I've become bored of cars.

[Slow]

C70R said:

LamedonM said:

C70R said:

Slow said:

C70R said:

Quavers said:

Years ago there was a sense of achievement when you bought something nice.
But not anymore - everybody has the latest good thing on tick. That feeling of " I've made it" has gone.
I drive an 18 year old e60 - oddly I have been looking at mk3 cavaliers a lot lately.....

I've never understood this sense of achievement thing in buying something. I don't get people who are 'proud' of their cars.

Be proud of your family, your health, your personal achievements. Don't be proud because you've bought something.

People are proud of different things. Some people it may be family, others may be that artwork they always wanted, a house, a watch, a mountain they climbed or a car.

I just think it's a bit tragic to be proud of buying a material object.

According to you: it would be tragic to be proud to buy a house? Because it is a material object as well. You could as well be living in a cave. In short, don’t invalidate the feelings of others

Edited by LamedonM on Saturday 21st May 10:47

Housing is a bad example of a material possession. Shelter is a basic human requirement, so it makes sense to have pride in that as an achievement.

A nice watch or a nice car don't tend to feature on Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

So why not live in the smallest house possible in the worst area so that it is cheap? Or would you rather have pride in a nice house? Functionally it is the same as the cheap one, like a cheap car or a cheap watch.

[C70R]

Slow said:

So why not live in the smallest house possible in the worst area so that it is cheap? Or would you rather have pride in a nice house? Functionally it is the same as the cheap one, like a cheap car or a cheap watch.

That's not a very clever argument.

If someone is so poor that all they can afford is "the smallest house possible in the worst area", that shouldn't prevent them from having pride in providing shelter for themselves and their family.

Having pride in owning a car or a watch is no different to having pride in owning a handbag or a pair of sunglasses. It's just materialism.

Nothing should stop you enjoying any of those material items, but having pride in owning them is a bit sad and materialistic.

[Leon R]

What if the pride you have is in the fact that hard work and dedication enabled you to obtain it.

[C70R]

Leon R said:

What if the pride you have is in the fact that hard work and dedication enabled you to obtain it.

Then be proud of working hard.

Don't be proud of buying a car.

[Leon R]

That thinking is too binary for me.

[SidewaysSi]

C70R said:

Leon R said:

What if the pride you have is in the fact that hard work and dedication enabled you to obtain it.

Then be proud of working hard.

Don't be proud of buying a car.

An achievement is an achievement, irrespective of the form it takes.

Totally valid for someone to be proud they are able to buy a car of their dreams. It's not about the monetary transaction of course.

Working hard doesn't always generate cash as we all know so the pure act of working hard isn't something to be proud about if it doesn't achieve the goals you want it to.

[s m]

Quavers said:

I drive an 18 year old e60 - oddly I have been looking at mk3 cavaliers a lot lately.....

Last of the line V6 with the quicker rack is where my money would go
Still reasonably fast even now for a 167bhp car

[LamedonM]

C70R said:

LamedonM said:

C70R said:

Slow said:

C70R said:

Quavers said:

Years ago there was a sense of achievement when you bought something nice.
But not anymore - everybody has the latest good thing on tick. That feeling of " I've made it" has gone.
I drive an 18 year old e60 - oddly I have been looking at mk3 cavaliers a lot lately.....

I've never understood this sense of achievement thing in buying something. I don't get people who are 'proud' of their cars.

Be proud of your family, your health, your personal achievements. Don't be proud because you've bought something.

People are proud of different things. Some people it may be family, others may be that artwork they always wanted, a house, a watch, a mountain they climbed or a car.

I just think it's a bit tragic to be proud of buying a material object.

According to you: it would be tragic to be proud to buy a house? Because it is a material object as well. You could as well be living in a cave. In short, don’t invalidate the feelings of others

Edited by LamedonM on Saturday 21st May 10:47

Housing is a bad example of a material possession. Shelter is a basic human requirement, so it makes sense to have pride in that as an achievement.

A nice watch or a nice car don't tend to feature on Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

Things of this nature are in the upper most part of the Maslow’s hierarchy. What usually makes an event an achievement is how much you have to work to achieve it. Thus buying an iPhone may be an achievement for someone of modest background. A mistake many politicians have made. You should not project your values onto others.

[david106]

I too am bored with f##king suv's the other half wants another one when this one goes back give me a tidy sports car that she can't get in and a fast bike and i will die a happy man

[Slow]

david106 said:

I too am bored with f##king suv's the other half wants another one when this one goes back give me a tidy sports car that she can't get in and a fast bike and i will die a happy man

I drive a Range Rover, wouldn’t have anything else as the daily. My fun driving doesn’t happen on day to day shopping etc.

[pherlopolus]

Having just extended the lease on my Karoq (nothing out there vaguely interesting), I had a flash of inspiration after reading classic and sports car while in airport.

For 36k you can get a low mileage vantage, for the same as a mid spec karoq. Ok running costs will be a bit more but it's and Aston Martin.

I have 18 months to convince the domestic financial controller.

[C70R]

pherlopolus said:

For 36k you can get a low mileage vantage, for the same as a mid spec karoq. Ok running costs will be a bit more but it's and Aston Martin.

Running costs will be incomparable.

[Hoofy]

Slow said:

david106 said:

I too am bored with f##king suv's the other half wants another one when this one goes back give me a tidy sports car that she can't get in and a fast bike and i will die a happy man

I drive a Range Rover, wouldn’t have anything else as the daily. My fun driving doesn’t happen on day to day shopping etc.

Makes dull journeys more fun, though. I regularly pop to Tesco in my fun car. Boot's not great, mind.

[kylos27]

Op needs a lotus Carlton or diesel focus

[pherlopolus]

C70R said:

pherlopolus said:

For 36k you can get a low mileage vantage, for the same as a mid spec karoq. Ok running costs will be a bit more but it's and Aston Martin.

Running costs will be incomparable.

Oh I know, £1500 to £2000 is my expectations, but my usage patterns are likely to drop from 15-20k per year down to 8-10 due changing how we run business vehicles. And at 51 some things need to be just done. And the depreciation will be less than the lease costs.

[Jaguar steve]

C70R said:

That's not a very clever argument.

If someone is so poor that all they can afford is "the smallest house possible in the worst area", that shouldn't prevent them from having pride in providing shelter for themselves and their family.

Having pride in owning a car or a watch is no different to having pride in owning a handbag or a pair of sunglasses. It's just materialism.

Nothing should stop you enjoying any of those material items, but having pride in owning them is a bit sad and materialistic.

Materialism is very sad.

Being proud of your practical skills or intellectual ability or your contribution toward society or your children's achievements as examples is one thing, but being proud of your material possessions is entirely different because that's invariably paralleled with egotism which can only be satisfied by relentlessly showing your possessions off and comparing and competing with other peoples possessions.

The moment egotism enters the equation you become a slave to your possessions rather than the master of them and it's an entirely reasonable suggestion that it's better to reject that slavery and live instead unencumbered as a free man.

[swisstoni]

I feel sorry for those who feel the need to fly their car collection to London for the season and display them around certain hotels and shops.
To be that wealthy and think that’s a good thing to do with their money is a sign of poverty of character and incredible lack of awareness generally imho.

For someone who ‘came from nothing’ and strove to achieve the means to buy their childhood dream of a Ferrari, I have a very different opinion.

[C70R]

pherlopolus said:

C70R said:

pherlopolus said:

For 36k you can get a low mileage vantage, for the same as a mid spec karoq. Ok running costs will be a bit more but it's and Aston Martin.

Running costs will be incomparable.

Oh I know, 1500 to 2000 is my expectations, but my usage patterns are likely to drop from 15-20k per year down to 8-10 due changing how we run business vehicles. And at 51 some things need to be just done. And the depreciation will be less than the lease costs.

You're underestimating still. Serving at a decent specialist will be almost £1,000/yr, and that's before you fix or change any parts on a complicated ageing car.

A friend of mine ran one and it was eye-opening - he got a stone chip in one of his headlights, and couldn't find a good replacement for less than £7-800.

It really is a different league from your imagination.

[MC Bodge]

If you don't like the car, sell it.

If you don't like new fast cars, buy an older one if you want to.

If you no longer enjoy driving as a hobby, do something else.


On the roads, it's not a race. The satisfaction from many activities comes from becoming better at the skill or mastering the control, despite the imperfections, quirks or shortcomings of the equipment. Being able to hit 150mph in a short distance in a car with various driver aids is impressive and will be initially fun, but it doesn't require much skill -and probably quite risky, responsibly/legally/punishment speaking, on the road.

[SidewaysSi]

Jaguar steve said:

C70R said:

That's not a very clever argument.

If someone is so poor that all they can afford is "the smallest house possible in the worst area", that shouldn't prevent them from having pride in providing shelter for themselves and their family.

Having pride in owning a car or a watch is no different to having pride in owning a handbag or a pair of sunglasses. It's just materialism.

Nothing should stop you enjoying any of those material items, but having pride in owning them is a bit sad and materialistic.

Materialism is very sad.

Being proud of your practical skills or intellectual ability or your contribution toward society or your children's achievements as examples is one thing, but being proud of your material possessions is entirely different because that's invariably paralleled with egotism which can only be satisfied by relentlessly showing your possessions off and comparing and competing with other peoples possessions.

The moment egotism enters the equation you become a slave to your possessions rather than the master of them and it's an entirely reasonable suggestion that it's better to reject that slavery and live instead unencumbered as a free man.

I didn't know that's how you felt. Should have mentioned it before.

Anyway, how's the yacht?