Alonso to leave Ferrari?

[angrymoby]

fatbutt said:

Points vrs wins is always fun when it comes to Lewis. He's better than Niko because he has more points but Niko has more wins. Last year, Button had more points but Lewis more wins and apparently Lewis was better than Button.

erm?... & it's 'Nico'

[fatbutt]

angrymoby said:

erm?... & it's 'Nico'

Fair enough, its Nico. Point still stands.

[Catatafish]

RXED said:

johneturbo said:

I thought Lewis was ahead of Niko in the championship.... or not?

Not worked it out, but is that due to mechanical DNFs on Nico's side?

Rosberg has one more win (one was inherited from Hamilton due to the exploding tyre fiasco at silverstone).

Most people seem to say that when Hamilton performs badly, his team mate just about manages to equalise the points at the towards the end.

Qualifying is another matter. Rosberg is definitely a bit more lively than Button in that regard, although still lagging behind.

Edited by Catatafish on Wednesday 6th November 16:22

Edited by Catatafish on Wednesday 6th November 16:26

[angrymoby]

fatbutt said:

Fair enough, its Nico. Point still stands.

No it doesn't. Go back & check the 2012 WDC table.

[AWRacing]

johneturbo said:

I thought Lewis was ahead of Niko in the championship.... or not?

Indeed he is but only by 16points, not really a convincing #1 driver status decider, especially given the extra DNF on Nicos tally.

Anyway, we digress - this is a thread about alonso.

[RXED]

AWRacing said:

Anyway, we digress - this is a thread about alonso.

Who won't be leaving Ferrari any time soon, as there is no better seat available! Alonso is stuck in an era where talent doesn't mean as much as car!

edit - Not taking anything away from Seb, who I believe is one of the best now!

[Efbe]

RXED said:

Who won't be leaving Ferrari any time soon, as there is no better seat available! Alonso is stuck in an era where talent doesn't mean as much as car!

edit - Not taking anything away from Seb, who I believe is one of the best now!

ok, so explain to me. why is Alonso such a good driver?

[Jasandjules]

Efbe said:

ok, so explain to me. why is Alonso such a good driver?

I don't know about him, but my view is:

He, like Hamilton, somehow is able to get more out of the car than the team expect. So even if the car is not perfect, they are still at the front fighting.

[RXED]

Efbe said:

ok, so explain to me. why is Alonso such a good driver?

Without being confrontational, do you really need that explaining? Do you watch F1? Have you seen FA drag that embarrassment of a Ferrari around into podium positions? I'm no mega fan, but the bloke can drive!

[toppstuff]

RXED said:

Without being confrontational, do you really need that explaining? Do you watch F1? Have you seen FA drag that embarrassment of a Ferrari around into podium positions? I'm no mega fan, but the bloke can drive!

Agree with this. Fred is special. Able to take a car a little higher than it deserves to be.

[vonuber]

toppstuff said:

Agree with this. Fred is special. Able to take a car a little higher than it deserves to be.

No, he drives a car that may be difficult to handle or setup to a place it can be if it is driven by someone with skill enough to extract more performance out of it than another diver.
The car deserves to be there because it is fast enough to be there.

[Efbe]

I simply asked a question. I have my own opinion of this, but didn't want to sway your answers.

Specifically what actually makes you think he is talented/great?

[Justaredbadge]

Efbe said:

I simply asked a question. I have my own opinion of this, but didn't want to sway your answers.

Specifically what actually makes you think he is talented/great?

Why don't you try reading the answers already given, rather than trying to start an argument whilst claiming not to?

[Roo]

vonuber said:

toppstuff said:

Agree with this. Fred is special. Able to take a car a little higher than it deserves to be.

No, he drives a car that may be difficult to handle or setup to a place it can be if it is driven by someone with skill enough to extract more performance out of it than another diver.
The car deserves to be there because it is fast enough to be there.

But if the driver wasn't any good the car wouldn't be there.

[AWRacing]

Efbe said:

I simply asked a question. I have my own opinion of this, but didn't want to sway your answers.

Specifically what actually makes you think he is talented/great?

Surely any driver who has managed to be crowned champion more than once has a fair bit of talent to prove it wasnt just a fluke.
Also, and im being a little provocative here, but any driver who is paid to race in F1 and doesnt need to buy their drive is highly talented.

Its obvious you dont like FA and no matter what anyone says on here you're always going to look for an arguement.

[mollytherocker]

vonuber said:

The car deserves to be there because it is fast enough to be there.

This is absolutely true. Drivers dont have special magic powers to defy the laws of physics.

In fact, it is impossible to get 100% out of a car. The question would be, does Fred get closer to the cars ultimate potential, ie 100%, than any other driver and more of the time?

We just cant know this. We suspect he does, but we just do not know. He is good at talking himself up in a subtle way though.

[Efbe]

AWRacing said:

Surely any driver who has managed to be crowned champion more than once has a fair bit of talent to prove it wasnt just a fluke.
Also, and im being a little provocative here, but any driver who is paid to race in F1 and doesnt need to buy their drive is highly talented.

Its obvious you dont like FA and no matter what anyone says on here you're always going to look for an arguement.

I'd say anyone who is WDC even once is a great driver!

didn't quite get the responses I expected. Should I have questioned LH or JB or MW I would get a list of reasons; however the only responses seem to be i'm an idiot for suggesting he isn't (which I didn't)

Quite simply I was trying to find out what makes you think he is a good driver, what part of his character, style, history, technique etc, was there a specific race or period? It's not a difficult question, though obviously a bit too difficult for this thread :/

[toppstuff]

mollytherocker said:

vonuber said:

.

This is absolutely true. Drivers dont have special magic powers to defy the laws of physics.

Indeed. Some here seem to think Sebastien does, however.

Apparently in his case Seb having special magic powers is more likely, than having a car advantage, but I digress and will leave with my tongue firmly in my cheek..

[vonuber]

toppstuff said:

Indeed. Some here seem to think Sebastien does, however.

Apparently in his case Seb having special magic powers is more likely, than having a car advantage, but I digress and will leave with my tongue firmly in my cheek..

The difference in this case is that if alonso is fast it's because he puts the car where it has no right to be; if vettel is fast it's because he has a fast car.
Vettel extracts more of the car's potential from the redbull than webber does, as alonso (used to..) do with the Ferrari compared to massa.

[toppstuff]

vonuber said:

toppstuff said:

Indeed. Some here seem to think Sebastien does, however.

Apparently in his case Seb having special magic powers is more likely, than having a car advantage, but I digress and will leave with my tongue firmly in my cheek..

The difference in this case is that if alonso is fast it's because he puts the car where it has no right to be; if vettel is fast it's because he has a fast car.
Vettel extracts more of the car's potential from the redbull than webber does, as alonso (used to..) do with the Ferrari compared to massa.

I am not sure that is quite right. For your theory to work we would also need to see Seb elevate a bad or average car into a good result. We have seen Alonso do that. Hamilton too. We haven't seen much evidence of that yet from Seb, which is why the poor chap still needs to convince some people that he is truly is as good as we suspect he may be.