Jamie Chadwick - First competitive female driver in F1?
Discussion
carl_w said:
Back to W Series for Jamie: https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/articles/single...
Still if she keeps winning $0.5m a year that's a tidy income
Makes a joke of the W-Series and shows it up as a dead end. If the FIA are serious about it, then they need to make some changes. This doesn’t exactly encourage talented women drivers to join the series, unless they’re happy watching their careers plateau.Still if she keeps winning $0.5m a year that's a tidy income
Nampahc Niloc said:
carl_w said:
Back to W Series for Jamie: https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/articles/single...
Still if she keeps winning $0.5m a year that's a tidy income
Makes a joke of the W-Series and shows it up as a dead end. If the FIA are serious about it, then they need to make some changes. This doesn’t exactly encourage talented women drivers to join the series, unless they’re happy watching their careers plateau.Still if she keeps winning $0.5m a year that's a tidy income
She's not in W Series because she can't afford to progress. She's there because she doesn't have the speed, she's already had two seasons of F3 (British and Asia) and only scored one (reverse grid) win from 39 starts. And she's already older than 9 of the top ten in last year's F2 championship.
I just had a look at her record and it’s ok.
She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
Koln-RS said:
I just had a look at her record and it’s ok.
She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
Yup. Raced against her in 2015 in GT4 when she was 16. The seat insert she had was comical. Her teamate (Ross Gunn) was 18 and 6ft. She was about 5ft 2 then!She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
To say Mouton was not not on the same level as Stig, Hannu or Walter is massively disrespectful. She was on some days, she was often quicker on asphalt as none of those men were that quick on the hard stuff Walter was hopeless really in the A2 Quattro winning only his event the Monte and 11th in the series, Stig and Hannu never did much on asphalt and neither did the Audi. But she won Sanremo on both tar and gravel in 81.
Audi chose Moutons events carefully, as Lancia did routinely with their drivers, she did as well as could be expected and nearly won the championship, that in itself is enough to say she was on the same level, three wins in 82 second iont he RAC only 5 minutes behind the best that ever competed there Hannu,is fair wold you not say.
Is it the same as Vatanen winning in a 10 year old design, no, or Rohrl winning against all sorts in a bloody Ascona, not at all, but is still very meritorious what she achieved, and will never be bettered.
Audi chose Moutons events carefully, as Lancia did routinely with their drivers, she did as well as could be expected and nearly won the championship, that in itself is enough to say she was on the same level, three wins in 82 second iont he RAC only 5 minutes behind the best that ever competed there Hannu,is fair wold you not say.
Is it the same as Vatanen winning in a 10 year old design, no, or Rohrl winning against all sorts in a bloody Ascona, not at all, but is still very meritorious what she achieved, and will never be bettered.
coppice said:
Crikey , raw nerve is it ?
When "men" like yourself start projecting your own self-hatred on to others it does become rather annoying, yes. Especially when you then start attacking others for not holding your views. I know you probably think you're enlightened by doing this but it really just screams that you don't view women as your equals.Sandpit Steve said:
The same discrimination by sponsors that happens all the time, usually on the grounds of nationality or nepotism.
My point was that, without the superlicence rules, we used to have a whole pile of drivers running around the back of the F1 race several seconds a lap down. If there was a market for that, then maybe some sponsor would have taken a chance on one of the lady drivers.
It’s all hypothetical though, we do have a superlicence system and everyone has to qualify for it. Which is IMHO a much better system, even though Piastri missed out this year.
People choosing how to best spend their own money is not discrimination. Not one single person who wants to go racing is entitled to a single penny/cent of another person's money to pay for them. Those who can get others to pay for their hobby should count themselves lucky but those who cannot are not discriminated against in any way.My point was that, without the superlicence rules, we used to have a whole pile of drivers running around the back of the F1 race several seconds a lap down. If there was a market for that, then maybe some sponsor would have taken a chance on one of the lady drivers.
It’s all hypothetical though, we do have a superlicence system and everyone has to qualify for it. Which is IMHO a much better system, even though Piastri missed out this year.
Nampahc Niloc said:
Makes a joke of the W-Series and shows it up as a dead end. If the FIA are serious about it, then they need to make some changes. This doesn’t exactly encourage talented women drivers to join the series, unless they’re happy watching their careers plateau.
The FIA have nothing to do with series. The only changes the FIA should make is to force it to downgrade to F4 status if it wants FIA recognised status. It isn't on par with the other recognised F3 Regional/Formula Regional series anyway.spikyone said:
She's not in W Series because she can't afford to progress. She's there because she doesn't have the speed, she's already had two seasons of F3 (British and Asia) and only scored one (reverse grid) win from 39 starts. And she's already older than 9 of the top ten in last year's F2 championship.
Exactly, she's in W Series because she can't progress beyond F3/Formula Regional level despite being more than adequately experienced at that level and evidently being sufficiently financially backed enough to enable her stagnation at this level. If she lacked financial support she would have ceased continued entrances in F3 Regional series years ago.Koln-RS said:
I just had a look at her record and it’s ok.
She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
The problem is her record is at best OK, and it's been only OK in some low-level series. GT4 is pretty much a Pro-Am series and she was paired with a factory Aston Martin driver. She'd already had two full seasons in Ginetta Juniors without a win or a pole. There's a direct comparison with an F1-level driver there too - in her second season, she was well beaten by Lando Norris in his first season of cars: he won 4 races and took 8 poles.She’d won stuff in GTs before coming to single-seaters, quite late, then in s/s she won the 2019 MRF Winter Championship Title, against all male drivers
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018–19_MRF_...
And the following year finished 4th in Asian F3, behind Mazepin but ahead of Fittipaldi, with several podiums.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019–20_F3_A...
MRF is a low quality series with small grids that's been won by a lot of people who didn't win much else. Chadwick had 42 races in F3 (couldn't add up last time!) with only one reverse grid win. In F3 Asia the grids are fairly small - from ten full time drivers she finished fourth.
Against the boys in Formula Regional - the same cars as W Series - she really had her arse handed to her, with only one podium, which came in a race with 7 finishers. Again, ten full-time drivers and she finished ninth (beaten by Vips and Hauger, who ran partial seasons).
As for beating Pietro Fittipaldi, if he gets Mazepin's Haas seat it'll actually be a downgrade for them. I have no problem calling out under-qualified male drivers too, and he wouldn't deserve to be in that car any more than when he replaced Grosjean.
Bright Halo said:
Jamie going again in Formula W
What is the point, all she can do is go backwards after winning two years on the trott?
Surely the prize should be an F1 test?
The whole idea was to promote lady drivers but does not seem to be doing that.
She’s probably third favourite this season, behind Juju Noda and Abbi Pulling, both a lot younger than Jamie and looking to progress to FIA F3. What is the point, all she can do is go backwards after winning two years on the trott?
Surely the prize should be an F1 test?
The whole idea was to promote lady drivers but does not seem to be doing that.
jsf said:
It's a ridiculous series to do as a stepping stone to F1.
Go kick everyone's arse in the proper feeder series if you have any talent.
It's flawed logic (theirs - W-Series, not yours) - money buys a seat in F3, not talent. Occasional talent then gets to buy a seat in F2....or your surname.Go kick everyone's arse in the proper feeder series if you have any talent.
F2 weeds out the true crap, but not average drivers.
W series (sadly) no more an indication of true F1 talent than GB3 or F4.
It's really disappointing as it somehow promotes a view that W-Series = F1 feeder series, and it's not.
I'm slowly coming to the view that W Series is not what it set out to be, which makes me sad - and in parallel coming round to the view that "separate" racing is not what's needed.
Chadwick has won the series twice, is a Williams development driver and competes in multiple other series, yet still can't even get into FIA F3.
Peacockantony said:
coppice said:
Crikey , raw nerve is it ?
When "men" like yourself start projecting your own self-hatred on to others it does become rather annoying, yes. Especially when you then start attacking others for not holding your views. I know you probably think you're enlightened by doing this but it really just screams that you don't view women as your equals.Just noticed this entertaining riposte . Just a wild guess , but judging by this hissy fit , I think my suspicions were correct.
JonChalk said:
I'm slowly coming to the view that W Series is not what it set out to be, which makes me sad - and in parallel coming round to the view that "separate" racing is not what's needed.
Completely agree. The ultimate theoretical conclusion would be a Women's F1 and a Men's F1. That's necessary in Tennis but not in Motor Sport.
In promoting gender equality in Motor Sport, they've actually done the opposite.
bit early to write off W Series after only 2 full seasons imo ...& if it continues to raise awareness that women are more than welcome to join effectively what is a boys only club (which motorsport is) then i remain in support of it
Im not sure how it's structured or logistics, but if allows women to not only compete in W Series but also the main traditional feeder series into F1 then there is no harm in letting it continue for at leat 10-15 years & judge it after that
Im not sure how it's structured or logistics, but if allows women to not only compete in W Series but also the main traditional feeder series into F1 then there is no harm in letting it continue for at leat 10-15 years & judge it after that
Interview in the Telegraph today:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/formula-1/2022/05/06/j...
She is talking pragmatically about staying in WS, it’s free racing after all, but says she stopped reading her social media after the decision was announced.
IMHO, WS do need to push the winner into FIA F3, with a combination of prize money, sponsorship and a deal with one of the teams.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/formula-1/2022/05/06/j...
She is talking pragmatically about staying in WS, it’s free racing after all, but says she stopped reading her social media after the decision was announced.
IMHO, WS do need to push the winner into FIA F3, with a combination of prize money, sponsorship and a deal with one of the teams.
My 12yr old daughter has started karting this year as a direct effect from her seeing the W series. Before this she didn’t believe other girls/women competed in motorsport.
Even at our grass roots level it still feels like a male dominated sport. Very very few girls competing at club level karting.
I agree W series championship should = FIA F3 seat.
Even at our grass roots level it still feels like a male dominated sport. Very very few girls competing at club level karting.
I agree W series championship should = FIA F3 seat.
chappj said:
My 12yr old daughter has started karting this year as a direct effect from her seeing the W series. Before this she didn’t believe other girls/women competed in motorsport.
Even at our grass roots level it still feels like a male dominated sport. Very very few girls competing at club level karting.
I agree W series championship should = FIA F3 seat.
That’s awesome, good luck to her! Even at our grass roots level it still feels like a male dominated sport. Very very few girls competing at club level karting.
I agree W series championship should = FIA F3 seat.
The one thing WS has done well, is publicising the number of women in competitive motorsport. The next woman F1 driver might well be someone who was exposed to WS and decided to go karting.
Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff