearing on the radio and then either deliberately hit another car or in his little fit lost control and hit another car.
He lost his temper and was intent on retaliation.
As far as trying to "rough Hamilton up a bit" to "boss" him, didn't really work did it ?
He drove alongside another car flapping his hands around, swearing on the radio and then either deliberately hit another car or in his little fit lost control and hit another car.
He lost his temper and was intent on retaliation.
As far as trying to "rough Hamilton up a bit" to "boss" him, didn't really work did it ?
Crafty_ said:
Didn't explode ? what would you call it then?
He drove alongside another car flapping his hands around, swearing on the radio and then either deliberately hit another car or in his little fit lost control and hit another car.
He lost his temper and was intent on retaliation.
As far as trying to "rough Hamilton up a bit" to "boss" him, didn't really work did it ?
I thought he acted pretty daft, and managed to penalise himself, out of a race win. But I didn't see anyone explode at the time or afterwards. There's too much hysterical frothing over this.He drove alongside another car flapping his hands around, swearing on the radio and then either deliberately hit another car or in his little fit lost control and hit another car.
He lost his temper and was intent on retaliation.
As far as trying to "rough Hamilton up a bit" to "boss" him, didn't really work did it ?
Interesting comparison today in the Tour de France of how another sport deals with a world champion, in this case literally, getting his elbows out.
Peter Sagan has been disqualified from the blue riband event in his year, something his whole season and training regime will have been built around, for causing this crash with Marc Cavendish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgwZsxukSL8
To be clear, this is almost certainly accidental - when you lose your balance on a bike and cannot steer to correct, the natural reaction is to lean in and stick your elbow out. Of course the difference here is that Cavendish was injured and may withdraw.
Peter Sagan has been disqualified from the blue riband event in his year, something his whole season and training regime will have been built around, for causing this crash with Marc Cavendish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgwZsxukSL8
To be clear, this is almost certainly accidental - when you lose your balance on a bike and cannot steer to correct, the natural reaction is to lean in and stick your elbow out. Of course the difference here is that Cavendish was injured and may withdraw.
Mr_Thyroid said:
Interesting comparison today in the Tour de France of how another sport deals with a world champion, in this case literally, getting his elbows out.
Peter Sagan has been disqualified from the blue riband event in his year, something his whole season and training regime will have been built around, for causing this crash with Marc Cavendish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgwZsxukSL8
To be clear, this is almost certainly accidental - when you lose your balance on a bike and cannot steer to correct, the natural reaction is to lean in and stick your elbow out. Of course the difference here is that Cavendish was injured and may withdraw.
...and he even apologised straight away too...Peter Sagan has been disqualified from the blue riband event in his year, something his whole season and training regime will have been built around, for causing this crash with Marc Cavendish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgwZsxukSL8
To be clear, this is almost certainly accidental - when you lose your balance on a bike and cannot steer to correct, the natural reaction is to lean in and stick your elbow out. Of course the difference here is that Cavendish was injured and may withdraw.
Cavendish didn't throw the dummies out the pram, which was an even bigger surprise
Cold said:
The cycling comparison doesn't really seem valid. What disadvantage did Hamilton actually suffer from having his front wheel biffed by Vettle's?
Sagan was punished for the consequences of his action (the crash), not his action.Another rider in the finishing frantic sprint who also made an equally dangerous manoeuvre but luckily caused no crash,
had no action taken against him.
housen said:
vettel is now the new roseberg
he will be booed a lot ...and will lose his s
t even more
makes a good season
We'll see some boo-inghe will be booed a lot ...and will lose his s
t even more makes a good season
And then some counter boo-ing, and the circus perpetuates.
Rosberg,jnr was booed initially because he was seen to have dodged fair judgement/penalty, People need to do their job properly.
Cold said:
The cycling comparison doesn't really seem valid. What disadvantage did Hamilton actually suffer from having his front wheel biffed by Vettle's?
Have a look at Mark Renshaw in 2010 - very comparable to Seb and Lewis. He was also disqualified due to behaviour (without causing a crash). I'd also question if Sagan's move was deliberate, he says he didn't know Cavendish was their and apologised immediately so although the consequences worse, I think the intent was maybe less.I'd say Seb was a bit lucky to avoid a black flag, but that's the way it goes, Seb like everyone else will win some and lose some.
Really looking forward to Austria.
I thought it was a brave decision by the Tour de France stewards yesterday.
Personally I think the initial points deduction was enough as I don't think it was intentional and Sagan isn't that sort of rider, but this does send out a very clear message to the rest of the riders, unlike the FIA who's message to Vettel and Ferrari will be:
'Now please don't do this again, otherwise we will really, probably, have to at least consider doing something, maybe, definitely have a meeting and will almost certainly tell you off if you don't say sorry quicker this time'
Personally I think the initial points deduction was enough as I don't think it was intentional and Sagan isn't that sort of rider, but this does send out a very clear message to the rest of the riders, unlike the FIA who's message to Vettel and Ferrari will be:
'Now please don't do this again, otherwise we will really, probably, have to at least consider doing something, maybe, definitely have a meeting and will almost certainly tell you off if you don't say sorry quicker this time'
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