Qualifying 2016 style (could be fun ? ? )
Discussion
slipstream 1985 said:
The current qualifying setup is the best we have had in years. If it ain't broe don't fix it. Need to work on making the race a bit more interesting.
I'll throw an out there crazy suggestion.
each starting position gets a weight penalty. pole +22kg 2nd +21kg 3rd 20kg and so on.
Why? I'll throw an out there crazy suggestion.
each starting position gets a weight penalty. pole +22kg 2nd +21kg 3rd 20kg and so on.
It reads to me like some kind of 'wacky races' session. with plenty of potential for cockups and drama. I assume the intention is to randomly put some fast cars near the back of the grid. The result is a potentially exciting race for the TV viewers as they hope to watch the top car/driver try to make it's way through the pack.
I'm all for it. For too many races we have been denied any actual racing at the front. Issues such as tyre and fuel management has lead to some very inactive races of late. Anything that makes the drivers work for their money and glory is worth a try.
So this is official now. I will admit I'm still struggling to get my head around it (possibly because a lot of the detail hasn't actually been published yet).
I'm guessing for a few races it will be a bit messy with some odd unintended consequences, then Charlie will 'clarify' the -badly written- rules slightly several times over into the whole thing is pretty much neutralized and no different to the (perfectly good) existing format.
I'm guessing for a few races it will be a bit messy with some odd unintended consequences, then Charlie will 'clarify' the -badly written- rules slightly several times over into the whole thing is pretty much neutralized and no different to the (perfectly good) existing format.
I don't understand why people are saying this is a complicated new system? Seems pretty simple to me.
Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
DS240 said:
I don't understand why people are saying this is a complicated new system? Seems pretty simple to me.
Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
The system itself isn't necessarily complicated, but it's fundamentally a system that would benefit from cars(tyres) that can be absolutely on it when the driver chooses to do so, and everything that goes with that (such as number of engines). The problem they are trying to cover over is still there, if anything it will be amplified. Also...traffic.Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
Ted Kravitz summarised it nicely...
"I wonder whether the F1 bosses on the Commission pay attention to how F1 cars produce quick qualifying times. The best times are set when the tyre is on its first or second hot lap. After that, the best performance of the tyre is gone and the lap times don't improve. So the reality is that teams will not just go out onto the track and keep going round and round to set quicker times. They'll go out, set what they hope is the quickest time on a fresh tyre, come back in, and let the slower cars get dropped one by one as the session progresses."
The biggest issue is that they are 'fixing' the one thing that the vast majority of people had little issue with. So many things are broken but Quali was never really one of them aside from the occasional lack of running.
Edited by ukaskew on Friday 4th March 17:09
DS240 said:
I don't understand why people are saying this is a complicated new system? Seems pretty simple to me.
Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
I doubt I'll bother watching much this year, I gave up going to races live many years ago, this is just a way of skewing the results by exaggerating the effects of traffic, rain shower, yellow flags,etc. They might as well take numbers out of a hat and spare us the waste of time on a Saturday afternoon. Time was when the cars went out for an hours qually and the fastest driver got pole.... imagine that? Slowest after a certain time is out automatically.. Then at the end of each 90 second interval the current slowest on the time sheet is out.
I think it has potential to make qualifying quite interesting with the knock on effect of cars being out of place on the grid. It's going to make me watch qualifying again, which as a long term F1 fan is positive. Last 2-3 years if I missed qualifying I wasn't that bothered. I'd either just watch the final Q3 on record or simply not bother and just see what the results were.
All cars on track setting fast times together in desperation not to be eliminated? best make the Q1Q2 interval 2 hours so the stewards can process all the claims of impeding in time for Q2 to proceed fairly then.
Generally the best rules can be summed up simply and succinctly, rather than over complicating things.
Generally the best rules can be summed up simply and succinctly, rather than over complicating things.
This whole change to quali has puzzled me. One it isn't needed, two how can they rush this through a few weeks before the start of the season. I think the bosses fear another year of Mercedes domination so have cooked up a plan in a vain attempt to mix things up.
Funny how they weren't doing this when Red Bull were into their fourth year of winning everything.
Funny how they weren't doing this when Red Bull were into their fourth year of winning everything.
Having read the rules as posted on the FIA website, taking into account the way the tyres produce their performance, it wont change anything for the positive.
They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
jsf said:
Having read the rules as posted on the FIA website, taking into account the way the tyres produce their performance, it wont change anything for the positive.
They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
"... but drivers must be on track throughout each part until they get knocked out."They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
I read the above as meaning they couldn't just park it?
Whatever, like ted kravitz pionts out quoted above the rule writers don't seem to understand the sport; this will probably go the same way as the "fuel burn phase"
hairyben said:
"... but drivers must be on track throughout each part until they get knocked out."
I read the above as meaning they couldn't just park it?
Whatever, like ted kravitz pionts out quoted above the rule writers don't seem to understand the sport; this will probably go the same way as the "fuel burn phase"
It doesn't say that on the FIA website. It says the wording of the rules will be submitted to the F1 strategy group and F1 commission, so the rules aren't finalised yet.I read the above as meaning they couldn't just park it?
Whatever, like ted kravitz pionts out quoted above the rule writers don't seem to understand the sport; this will probably go the same way as the "fuel burn phase"
Even if they made them all ponse about on track for the entire session, that wont change when the fast time will come, when you have tyres so peaky.
hairyben said:
jsf said:
Having read the rules as posted on the FIA website, taking into account the way the tyres produce their performance, it wont change anything for the positive.
They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
"... but drivers must be on track throughout each part until they get knocked out."They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
I read the above as meaning they couldn't just park it?
Whatever, like ted kravitz pionts out quoted above the rule writers don't seem to understand the sport; this will probably go the same way as the "fuel burn phase"
jsf said:
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
This is also my fear. Even if we go on to the elimination stages...in the last minute of Q3, instead of the best two cars going head to head, it might be a Merc and a mid fielder that got lucky. What an anticlimax that will be. I always looked forward to that final run in the dying moments of Q3 with cars that have a realistic chance of improving or getting pole being out there all at once. This will mean that Q1 times will have to be set on a full track, with all the cars circulating. That's a lot of extra variables to throw in.
It's all part of Bernie's plan to get front runners near the back of the grid more often - it's more fun that way, but this does it without actively messing with the grid order.
It's all part of Bernie's plan to get front runners near the back of the grid more often - it's more fun that way, but this does it without actively messing with the grid order.
BarbaricAvatar said:
hairyben said:
jsf said:
Having read the rules as posted on the FIA website, taking into account the way the tyres produce their performance, it wont change anything for the positive.
They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
"... but drivers must be on track throughout each part until they get knocked out."They will go out and set a time, then park it, then go for a second time if they didn't maximise that first run enough to sit it out, as per the current system.
The only time this will change is if they don't get a clean first lap, in which case they will do a second lap pre the cut off time.
So it's going to make no positive difference, we could in fact end up with the cars not running at all in the last few minutes of each session, as they have set their best possible time on the fresh tyre earlier in the session within the 90 seconds post the cut off time.
So just imagine, after 6 minutes 30 seconds of Q3 nothing is on track. Genius idea.
I read the above as meaning they couldn't just park it?
Whatever, like ted kravitz pionts out quoted above the rule writers don't seem to understand the sport; this will probably go the same way as the "fuel burn phase"
I can see a few car setting out with low fuel, putting in a fast time, then cruising until their enhanced slot arrives.
How are they going to start the session? If it is from the pit lane, then when does the first lap start? If from the grid, where does each car go?
It possibly makes for better TV, but no one knows. There will be ways around it.
If someone locks up and a car becomes undriveable, what happens then? There will be cars expiring on the circuit and would that mean cars returning to the pits?
Act in haste . . .
How are they going to start the session? If it is from the pit lane, then when does the first lap start? If from the grid, where does each car go?
It possibly makes for better TV, but no one knows. There will be ways around it.
If someone locks up and a car becomes undriveable, what happens then? There will be cars expiring on the circuit and would that mean cars returning to the pits?
Act in haste . . .
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