RE: Ford discontinues 2.3-litre Mustang in UK
Discussion
Teddy Lop said:
someone with the purchasing criteria of wanting "not a bad car" will find a renault or a nissan something. Someone spending over 40k generally wants something a bit more special than not bad.
You say that but look at how many quite average cars there are around for £40k new. I sat in a Merc C Class a year or so ago at MB world. Looked nice, decent spec (blue outside/ivory interior) that was a bout £45k and was a C220 diesel. I suspect many people just look at that monthly amount rather than the overall cost. My uncle actually bought an Alfa Giulia Veloce which is nice enough but less powerful than the Ecoboost Mustang. Guess its that debate over new or used as £40k buys a lot of nearly new car.
Alex_225 said:
You say that but look at how many quite average cars there are around for £40k new. I sat in a Merc C Class a year or so ago at MB world. Looked nice, decent spec (blue outside/ivory interior) that was a bout £45k and was a C220 diesel. I suspect many people just look at that monthly amount rather than the overall cost.
My uncle actually bought an Alfa Giulia Veloce which is nice enough but less powerful than the Ecoboost Mustang. Guess its that debate over new or used as £40k buys a lot of nearly new car.
sir is confused in his determining of average, most of the cars on the most popular new cars list rrp from around half of that. My uncle actually bought an Alfa Giulia Veloce which is nice enough but less powerful than the Ecoboost Mustang. Guess its that debate over new or used as £40k buys a lot of nearly new car.
Alex_225 said:
You say that but look at how many quite average cars there are around for £40k new. I sat in a Merc C Class a year or so ago at MB world. Looked nice, decent spec (blue outside/ivory interior) that was a bout £45k and was a C220 diesel. I suspect many people just look at that monthly amount rather than the overall cost.
My uncle actually bought an Alfa Giulia Veloce which is nice enough but less powerful than the Ecoboost Mustang. Guess its that debate over new or used as £40k buys a lot of nearly new car.
For the most basic new shape C Class you're looking at just over 38k, it'e no coincidence they always show the monthly costs rather than the RRP.My uncle actually bought an Alfa Giulia Veloce which is nice enough but less powerful than the Ecoboost Mustang. Guess its that debate over new or used as £40k buys a lot of nearly new car.
Stang without the rumble is a sad thing altogether. No loss.
On hols in the US in 2018, I read a few of the local W Coast car magazines. One had a group test of the Mustang, Dodge Challenger and Chevrolet Camaro. They concluded that the Mustang was by far the best offering of the three, when you took build quality, mpg etc into account.
No doubt it is, but my heart would always be with a burnt orange Challenger ...
But if I really had the £ / $ going spare, I'd go older again:
On hols in the US in 2018, I read a few of the local W Coast car magazines. One had a group test of the Mustang, Dodge Challenger and Chevrolet Camaro. They concluded that the Mustang was by far the best offering of the three, when you took build quality, mpg etc into account.
No doubt it is, but my heart would always be with a burnt orange Challenger ...
But if I really had the £ / $ going spare, I'd go older again:
irocfan said:
biggbn said:
I'd have no problem running a four pot mustang. Sod what everyone else thinks.
Which is the right attitude tbhI do think it would be better (even in 2.3T form) with the manual gearbox or if you didn't have much experience of anything else (or just wanted to pootle)...
You may as well buy a Focus RS over a Mustang if going for the 4 cylinder out of choice.
Tbh it depends on the Mazda engine, I wouldn't object to a 3 rotor brapping rotary in place of the V8, Rob Dahm took a rotary swapped corvette to the worlds largest V8 festival and was generally well received.
Section 8 said:
I was in traffic the other night and a could see a Mustang behind me. I thought to myself how I still think they are a great looking car and something that’s been remade as an actual decent homage to a classic . As I turned off it went past and then I heard the engine and suddenly realised....oh dear.. the Ecoboost 2.3 was just not delivering to expected rumble.
I liken it to booking a ticket to see the London Philharmonic and as you sit down with baited breath to hear the whole ensemble burst into life with the John Williams iconic Imperial March..... out comes the sound of a bloke on a Casio key board playing the Cantina song.
Imagine the scene. 3 kids stood by the car. You turn up and they await for you to depart to hear that engine. You turn the key and they look around waiting for a Mazda to sod off. Then they realise it’s you ??.It needs to do 60 in under 5 to outrun the embarrassment! Messing aside it’s definitely not my choice of engine.
Had a similar realisation when I went to watch the cycling at the velodrome at the Olympic park, one of the main drawers was the spectacle of the Keirin which was a load of cyclists chasing an old guy in a leather hat on a Derny (assisted two stroke 100cc motorbike) which had really long gearing so the Derny rider would only have to pedal at a low rpm which showed the evolution from cycle to motorcycle but now to XR wokeness it's turned into some bellend on a cheap mtb style ebike pedalling furiously so now the sight, sound (and taste) has been removed and the audience are the main losers.I liken it to booking a ticket to see the London Philharmonic and as you sit down with baited breath to hear the whole ensemble burst into life with the John Williams iconic Imperial March..... out comes the sound of a bloke on a Casio key board playing the Cantina song.
Imagine the scene. 3 kids stood by the car. You turn up and they await for you to depart to hear that engine. You turn the key and they look around waiting for a Mazda to sod off. Then they realise it’s you ??.It needs to do 60 in under 5 to outrun the embarrassment! Messing aside it’s definitely not my choice of engine.
Tbh it depends on the Mazda engine, I wouldn't object to a 3 rotor brapping rotary in place of the V8, Rob Dahm took a rotary swapped corvette to the worlds largest V8 festival and was generally well received.
untakenname said:
Tbh it depends on the Mazda engine, I wouldn't object to a 3 rotor brapping rotary in place of the V8, Rob Dahm took a rotary swapped corvette to the worlds largest V8 festival and was generally well received.
I think he's referring to the 2.3T being an evolution of the Mazda-L engine which Ford took with them when they sold their stake in Mazda (and then Mazda themselves dropped for the SkyActiv). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazda_L_engine#2.3L_...
The engine in a car is the most important part of the car for me, so it would be the V8 or nothing. I do think that the majority of people don't actually care about the engine though(Volvo only make 4 cylinder engines for example now).
You also only have to look at how popular electric cars are now to see that most people don't care about engines. As long as the car moves they are happy.
You also only have to look at how popular electric cars are now to see that most people don't care about engines. As long as the car moves they are happy.
cerb4.5lee said:
The engine in a car is the most important part of the car for me, so it would be the V8 or nothing. I do think that the majority of people don't actually care about the engine though(Volvo only make 4 cylinder engines for example now).
You also only have to look at how popular electric cars are now to see that most people don't care about engines. As long as the car moves they are happy.
Sadly you're right, the fact that the vast majority of people consider a 4 cylinder diesel engine to be an acceptable engine for a car costing upwards of £40k speaks volumes; for me a 520d is a truly hateful car because of the inappropriate engine, but I'm very much in the minority on that front.You also only have to look at how popular electric cars are now to see that most people don't care about engines. As long as the car moves they are happy.
I disagree about electric though - they make the most refined V12 with the most sophisticated automatic gearbox feel like some piece of mid 19th century steam powered farm equipment. The refinement, instant response, ability to incredibly precisely meter out power, and the torque curve/power delivery are all vastly superior to internal combustion, I can't wait for something like an EV MX5
Also, V8 or nothing? They're nice, but a third of the engine is missing surely?
stickleback123 said:
Sadly you're right, the fact that the vast majority of people consider a 4 cylinder diesel engine to be an acceptable engine for a car costing upwards of £40k speaks volumes; for me a 520d is a truly hateful car because of the inappropriate engine, but I'm very much in the minority on that front.
I disagree about electric though - they make the most refined V12 with the most sophisticated automatic gearbox feel like some piece of mid 19th century steam powered farm equipment. The refinement, instant response, ability to incredibly precisely meter out power, and the torque curve/power delivery are all vastly superior to internal combustion, I can't wait for something like an EV MX5
Also, V8 or nothing? They're nice, but a third of the engine is missing surely?
Yes and I share exactly the same view as you regarding the 520d. A premium car without the premium engine is what I've always thought. I disagree about electric though - they make the most refined V12 with the most sophisticated automatic gearbox feel like some piece of mid 19th century steam powered farm equipment. The refinement, instant response, ability to incredibly precisely meter out power, and the torque curve/power delivery are all vastly superior to internal combustion, I can't wait for something like an EV MX5
Also, V8 or nothing? They're nice, but a third of the engine is missing surely?
I'd like to try an electric car because you do hear(excuse the pun!) great things about them for sure.
I certainly wouldn't say no to a V10 or V12 engine!
cerb4.5lee said:
Yes and I share exactly the same view as you regarding the 520d. A premium car without the premium engine is what I've always thought.
I'd like to try an electric car because you do hear(excuse the pun!) great things about them for sure.
I certainly wouldn't say no to a V10 or V12 engine!
If you're an engine man you really need to try an EV, and if anything the basic cheap ones are even more impressive than the expensive ones because the delta in how good the drivetrain is over some miserable four banger is immense. Obviously there is no visceral thrill in revving it out, but how many cars has that ever actually been true for.I'd like to try an electric car because you do hear(excuse the pun!) great things about them for sure.
I certainly wouldn't say no to a V10 or V12 engine!
I suspect in 20 years when it's all EVs people will think it's hilarious that we used to drive around in stuff with engines as s
t as the 2 litre diesel rattlers.rockin said:
Drivers of electric cars see a big V8 coming and start showing off their "wonderful electric performance". Then one of two things happens,
Drivers of big V8 petrol cars see a four pot diesel coming and start showing off their "wonderful V8 performance". Then one of two things happens,- They have to slow down to avoid flattening their battery, or
- You stop later for a quick fill of petrol and see them still stuck on the charger.
- They have to slow down to avoid running out of fuel, or
- You drive past them later stopped for petrol while you still have half a tank.
untakenname said:
Had a similar realisation when I went to watch the cycling at the velodrome at the Olympic park, one of the main drawers was the spectacle of the Keirin which was a load of cyclists chasing an old guy in a leather hat on a Derny (assisted two stroke 100cc motorbike) which had really long gearing so the Derny rider would only have to pedal at a low rpm which showed the evolution from cycle to motorcycle but now to XR wokeness it's turned into some bellend on a cheap mtb style ebike pedalling furiously so now the sight, sound (and taste) has been removed and the audience are the main losers.
I'd love one of those old Derny's. Be great for pottering about the village apart from the lack of suspension and brakes, obviously. It's sad they've done away with them. It's taken away all the character. otolith said:
Drivers of big V8 petrol cars see a four pot diesel coming and start showing off their "wonderful V8 performance". Then one of two things happens,
I'd very, very, very happily swap the V12 in my sensible family four door car for driving the kids round in for the electric alternative; range would probably be higher, refinement higher, reliability better, performance better, and instead of standing around in the cold for 5 minutes pouring £120 of super in it every 220 miles I could just plug it in outside the house and "fill" it for a fiver.- They have to slow down to avoid running out of fuel, or
- You drive past them later stopped for petrol while you still have half a tank.
45 mins stopped to take a leak and get a coffee every 250 - 300 miles on a longer journey might be irritating but the benefits would vastly outweigh that inconvenience for me.
To bring things back on topic, I'd rather have a pogo stick than an ecoboost mustang
Bennet said:
Well, I must be the only PH member who would have actually opted for the 4 cylinder if I were buying one.
I know the V8 sounds fantastic, but I tend to find I prefer the response and involvement you get from a 4 cylinder. (Or used to...)
All this stuff about the 2.3 being the equivalent of trouser stuffing is risible. Buying any Mustang, particularly the V8, is dangerously akin to trouser stuffing. It's called a "muscle car" for a reason. That's why people buy them.
The response of the V8 Mustang I had was pin sharp, the engine is master piece. The response of the 2.3 is crap in comparison being a turbo lump... and there is no human way that the Turbo 4 cyl is more involving than the high revving V8. I know the V8 sounds fantastic, but I tend to find I prefer the response and involvement you get from a 4 cylinder. (Or used to...)
All this stuff about the 2.3 being the equivalent of trouser stuffing is risible. Buying any Mustang, particularly the V8, is dangerously akin to trouser stuffing. It's called a "muscle car" for a reason. That's why people buy them.
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