Dealer refuses to take car back
Discussion
I’ve been a long time follower of PH - especially of the forums, but have never registered as a user or posted myself. I’m posting now because I’d like to share this story in the hope that it prevents someone else falling into the same trap as me. The dealer concerned advertises a lot on PH so it’s easily possible that someone else on here will fall into the same trap that I have.
Long story short, I paid top price for a fully restored 1972 911S from a UK dealer. I guess over the years buying many cars through the official Ferrari, Porsche, Bentley & Land Rover dealer network I’ve become a bit too complacent and trusting, never experiencing an issue with what I've bought. Stupidly in hindsight, I bought this particular car without viewing it in person or having it inspected by an expert. The main reason was my impatience and the considerable distance from me (I’m on the south coast, they are in the north) and I took the detailed description and high (POA of course..) price to be a validation of genuine & honest car. I’d describe myself as a car enthusiast not a 911 air-cooled expert, but upon receiving the car all seemed initially fine to my untrained eye. After having the car for a week or so I had some minor running issues which required me to take the car to a local air-cooled specialist for some tweaking.
They informed me pretty quickly that the car I’d bought was not a genuine restored 911S but a “patchwork quilt” of different cars from different eras. I immediately informed the dealer and initially they tried to say this was not the case - but there is a huge amount of physical and documented evidence to the prove contrary. Without much persuading the dealer agreed he could “see where I was coming from” and agreed to take the car back giving me a full refund. Two weeks later the car is still sat in my garage. I’ve chased him by phone, email & text for refund and the dealer has become less and less responsive telling me when he has the money he will pay me back. He's missed all the deadlines we've agreed.
So, I’ve now been left with no option but to go the legal route to conclude this sorry tale. Even though I have the consumer rights act on my side etc. this is still a big drain on my energy and time, just goes to show that in this modern fast-paced digital world some old fashioned tyre kicking, face to face and greasy hands all count for a lot more when things go wrong.
Long story short, I paid top price for a fully restored 1972 911S from a UK dealer. I guess over the years buying many cars through the official Ferrari, Porsche, Bentley & Land Rover dealer network I’ve become a bit too complacent and trusting, never experiencing an issue with what I've bought. Stupidly in hindsight, I bought this particular car without viewing it in person or having it inspected by an expert. The main reason was my impatience and the considerable distance from me (I’m on the south coast, they are in the north) and I took the detailed description and high (POA of course..) price to be a validation of genuine & honest car. I’d describe myself as a car enthusiast not a 911 air-cooled expert, but upon receiving the car all seemed initially fine to my untrained eye. After having the car for a week or so I had some minor running issues which required me to take the car to a local air-cooled specialist for some tweaking.
They informed me pretty quickly that the car I’d bought was not a genuine restored 911S but a “patchwork quilt” of different cars from different eras. I immediately informed the dealer and initially they tried to say this was not the case - but there is a huge amount of physical and documented evidence to the prove contrary. Without much persuading the dealer agreed he could “see where I was coming from” and agreed to take the car back giving me a full refund. Two weeks later the car is still sat in my garage. I’ve chased him by phone, email & text for refund and the dealer has become less and less responsive telling me when he has the money he will pay me back. He's missed all the deadlines we've agreed.
So, I’ve now been left with no option but to go the legal route to conclude this sorry tale. Even though I have the consumer rights act on my side etc. this is still a big drain on my energy and time, just goes to show that in this modern fast-paced digital world some old fashioned tyre kicking, face to face and greasy hands all count for a lot more when things go wrong.
Sorry to hear about this but as you said its always best to be careful. I think we have all fell into the trap that you have to some degree and it can bite!
I think the legal route is a wise move and one you need to push for as swift as possible to allow them little chance to make any alternative moves.
I think one letter from your legal representative will prompt them to make arrangements to have the car collected at their cost and refund you in full. good luck!
I think the legal route is a wise move and one you need to push for as swift as possible to allow them little chance to make any alternative moves.
I think one letter from your legal representative will prompt them to make arrangements to have the car collected at their cost and refund you in full. good luck!
Thanks for taking the time to comment guys, appreciated. Yes, the dealer delivered the car and it was within the 30 day right to cancel period that I rejected the car. Reason as it "wasn't what it said on the tin" e.g. as described in the advert, it was definitely not a genuine nuts and bolts restoration of a 911S. For example (nerdy fact alert..) a genuine 911S revs to a 7,250 redline. The rev counter in the car I bought only goes to 7,000rpm in total (6,000 redline). Thats just one of too many examples to list here where it doesn't stack up. The only good thing to come out of all this is that I know a lot more about period 911's and the Consumer Rights Act 2015. Although I'd rather be a driver than a mechanic, and a happy consumer than a lawyer.
sandman77 said:
ThePackMan said:
Thanks for taking the time to comment guys, appreciated. Yes, the dealer delivered the car and it was within the 30 day right to cancel period that I rejected the car.
But was it within 14 days? If so you don't need a reason to return to return the car.What do you think the value hit is % wise given what you know now? It may be worth trying to come to an agreement for the actual impact in pounds and pence. You never know you may even be able to enjoy the car for what is it!
You hit the nail on the head. The price for a very high quality recreation in the 911 world is a lot lower than a genuine ground up renovation. And in turn that is lower than a genuine un-renovated showroom condition example - kind of the 911 unicorn. Whilst the car I have bought still looks cool, in the end its a "parts-bin special recreation". I'd estimate its worth no more than 50% of what I paid for it.
I'm a little staggered somebody would buy such a specialist car without doing any due-diligence on it before buying. Not seeing the car, not getting a specialist to view the car, or even simply getting the sellers photos checked by an expert just seams madness.
OP, I hope you get your money back, but please don't be so trusting when buying specialist cars where all the value is in the detail rather than a shiny coat of paint.
OP, I hope you get your money back, but please don't be so trusting when buying specialist cars where all the value is in the detail rather than a shiny coat of paint.
I'm sure the dealer is sufficiently well capitalised to refund the money, but it's way down his list of priorities to organise transport etc for something that is of no benefit to him.
Best way to move things forward is to tell him that you will return the car to him on such and such a day and expect payment by bank trans while you are there.
I appreciate that there is a cost to you in both time and money but it's you that will benefit from this not him.
Best way to move things forward is to tell him that you will return the car to him on such and such a day and expect payment by bank trans while you are there.
I appreciate that there is a cost to you in both time and money but it's you that will benefit from this not him.
Maybe because my wife is from Manchester I assumed everyone from "up North" is amazing....
As I already explained, yes I regret going on good faith - that was my decision and I take full responsibility for that, but doesn't mean that as I trusted someone I'm automatically fair game to be done over. As to the dealer being liquid and well capitalised? he says he's in a cashflow situation and doesn't have the money to refund me until someone else has paid him. Which then becomes "our" cashflow situation..? In the end I'm a customer not an investor.
Due to the PH forum rules and that I've already instructed legal people I can't say who the dealer is, but I'm sure you can work it out.
As I already explained, yes I regret going on good faith - that was my decision and I take full responsibility for that, but doesn't mean that as I trusted someone I'm automatically fair game to be done over. As to the dealer being liquid and well capitalised? he says he's in a cashflow situation and doesn't have the money to refund me until someone else has paid him. Which then becomes "our" cashflow situation..? In the end I'm a customer not an investor.
Due to the PH forum rules and that I've already instructed legal people I can't say who the dealer is, but I'm sure you can work it out.
Sorry, forgot to add that I offered (and arranged) enclosed transportation of the vehicle at my cost as an offer of goodwill to get the refund moving, but he missed the deadline we agreed for payment prior to shipping and said he would organise the collection - and then missed his own deadline on that too. As for priorities...I won't even start that one..
If the refund has been agreed and you are sure the dealer has the money, then a legal nudge to push the process along might help
Could a statutory demand be of use in this situation?
https://www.gov.uk/statutory-demands
Could a statutory demand be of use in this situation?
https://www.gov.uk/statutory-demands
cobra kid said:
Maybe not, but the dealer still has to be made to pay up somehow! That's the difficult bit. You can't just walk in and take money out of the till.
Yes but at least the buyer would have the law on his side rather than a potential argument about the car being as described or not. If course this all depends on the timescale (which the OP has so far not clarified).hondansx said:
Sorry to hear this.
I guess you've found the issue with emotive purchases! I had a not too dissimilar situation, but with an official Porsche dealer!!
Eyes now wide open, and I would never purchase a car of high value without a specialist inspection first.
I remember a few years back the story of a GT3RS that was reshelled and bought unknowingly from an OPC, I guess you've found the issue with emotive purchases! I had a not too dissimilar situation, but with an official Porsche dealer!!
Eyes now wide open, and I would never purchase a car of high value without a specialist inspection first.
Buyer beware!
Good Luck op.
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