RE: Gordon Murray Automotive T.50 revealed
Discussion
AmyRichardson said:
Yup, when he steps outside of blank-cheque "my sort of stuff" projects it all unravels pretty quickly. More fool us (and a number of Murray's clients!) for thinking that someone who's a superlative designer of X is somehow going to be an equally good designer of Y.
Most of his clients are probably thinking of the T50 as a high interest ISA.Sway said:
Oh, completely agree.
The bit I find somewhat odd though, is the cars Murray builds are rather different to the types of cars (especially road cars) Murray loves and has in his museum...
Yes, they're all very light. But they're also rather more manageable in power to weight - and can all be wrung out on a regular road. That's not the case for anything he's built other than the Rocket.
From interviews i've heard, the cars in Murray's museum are cars he had already designed/built, or cars he lusted after in his youth.The bit I find somewhat odd though, is the cars Murray builds are rather different to the types of cars (especially road cars) Murray loves and has in his museum...
Yes, they're all very light. But they're also rather more manageable in power to weight - and can all be wrung out on a regular road. That's not the case for anything he's built other than the Rocket.
As such, most of the cars he hasn't had a hand in designing are over 40 years old; as you are hopefully aware, cars of such an age are generally smaller, lighter and slower than their modern counterparts. Plus, when he can just go out and buy a Mk1 Cortina GT which he can have restored to his own personal tastes, why would he waste his time designing a modern pastiche that probably wouldn't have as much appeal to him, or 99.999% of car buyers nowadays?
If you want something more managable in power to weight, there are plenty of cars for you to choose from on the used or classic car markets - if Murray can make money from selling hypercars to the hyper rich, fair play to him. Would rather a T50 than any of the other cars in the sector available to buy new currently, not surprised it's sold out.
thegreenhell said:
TG video just released...
Thanks for posting that link. 
I just watched it in full and it just confirmed how special this car is what with an N/A screamer, manual gearbox, passive suspension, etc. My ultimate car ever, although I prefer the "cheaper" T33!
I'll never have one but I'm so glad they exist.
Hammersia said:
I don't doubt how good it is to drive, but the looks haven't grown on me at all. I wasn't originally a fan of the F1 styling but it grew on me, possibly because it was so different to anything else (still is).
Compared to the F1, the T50 has lost some of the attitude, aggression, e.g. the lack of side strakes, even the headlights and mounts look fussy and effeminate. The fan might have worked from the styling point of view if the outlet had been more oval or matching with other shapes around the rear valence, as it is it just looks stuck on.
Agreed, the F1 looks far better. Regarding the looks, it simply doesn't look anything remotely like it's cost. Or put another way - if the T50 costs £2.8 million, then something like a 765LT should cost £5 million !!Compared to the F1, the T50 has lost some of the attitude, aggression, e.g. the lack of side strakes, even the headlights and mounts look fussy and effeminate. The fan might have worked from the styling point of view if the outlet had been more oval or matching with other shapes around the rear valence, as it is it just looks stuck on.
However, if I had many millions I would get one just for the V12 engine / soundtrack alone :-)
Do we know why the top speed is 'only' 226mph? I understand that's with the shorter of the two gear sets. With more power, and the fan providing a 'low drag' mode I expected it to exceed the speed posted by the F1, especially since that top speed was achieved past the peak power figure of the engine, suggesting it could go even faster with ideal gearing. I assume the T.50 has more downforce at the expense of more drag? I can't seem to find CdA figues for the T.50.
Not suggesting the T.50 should have chased a higher top speed or that this would make the car better, I'm just interested in the technical reason why it's not even faster than the F1.
Not suggesting the T.50 should have chased a higher top speed or that this would make the car better, I'm just interested in the technical reason why it's not even faster than the F1.
It sounds like it's limited by gearing with the shorter top gear, so it will be on the rev limiter at 226mph. The longer top gear option is so much longer that it might not actually be any faster if it can't pull the gear to the rev limit. Many other cars with extra long top gears for cruising/economy actually reach their top speed a gear below top gear for this reason.
varsas said:
Do we know why the top speed is 'only' 226mph? I understand that's with the shorter of the two gear sets. With more power, and the fan providing a 'low drag' mode I expected it to exceed the speed posted by the F1, especially since that top speed was achieved past the peak power figure of the engine, suggesting it could go even faster with ideal gearing. I assume the T.50 has more downforce at the expense of more drag? I can't seem to find CdA figues for the T.50.
Not suggesting the T.50 should have chased a higher top speed or that this would make the car better, I'm just interested in the technical reason why it's not even faster than the F1.
Yeah, it just has more drag, it's that simple.Not suggesting the T.50 should have chased a higher top speed or that this would make the car better, I'm just interested in the technical reason why it's not even faster than the F1.
According to GMA the T.50 has "three times" the downforce of the F1. Not sure if that's with the Vmax mode active or not, but either way it has a lot more downforce - which of course means more drag as there are no freebies. Additionally, the T.50 is slightly wider and taller, so the frontal area is gonna be marginally bigger too.
GMA have also said that the top speed could potentially be even higher - the 226mph figure is only calculated and not a result of an actual high speed test as far as I know - so maybe there is a room for a surprise. The gearing should not be an issue - based on the gear ratios they published, even the shorter 6th gear should be good for 243mph.
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