Ted's roundups
Discussion
Scuffers said:
I used to have time for him, but having just sat though all 4 test day roundups, he's an idiot!
the bit with the guy from Renault was just painfully bad, he really does not understand anything.
like the battery bit, 20Kg's to store 4MJ - well, is it just the battery that is 20Kg's (or is that including the inverters etc?)
the store itself is MORE than 4MJ, the reggs limit the MGU-K to 4MJ per lap, that does not mean that's the total capacity of the ES otherwise you would be robbing this 4MJ with the MGU-H, and also would mean you would need to recover 4MJ per lap every lap to be able to use it (I suspect that the ES is probably more like 6-8MJ)
4MJ is 1.111Kwh, why the need to resort to kettle references? - to put this in context, a Nissan Leaf has a 24Kwh battery that weighs some 300Kg's (with control systems and containment), so some 12.5KG/Kwh.
the list goes on, but you would think by now, somebody would have taken him to one side and taught him some basic maths/physics?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5cYgRnfFDA#t=25sthe bit with the guy from Renault was just painfully bad, he really does not understand anything.
like the battery bit, 20Kg's to store 4MJ - well, is it just the battery that is 20Kg's (or is that including the inverters etc?)
the store itself is MORE than 4MJ, the reggs limit the MGU-K to 4MJ per lap, that does not mean that's the total capacity of the ES otherwise you would be robbing this 4MJ with the MGU-H, and also would mean you would need to recover 4MJ per lap every lap to be able to use it (I suspect that the ES is probably more like 6-8MJ)
4MJ is 1.111Kwh, why the need to resort to kettle references? - to put this in context, a Nissan Leaf has a 24Kwh battery that weighs some 300Kg's (with control systems and containment), so some 12.5KG/Kwh.
the list goes on, but you would think by now, somebody would have taken him to one side and taught him some basic maths/physics?
Edited by entropy on Monday 3rd February 23:56
PW said:
Well watch that then. Why do you really need to see it on Sky as well?
1)I dont understand your post saying 'reasons why sky dont do it' (in regards to a late night test round up) as they do 'do' it, thats what this whole thread is about? Ted just does it to a poor standard (imo).2) I do watch the racers edge, it's low budget, often short and still much better than the sky alternative as a test/tech round up. I bring it up as i think something similar (i.e. tech people who actually know that they are talking about) on sky would be much better for the hardcore fan than ted with a nose trimmer and a banana. And who else other than the hardcore fan is watching a Test/Tech pre-season round up late at night?
Dixie said:
I like it. And I like that the shows are getting longer. Sure it could be more technical but like others have said they're trying to play to a wide audience. Maybe they need to realise the majority of their viewers are more technical than the average GP viewer.
I think this sums it up really. By aiming for a wider viewer they are alientating the more technical viewer, who realistically is the only type of viewer watching!Ship in someone more technical and have Ted/Crofty speak to them. I think they should generally assume for this type of program (Non-prime time niche stuff) if the expert can explain it to Ted/crofty and enable them to follow and understand, then its likely the fan watching will follow too. Theres no need for Ted/Crofty to dumb it down that extra level, that generally makes us cringe or switch off.
Forbes82 said:
I think this sums it up really. By aiming for a wider viewer they are alientating the more technical viewer, who realistically is the only type of viewer watching!
Ship in someone more technical and have Ted/Crofty speak to them. I think they should generally assume for this type of program (Non-prime time niche stuff) if the expert can explain it to Ted/crofty and enable them to follow and understand, then its likely the fan watching will follow too. Theres no need for Ted/Crofty to dumb it down that extra level, that generally makes us cringe or switch off.
I don't have Sky because I don't consider it worth it, however I would assume that those who have considered the F1 channel worth the additional expense have done so because they are a bigger fan, therefore more technically knowledgeable and therefore agree the programme doesn't need dumbing down.Ship in someone more technical and have Ted/Crofty speak to them. I think they should generally assume for this type of program (Non-prime time niche stuff) if the expert can explain it to Ted/crofty and enable them to follow and understand, then its likely the fan watching will follow too. Theres no need for Ted/Crofty to dumb it down that extra level, that generally makes us cringe or switch off.
I can expect the BBC having to dumb down coverage (although I don't like it) because they have to cater for the viewer that is watching it because its on etc, with Sky you have to have made the decision to get it so less dumbing down is needed.
CocoUK said:
kybo said:
If it's beneath someone's level of understanding, it's gonna be poor, if it's above someone's level of understanding you're not gonna like it either. Difficult to get it right IMO.
I'm not pulling your message apart for the sake of argument but using the props that he did should really be seen as way below the bar.A packet of pasta(?) and a banana to represent the front-end of a Caterham!?!
Photograph + ipad = DONE
Appreciate your opinion and, if I'm honest, 'point taken!'
Although I did say this, too:
Kybo said:
'cringe-worthy'
In an attempt to become a complete hypocrite, I just watched some of his airtime during last year's Malaysian GP and the amount of times he paused, er'd, and stuttered his way thorugh general conversation took be back - I didn't realise he did it that often. Still like him tho.
PW said:
It's a niche market that is already catered for. Sky's primary job is to cover the races live and F1 in general, not be the one-stop-shop leading authority for granular analysis of every single thing that happens, be it technical, political, business, personal, whatever.
DC made the same argument but then he's working for the Beeb.Considering Sky has a far greater airtime devoted to F1 I think its a prerequisite for a portion of it devoted to good analysis from a premium provider.
PW said:
What's not to understand? If Sky thought it worthwhile hiring more people and investing in extra production to cater for a very small, niche audience they would have done it.
I think there was about an hour/90mins in total of Notebook from last week?
Hiring an expert at £££per day, extra flights, extra hotels, expenses, all the other costs of producing it - how much should they spend on that hour? Why should they spend it - what do they get back?
No extra production needed, just a half decent expert rather than a guy out of his depth waving a banana.I think there was about an hour/90mins in total of Notebook from last week?
Hiring an expert at £££per day, extra flights, extra hotels, expenses, all the other costs of producing it - how much should they spend on that hour? Why should they spend it - what do they get back?
Numerous freelance experts were already attending.
What they get back is drawing people into the new rules rather than turning them off. There is a big danger the complex new rules will have an affect on viewership, especially amoung those who want to know more but are greeted by a confusing and inaccurate display.
They also come across as more professional. They have the opportunity here to really please and impress the more hardcore fan that so often feels frustrated at some of the neccesary dumbing down of the 'main' shows.
Plus they could easily make a show that would be praised on motorsport forums rather than being an embarrassment. For absolute peanuts they could have tweaked the format, added a cheap 'expert' and had threads on here praising them, rather than this.
PW said:
But the hardcore fan can watch Racers Edge.... or read Racecar Engineering, or F1technical.net, or Scarb's blog, or any of the other places you can find it.
I don't understand how it is such a hardship that it isn't on Sky AS WELL as everywhere else.
It's a niche market that is already catered for. Sky's primary job is to cover the races live and F1 in general, not be the one-stop-shop leading authority for granular analysis of every single thing that happens, be it technical, political, business, personal, whatever.
I think its a missed opportunity to be the one-stop-shop to be honest. They have a dedicated 24 hour f1 channel and a big yearly budget, and there are alot of f1 fans who have sky purely because of f1. I think thier coverage overall has improved since they started, but i do think if they sat down and thought about it a bit more they could become that leading authority, and not neccesarily needing a great deal more investment to do so.I don't understand how it is such a hardship that it isn't on Sky AS WELL as everywhere else.
It's a niche market that is already catered for. Sky's primary job is to cover the races live and F1 in general, not be the one-stop-shop leading authority for granular analysis of every single thing that happens, be it technical, political, business, personal, whatever.
This 'cheap' expert, would he actually be skilled to present to a television audience?
A tricky balance to get the presentation and expertise correct, especially as one would be required to have actual technical experience and be willing to commit to such a position, i.e. leave his current role to be on television.
Cannot be many people who fit this description.
Not a suggestion for this position but I recall being captivated by a chap who was part of the engineering team for the Deltawing, discussing the technical aspects with Monkey Harris. I'd love something like this level of discussion in F1, highly doubtful but it would be fantastic.
EDIT:
Ben Bowlby - 6m36s in - /DRIVE Track Test: Nissan DeltaWing Driven At Road Atlanta -- /CHRIS HARRIS ON CARS
A tricky balance to get the presentation and expertise correct, especially as one would be required to have actual technical experience and be willing to commit to such a position, i.e. leave his current role to be on television.
Cannot be many people who fit this description.
Not a suggestion for this position but I recall being captivated by a chap who was part of the engineering team for the Deltawing, discussing the technical aspects with Monkey Harris. I'd love something like this level of discussion in F1, highly doubtful but it would be fantastic.
EDIT:
Ben Bowlby - 6m36s in - /DRIVE Track Test: Nissan DeltaWing Driven At Road Atlanta -- /CHRIS HARRIS ON CARS
Edited by CocoUK on Thursday 6th February 10:18
I think that Sky could really have done a bit more to cover the new era, rather than the compressed crap that's been shown of the Jerez test.......and we won't go in to the Craig Slater character........ who asks totally stupid questions, with every driver looking at him like the idiot that he is........
col68 said:
I think that Sky could really have done a bit more to cover the new era, rather than the compressed crap that's been shown of the Jerez test.......and we won't go in to the Craig Slater character........ who asks totally stupid questions, with every driver looking at him like the idiot that he is........
Totally agreehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCJuy79uMyU
CocoUK said:
Not a suggestion for this position but I recall being captivated by a chap who was part of the engineering team for the Deltawing, discussing the technical aspects with Monkey Harris. I'd love something like this level of discussion in F1, highly doubtful but it would be fantastic.
EDIT:
Ben Bowlby - 6m36s in - /DRIVE Track Test: Nissan DeltaWing Driven At Road Atlanta -- /CHRIS HARRIS ON CARS
Ben Bowlby IS Deltawing. And if you ever saw the film about his original delta car back in the '80s IIRC, you'll see that he has polished up a lot....EDIT:
Ben Bowlby - 6m36s in - /DRIVE Track Test: Nissan DeltaWing Driven At Road Atlanta -- /CHRIS HARRIS ON CARS
Edited by CocoUK on Thursday 6th February 10:18
I attended the Cass gig the other night. Gary Anderson was there and told me that the Beeb had decided the audience don't need to know anything technical about F1, which was why they dropped him. He confided other things too but I'm not going to reveal them.
It won't be long before Edwards and DC are sitting in a box in BBC Centrein London commentating on overseas GPs...the BBC do, after all, have experience of that don't they?
Drive channel on YouTube has a really nice shakedown with McNish on the new regs http://youtu.be/PzRoKW7LHz8
I'll take Ted and his notebook over Sky's weekly "F1 Show". I always record those and FFWD over the inane babble about what the drivers are doing or thinking, or are maybe thinking about doing.
F1 show even has an ex McLaren mechanic on it occasionally, he sits there in semi-disbelief as he gets asked the same inane questions three times by three different people.
F1 show even has an ex McLaren mechanic on it occasionally, he sits there in semi-disbelief as he gets asked the same inane questions three times by three different people.
CocoUK said:
However, since the move and the introduction of his post-race Notepad section I've become a fan!
I really like his behind the scenes work, he often gets to interact with drivers & personnel asking questions that we haven't heard already answered over & over.
He has also been in the right place at the right time to bring any result changes and reaction from ground zero, perhaps thanks to his recording schedule.
It had some interesting information, from Remi, but overall came across cobbled together to try and fill the lack of on-track activity, especially as a proper new rules feature is coming up in the near future.
Spot on - the testing notebook did seem under prepared particularly in comparison to the race weekend notebook.I really like his behind the scenes work, he often gets to interact with drivers & personnel asking questions that we haven't heard already answered over & over.
He has also been in the right place at the right time to bring any result changes and reaction from ground zero, perhaps thanks to his recording schedule.
It had some interesting information, from Remi, but overall came across cobbled together to try and fill the lack of on-track activity, especially as a proper new rules feature is coming up in the near future.
That said it seemed to me k=that there was far less of interest to go through that wasn't a re-hash of the change in regs that we've been somewhat deluged with on every news article and program.
The race weekend notebooks are an absolute highlight for me as a geekyF1 fan!
DS240 said:
He seems to get a bit bothered at anyone daring to wave at the camera behind him as he walks along.
I normally like the notebook bit. I like the casual walk around. This just seemed lazy effort with very little thought. Pointing out a tin of tuna in a tyre barrier..great!
It is like he was trying too hard to be a 'character', exaggerating his bumbling quirks.
Why talk about the caterham nose with a member of the team with a banana and sultanas when surely they could have just gone and looked at the actual nose?
TBH i find the bumbling rather natural for Ted (never met him though), i like the real bloke in the fits style personly.I normally like the notebook bit. I like the casual walk around. This just seemed lazy effort with very little thought. Pointing out a tin of tuna in a tyre barrier..great!
It is like he was trying too hard to be a 'character', exaggerating his bumbling quirks.
Why talk about the caterham nose with a member of the team with a banana and sultanas when surely they could have just gone and looked at the actual nose?
Probably because at this point in the year no teams want lots of close up video of thier cars ?
Ted (or Lumsden Bumhat) is on the latest Gareth Jones podcast. Worth a listen I think.
http://www.garethjones.tv/onspeed/onspeed216.html
http://www.garethjones.tv/onspeed/onspeed216.html
Right, I'll say it - I LIKE TED.
I really enjoyed his guest appearance on the GJOS podcast mentioned above and he was on top of his game on the F1 Show last week, very slick.
Anyhows, following the terrible engine-tech piece during the first testing event when he used his random household items... the Sky production team have found a graphics-package and knocked up a fairly nice overview of the new engines.
http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/f1/92...
It's not detail heavy but i'm happy with it, if I want more I know where I need to go.
I really enjoyed his guest appearance on the GJOS podcast mentioned above and he was on top of his game on the F1 Show last week, very slick.
Anyhows, following the terrible engine-tech piece during the first testing event when he used his random household items... the Sky production team have found a graphics-package and knocked up a fairly nice overview of the new engines.
http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/f1/92...
It's not detail heavy but i'm happy with it, if I want more I know where I need to go.
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