Historical or useless car facts.

[Futuramic]

tali1 said:

Futuramic said:

tali1 said:

Nissan Primera was first car in its class with ABS standard across range.

Edited by tali1 on Friday 26th September 20:52

Edited by tali1 on Monday 6th October 19:38

I disagree! Here's why. The Mk3 Granada, introduced somewhere between '86 and '87, I'm sure I've seen rough ones on the D and perhaps C, was the first family car to have ABS as standard across the range. Ford in the mid eighties had a fixation with the system, even going as far as to fit a mechnical setup to top spec Fiestas and Orions which were bereft of engine management computers. The mechanical ABS, if a fault developed, became a Satanic killing machine prone to releasing brake pressure during emergency stops. The Granada though, didn't have it.

The Mk3 Granada had a full blown ECU that ran the ABS, as well as injecing fuel into the twin-cam engines and controlling the cat. With the added, tasty, ingredient of the MT75 gearbox the Mk3 was a thoroughly modern car indeed.

The Nissan Primera was designed in about 1988. Prototypes were running by '89 and serious hatchback and saloon production began by the Tyne in 1990-ish. The estates were imported fully made up from Japan. There was some advancement over the older, cheaper and quite possibly superior and better looking Bluebird. 16 valve engines were standardised and both outside and interior were restyled in the definitively bland fashion of the nineties.

Octav Botnar wasn't happy. The Bluebird had an unrivalled reputation for toughness and durability; it may not have handled or performed but it lasted. Good quality steel and ruged drivetrains elevated it into the Volvo class of longevity. These things, loved by customers, were cheap. The much more advanced Primera was far more expensive. Not wishing to lose the Bluebird's audience the Primera was made more cheaply, and not as well.

There was also an absolute poverty specification 1.6 in the initial lineup. This had a carb feeding the 16 valve unit, not catalyst and of course, no ABS.

It's in the wording "first car in its class" AND my original post mentions the Granada as being the first car with ABS standard across the range- subtle differences.
Whilst i agree that the Primera had a "outside and interior were restyled in the definitively bland fashion of the nineties." there is nothing to my knowledge that it was of inferior build or reliability to a Bluebird.
As for Botnar he wanted to continue selling pile em high and cheap - but Nissan wanted to go upmarket and also it is claimed grab his lucrative AFN operation.It's reckoned he was stitched up by the HM customs and Nissan HQ soon after.

I've looked up the specifications for the original Primera in an Observers book of cars for '91. ABS is listed as unavailable for both the 1.6 LX and the 2.0 litre saloon. I used to own a Bluebird and it was incredibly well built, far more rust resistant than the early Primeras I've seen.

[tali1]

Futuramic said:

tali1 said:

Futuramic said:

tali1 said:

Nissan Primera was first car in its class with ABS standard across range.

Edited by tali1 on Friday 26th September 20:52

Edited by tali1 on Monday 6th October 19:38

I disagree! Here's why. The Mk3 Granada, introduced somewhere between '86 and '87, I'm sure I've seen rough ones on the D and perhaps C, was the first family car to have ABS as standard across the range. Ford in the mid eighties had a fixation with the system, even going as far as to fit a mechnical setup to top spec Fiestas and Orions which were bereft of engine management computers. The mechanical ABS, if a fault developed, became a Satanic killing machine prone to releasing brake pressure during emergency stops. The Granada though, didn't have it.

The Mk3 Granada had a full blown ECU that ran the ABS, as well as injecing fuel into the twin-cam engines and controlling the cat. With the added, tasty, ingredient of the MT75 gearbox the Mk3 was a thoroughly modern car indeed.

The Nissan Primera was designed in about 1988. Prototypes were running by '89 and serious hatchback and saloon production began by the Tyne in 1990-ish. The estates were imported fully made up from Japan. There was some advancement over the older, cheaper and quite possibly superior and better looking Bluebird. 16 valve engines were standardised and both outside and interior were restyled in the definitively bland fashion of the nineties.

Octav Botnar wasn't happy. The Bluebird had an unrivalled reputation for toughness and durability; it may not have handled or performed but it lasted. Good quality steel and ruged drivetrains elevated it into the Volvo class of longevity. These things, loved by customers, were cheap. The much more advanced Primera was far more expensive. Not wishing to lose the Bluebird's audience the Primera was made more cheaply, and not as well.

There was also an absolute poverty specification 1.6 in the initial lineup. This had a carb feeding the 16 valve unit, not catalyst and of course, no ABS.

It's in the wording "first car in its class" AND my original post mentions the Granada as being the first car with ABS standard across the range- subtle differences.
Whilst i agree that the Primera had a "outside and interior were restyled in the definitively bland fashion of the nineties." there is nothing to my knowledge that it was of inferior build or reliability to a Bluebird.
As for Botnar he wanted to continue selling pile em high and cheap - but Nissan wanted to go upmarket and also it is claimed grab his lucrative AFN operation.It's reckoned he was stitched up by the HM customs and Nissan HQ soon after.

I've looked up the specifications for the original Primera in an Observers book of cars for '91. ABS is listed as unavailable for both the 1.6 LX and the 2.0 litre saloon. I used to own a Bluebird and it was incredibly well built, far more rust resistant than the early Primeras I've seen.

Its the series 2 from 1993.
I think your Primera/Bluebird experience whilst true is simply anecdotal and not representative in general.

[LuS1fer]

Plus I never saw a road test that didn't think the Bluebird was a disaster on wheels. The Primera moved the dynamics on a lot.

[AL...Ease]

I read something somewhere that said the Primera had won some awards for its chassis and was the stiffest chassis in its class.... Or something similar.

[Aquadrome]

AL...Ease said:

I read something somewhere that said the Primera had won some awards for its chassis and was the stiffest chassis in its class.... Or something similar.

The Primera was certainly the handling benchmark for Ford when they were developing the original Mondeo.

[niva441]

Aquadrome said:

AL...Ease said:

I read something somewhere that said the Primera had won some awards for its chassis and was the stiffest chassis in its class.... Or something similar.

The Primera was certainly the handling benchmark for Ford when they were developing the original Mondeo.

It's front suspension geometry was unique (apart from the 300ZX) in that it acted like a equal length wishbone when straight ahead. When on lock it acted like a unequal length system.

[tali1]

The Thrust SSC Land Speed record car does 0.04MPG at maximum speed.

[Marquis_Rex]

On the Dodge Rams, in order to query fault codes that the OBD computer is kicking up a fuss about without getting a reader- you set the transmission in neutral (with parking brake on), and then key-on (to ACC) -key-off-key-on-key-off-key-on in rapid sequence.

The fault codes will then be displayed within the matrix display within the speedo.

[Marquis_Rex]

Both the big block Dodges and small blocks have a tappet/lifter diameter of 0.904 inches while the Small block Chevys have tappet/lifter diameters of 0.842 inches. 0.904 inches was actually the NASCAR limit.
This means that the Mopars cans utlise a a higher velocity during the opening and closing flanks of the cam profile and ultimately a more agressive profile for potentially better performance.

[W1 NER]

[quote=TheKeyboardDemon]
Another Example:

The BMW logo came from BMW's historical past where they used to make propeller engines for war planes, the white represents clouds, the blue for the sky, the lines between represent the propeller and the circle for the shape made when the blades are turning.

quote]

Not sure if this has already been said, can't be arsed to read 60 pages!

People always say this about the BM badge but it is untrue, it's actually taken from the bavarian flag

[stifler]

Balmoral Green said:

sniff diesel said:

That sounds like a great idea, I'd never heard of it before. Wonder why it never caught on?

It did, it was pretty much standard on most cars of the forties, fifties and sixties. The mystery is why it disappeared?

Indeed, it worked really well on the Morris Minor. Better than on a stalk, I would say.

[hugo a gogo]

Futuramic said:

The Nissan Primera was designed in about 1988. Prototypes were running by '89 and serious hatchback and saloon production began by the Tyne in 1990-ish.

Nissan Washington is far closer to the Wear than the Tyne

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&amp...

[Silent1]

stifler said:

Balmoral Green said:

sniff diesel said:

That sounds like a great idea, I'd never heard of it before. Wonder why it never caught on?

It did, it was pretty much standard on most cars of the forties, fifties and sixties. The mystery is why it disappeared?

Indeed, it worked really well on the Morris Minor. Better than on a stalk, I would say.

What are you talking about? I can't find the original post.

[Strawman]

Silent1 said:

stifler said:

Balmoral Green said:

sniff diesel said:

That sounds like a great idea, I'd never heard of it before. Wonder why it never caught on?

It did, it was pretty much standard on most cars of the forties, fifties and sixties. The mystery is why it disappeared?

Indeed, it worked really well on the Morris Minor. Better than on a stalk, I would say.

What are you talking about? I can't find the original post.

The main/dipped switch for the headlights (IIRC). Handy if you are cornering on a twisty road with main beams on and someone comes around a corner against you, you don't have to take your hands off the wheel.

[Dracoro]

However, for a long time, lights have been lot brighter than in yesteryear so you can mostly tell when someone is coming the otherway and be able to turn to dipped beam safely and in advance.

[williamp]

do you mean the foot switch for main/full??

I had one on the Rover P4. Didnt like it at all. With crossply tyres and a girl next to you on the bench seat, you were very busy with both hands and feet. Ahh, to be 17 again...

Mind you, to turn the lights on:

1) Turn rotary switch on the dashboard. This turns the sidelights on
2) The third stalk under the indicator. Pull his down, headlights come on
3) Main beam turned on/off via the foot switch

[Dracoro]

Strawman said:

The main/dipped switch for the headlights (IIRC). Handy if you are cornering on a twisty road with main beams on and someone comes around a corner against you, you don't have to take your hands off the wheel.

Hang on, just re-read that.

What car requires you to take your hands OFF the wheel to dip the headlights? I think EVERY car I've ever driven, the stalks can be operated without removing hands from the wheel, that's why they're placed where they are!

[mchammer89]

Dracoro said:

Strawman said:

The main/dipped switch for the headlights (IIRC). Handy if you are cornering on a twisty road with main beams on and someone comes around a corner against you, you don't have to take your hands off the wheel.

Hang on, just re-read that.

What car requires you to take your hands OFF the wheel to dip the headlights? I think EVERY car I've ever driven, the stalks can be operated without removing hands from the wheel, that's why they're placed where they are!

I think he means that when you're turning and your hands are near the top/bottom of the wheel as opposed to the sides where it's hard to hit the stalks while maintaining smooth cornering.

[Strawman]

Dracoro said:

Strawman said:

The main/dipped switch for the headlights (IIRC). Handy if you are cornering on a twisty road with main beams on and someone comes around a corner against you, you don't have to take your hands off the wheel.

Hang on, just re-read that.

What car requires you to take your hands OFF the wheel to dip the headlights? I think EVERY car I've ever driven, the stalks can be operated without removing hands from the wheel, that's why they're placed where they are!

I suppose it depends whether you drive with a driving test approved hands shuffle the wheel or fixed (mostly) hands on wheel position. I've never had a foot switch, and can't say I really miss one.

[Dracoro]

mchammer89 said:

Dracoro said:

Strawman said:

The main/dipped switch for the headlights (IIRC). Handy if you are cornering on a twisty road with main beams on and someone comes around a corner against you, you don't have to take your hands off the wheel.

Hang on, just re-read that.

What car requires you to take your hands OFF the wheel to dip the headlights? I think EVERY car I've ever driven, the stalks can be operated without removing hands from the wheel, that's why they're placed where they are!

I think he means that when you're turning and your hands are near the top/bottom of the wheel as opposed to the sides where it's hard to hit the stalks while maintaining smooth cornering.

Oh indeed I bet the IAM have something to say about they, you should be "shuffling" your hands when turning and never have them at top/bottom

Really though, it's never been a problem, shuffle hands a little and flip the stalk. You should be able to do this whilst smooth cornering with ease.