Loss of free to air coverage
Discussion
StevieBee said:
That, it may well be.
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Last Sunday I sat down at five past five and switched on the telly.
You are right though, to watch for free I did have to do more than you.
I had to press a button on a second remote, to start the satellite box.
The TV then senses another incoming signal and immediately displayed cars on the grid, ready for the start of the race.
How much do Sky charge now per year, for channels to included F1 ?
Some time ago, a neighbour who likes football, mentioned he pays Sky £800 each year.
A handy amount to save, because coincidentally it happens to equal two years insurance premiums, for a 180 mph sports car.
Jon39 said:
How much do Sky charge now per year, for channels to included F1 ?
I think there's various bands. Our monthly total Sky bill is a tad over £100 which includes the basic Sky package, SkyF1, broadband and phone. We only subscribed to Sky when they got the F1 gig and at the time, the whole package worked out roughly equal to what we were paying BT but with out the Sky channels. Moved out of the parent's house this summer and lost my access to Sky F1 in the process.
Spa was the 1st race in years that I'd missed, I volunteered for overtime in work and followed the race on BBC's live text.
Managed to catch Monza and Singapore in my parents' house.
However, they've now cancelled their Virgin Media subscription so I can't even go round to their house to watch it.
Surprisingly, I don't miss the live racing one bit. I can follow the main stories online through each team's Twitter feed and get 7-10 minute's worth of highlights off YouTube.
Generally, I find that I'm too busy with the house renovations to spend that amount of time on a sport. 5 hours worth of practice and qualifying and most of a Sunday afternoon suddenly seem like a crazy amount of time to invest in a sport every 2 weeks.
Saying that, I'll enjoy Silverstone live if C4 still have that next year, might even book the Friday off work.
Spa was the 1st race in years that I'd missed, I volunteered for overtime in work and followed the race on BBC's live text.
Managed to catch Monza and Singapore in my parents' house.
However, they've now cancelled their Virgin Media subscription so I can't even go round to their house to watch it.
Surprisingly, I don't miss the live racing one bit. I can follow the main stories online through each team's Twitter feed and get 7-10 minute's worth of highlights off YouTube.
Generally, I find that I'm too busy with the house renovations to spend that amount of time on a sport. 5 hours worth of practice and qualifying and most of a Sunday afternoon suddenly seem like a crazy amount of time to invest in a sport every 2 weeks.
Saying that, I'll enjoy Silverstone live if C4 still have that next year, might even book the Friday off work.
Jon39 said:
Thank you Eric.
We perhaps need a different tack to deal with the question of, is it fair that Germans are allowed to watch free live F1, but the British have to pay.
Britain hosts the majority of F1 teams and therefore builds most of the cars.
I think Toyota used to be in Germany, but are any teams based there now ?
Jon39 said:
Britain hosts the majority of F1 teams and therefore builds most of the cars.
I think Toyota used to be in Germany, but are any teams based there now ?
Happy to be corrected but I think Sauber/Alfa Romeo are in Switzerland, Ferrai and STR are in Italy, and the rest are in the UK?I think Toyota used to be in Germany, but are any teams based there now ?
I don't know if any significant amount of Haas in F1 terms is actually in the US
Eric Mc said:
Indeed so. Britain has now come to dominate F1 when it comes to engineering and design - a position that came to be with British innovations and success in the 1960s and 70s.
And IMO that explains why UK viewers get such a comparatively bad deal. It is pretty much a GB sport - at least team / engineering / fan base wise. Probably the reason why Sky thought it is good business sense to spend much GBP on squeezing all competition out of the market. But I do not think it will last 3 years or more now. Archaic business model, bad VFM and the young high value advertising targets have stopped watching TV altogether for a couple of years now. It needs to go, and IMO nobody will really miss it.
That's my concern too. The UK as a "Market" may be much smaller than (say) China, India , Russia or Indonesia. But that is the wrong way to look at the UK's importance in the world of F1 (and motorsport in general).
For far too long, F1 has thought in terms of "markets", "marketing" and "market penetration" in regards to how they advance the "sport/business" model.
The UK is a world hub and centre of excellence of the engineering and, dare I say it, possesses the right type of structures and culture that allows the development of racing technology. In other words, UK engineering culture (i.e. small teams, fast thinking, quick prototyping) is ideal for how racing cars are designed, built and evolved at a very fast pace throughout a season. I don't think any other country has that right mix of approach and skills.
By making Brits jump through expensive hoops to watch F1 on TV is counterproductive for the sport in the long run. If we lose a generation or two of youngsters who are fired up to get involved in motorsport engineering, the UK's standing could fade away.
I am hopeful that this antiquated and archaic "business model" as expressed by the Sky deal will last no longer than its 5 years - before any more damage is done.
For far too long, F1 has thought in terms of "markets", "marketing" and "market penetration" in regards to how they advance the "sport/business" model.
The UK is a world hub and centre of excellence of the engineering and, dare I say it, possesses the right type of structures and culture that allows the development of racing technology. In other words, UK engineering culture (i.e. small teams, fast thinking, quick prototyping) is ideal for how racing cars are designed, built and evolved at a very fast pace throughout a season. I don't think any other country has that right mix of approach and skills.
By making Brits jump through expensive hoops to watch F1 on TV is counterproductive for the sport in the long run. If we lose a generation or two of youngsters who are fired up to get involved in motorsport engineering, the UK's standing could fade away.
I am hopeful that this antiquated and archaic "business model" as expressed by the Sky deal will last no longer than its 5 years - before any more damage is done.
Eric Mc said:
That's my concern too. The UK as a "Market" may be much smaller than (say) China, India , Russia or Indonesia. But that is the wrong way to look at the UK's importance in the world of F1 (and motorsport in general).
For far too long, F1 has thought in terms of "markets", "marketing" and "market penetration" in regards to how they advance the "sport/business" model.
The UK is a world hub and centre of excellence of the engineering and, dare I say it, possesses the right type of structures and culture that allows the development of racing technology. In other words, UK engineering culture (i.e. small teams, fast thinking, quick prototyping) is ideal for how racing cars are designed, built and evolved at a very fast pace throughout a season. I don't think any other country has that right mix of approach and skills.
By making Brits jump through expensive hoops to watch F1 on TV is counterproductive for the sport in the long run. If we lose a generation or two of youngsters who are fired up to get involved in motorsport engineering, the UK's standing could fade away.
I am hopeful that this antiquated and archaic "business model" as expressed by the Sky deal will last no longer than its 5 years - before any more damage is done.
The net contribution the Motor Sports industry makes to the UK economy is £9billion each year. That's not to be sniffed at.For far too long, F1 has thought in terms of "markets", "marketing" and "market penetration" in regards to how they advance the "sport/business" model.
The UK is a world hub and centre of excellence of the engineering and, dare I say it, possesses the right type of structures and culture that allows the development of racing technology. In other words, UK engineering culture (i.e. small teams, fast thinking, quick prototyping) is ideal for how racing cars are designed, built and evolved at a very fast pace throughout a season. I don't think any other country has that right mix of approach and skills.
By making Brits jump through expensive hoops to watch F1 on TV is counterproductive for the sport in the long run. If we lose a generation or two of youngsters who are fired up to get involved in motorsport engineering, the UK's standing could fade away.
I am hopeful that this antiquated and archaic "business model" as expressed by the Sky deal will last no longer than its 5 years - before any more damage is done.
F1 may be a global endeavour but one that is most certainly UK centric.
But.... Things are a changing. Formula E is most certainly not UK centric, other than having its head office in London. The technology that's driving it is emerging from EU countries (Italy and Germany). The FIA World Rallycross Championship is moving to electric in the next couple of years, the forerunner to which (ProjeKt E) is being launched next year and will be based out of Austria using Austrian/German technology. Whilst the UK remains pivotal in much of the motor sport world, there are clear signs that this is beginning to wane, a fact not gone unnoticed by the Department of International Trade who have an entire floor dedicated to 'Motor Sports' in their office in Whitehall.
F1 is not FE of course but we all have to recognise that the merging of the two features at some point in the future and the risk is that when it does, we could see a refocusing to other geographic locations better able to support the technological transition when it happens.
As for TV, economically speaking, the gradual transition globally to pay-to-view (Germany will go that way soon) suits F1 very well, as it does many other sports. It generates revenue to levels that if dispersed correctly - and the jury is still out on that - lessens (in theory) the teams' dependancy on sponsors. And new sponsors are attracted due to the ability to more accurately define the demographics of the people watching. Many of the brands that you see in F1 today are not exactly what'd you'd call household names - certainly not to the extent we have seen previously.
In the field of Marketing, is generally better to reach less people but with greater accuracy and targeting than reach more people but with poor targeting and no accuracy. Free-to-air falls into the latter category, pay-per-view into the former. The caveat to this is that price to view has to offer value. If subscribers or customers begin to drop below a critical level, either the price is adjusted to make it more affordable or the quality of the content increased to better justify the premium paid.
How this might impact on the protection of the UK's role in F1 and motor sport is far from clear. Sky have been showing F1 since 2012 and in that time, motor sport related degree courses are consistently over-subscribed, kart tracks up and down the country remain full of kids giving it all. The British GP sells out each year. The younger generation have and are growing up in a media world dominated by Netflix, Amazon, Sky and others and so are used to paying to watch things they'd like to watch.
F1 has always been a bit 'fringey' but has always attracted sufficient interest to sustain it. I don't think that will change anytime soon and should the UK's contribution to F1 lessen, that will be due to forces emanating from elsewhere.
We pay £70 for Sky TV (everything, so Cinema, Sports etc), line rental and Fibre.
In the grand scheme of things that's pretty reasonable, the F1 is essentially absorbed into the massive 'discounts' we continue to get by threatening to cancel every 18 months.
I'd be happier if there was an option to just have Brundle audio on the commentary, but you can't have everything.
In the grand scheme of things that's pretty reasonable, the F1 is essentially absorbed into the massive 'discounts' we continue to get by threatening to cancel every 18 months.
I'd be happier if there was an option to just have Brundle audio on the commentary, but you can't have everything.
Jon39 said:
StevieBee said:
That, it may well be.
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Last Sunday I sat down at five past five and switched on the telly.
You are right though, to watch for free I did have to do more than you.
I had to press a button on a second remote, to start the satellite box.
The TV then senses another incoming signal and immediately displayed cars on the grid, ready for the start of the race.
How much do Sky charge now per year, for channels to included F1 ?
Some time ago, a neighbour who likes football, mentioned he pays Sky £800 each year.
A handy amount to save, because coincidentally it happens to equal two years insurance premiums, for a 180 mph sports car.
Anyone on a communal satellite system, be it in a block of flats or a fibre based system on a housing development.
Or people like me who live in a listed property (or conservation area) and can't get the necessary planning permission for a second dish.
rscott said:
Jon39 said:
StevieBee said:
That, it may well be.
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Personally, I retain sufficient passion and enthusiasm for F1 that justifies my subscription that enables me to sit down, switch on the telly and watch the race ....
Last Sunday I sat down at five past five and switched on the telly.
You are right though, to watch for free I did have to do more than you.
I had to press a button on a second remote, to start the satellite box.
The TV then senses another incoming signal and immediately displayed cars on the grid, ready for the start of the race.
How much do Sky charge now per year, for channels to included F1 ?
Some time ago, a neighbour who likes football, mentioned he pays Sky £800 each year.
A handy amount to save, because coincidentally it happens to equal two years insurance premiums, for a 180 mph sports car.
Anyone on a communal satellite system, be it in a block of flats or a fibre based system on a housing development.
Or people like me who live in a listed property (or conservation area) and can't get the necessary planning permission for a second dish.
Well I have a surprise and perhaps good news for you.
The very first satellite TV kit which I bought was contained in a strong plastic brief case. The TV system was I think intended for caravaners, hence it being portable. It was sold by Lidl, but presumably they can be obtained elsewhere. That was about 10 years ago, so not an HD version. It cost £50.
That dish now sits internally on a window sill at a second home, and it does work with the window closed (single glazed). No planning permission required. Coincidentally it does happen to be in a conservation area, but this internal dish is the only one in use anyway. I simply change the dish angle for German TV stations, if I want to watch F1. Just need to avoid knocking the dish when drawing curtains.
People in a block of flats with a south or south east facing window would be OK, but obviously not if there is no visible line towards the satellite.My portable satellite TV system is in the south of England. I don't know, but perhaps if further north it might not receive a strong enough signal through a closed window. Then it might be chilly with an open window, although the majority of F1 races are during the warmer seasons.
Edited by Jon39 on Friday 22 November 18:12
Jon39 said:
My portable satellite TV system is in the south of England. I don't know, but perhaps if further north it might not receive a strong enough signal through a closed window. Then it might be chilly with an open window, although the majority of F1 races are during the warmer seasons.
I once watched an F1 race (Mark Webber won it, so that should date the event) in a bar in Port de Fontvieille in Monaco (it might have been the Ship and Castle). They had a satellite mini-dish mounted inside a plant pot hidden amongst all the other foliage at the front of the premises....StevieBee said:
Jon39 said:
How much do Sky charge now per year, for channels to included F1 ?
I think there's various bands. Our monthly total Sky bill is a tad over £100 which includes the basic Sky package, SkyF1, broadband and phone. We only subscribed to Sky when they got the F1 gig and at the time, the whole package worked out roughly equal to what we were paying BT but with out the Sky channels. If I wanted to get Sky it will cost me £37 a month and whilst I get all the Sky sports the reality is the only bit I want is F1, so thats £444pa to watch F1. Reality is there are a few races I will miss due to other commitments so if I actually get to see 18 live thats £24.66 a race.
At that cost I will watch the highlights on Channel 4 which I record if necessary and watch later in the evening. Only once so far this season have I known the result before watching the highlights.
Oh how I’ve tried to get rid of sky this last year,(I’ve moved to somewhere in Cornwall that is right out in the sticks so broadband is very nearly dial up speed!)but alas after 6months of c4 coverage I cracked and bought a nowtv stick initially to catch up on Gomorrah but lately if I’m not working the Sunday a gp is on I’ll pay my tenner and happily watch it,I have unlimited data and great 4g where I am so it’s all in hi def for me.
I really can’t understand people moaning about the actual sky f1 coverage,yes it costs a bit but what doesn’t. I understand the odd presenter isn’t to everyone’s taste but to me the pre shows brundle teds notebook all are great and it’s a tenner well spent for 4 or 5 solid hours of good coverage compared to the hour and a half from c4.
I really can’t understand people moaning about the actual sky f1 coverage,yes it costs a bit but what doesn’t. I understand the odd presenter isn’t to everyone’s taste but to me the pre shows brundle teds notebook all are great and it’s a tenner well spent for 4 or 5 solid hours of good coverage compared to the hour and a half from c4.
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