RE: PH Fleet: Ferrari 599 GTB
Discussion
toppstuff said:
Personally, I prefer the 612.
The 612 is not the same kind of car of course, more GT and less raw, but it is maturing beautifully IMO and looks better now that it did when new when compared to others.
And there are a few manuals around. I know Chris Harris has had a 612 before, but I have a real soft spot for them and I'm not normally a fan of the dancing donkeys.
Had one: loved it. Would heartily recommend it to others. The 612 is not the same kind of car of course, more GT and less raw, but it is maturing beautifully IMO and looks better now that it did when new when compared to others.
And there are a few manuals around. I know Chris Harris has had a 612 before, but I have a real soft spot for them and I'm not normally a fan of the dancing donkeys.
Chris Harris said:
toppstuff said:
Personally, I prefer the 612.
....
Had one: loved it. Would heartily recommend it to others. ....
A 458 Spider and a 612 sat next to each other is perhaps a better bet than 458/599 combo?
What do you reckon having had both?
Stitch said:
Absolutely, CH is being a bit naughty here and not telling the whole truth - £350pm on £50-odd grand would take 15+ years to pay off.
"the man on the street" needs to be very careful about this sort of deal. Don't forget, CH is in part getting paid to do this sort of thing (it gives him something to write about) but for the rest of us there is a different equation.
Stuart: are you paying me to run a Ferrari? If so, please forward the cash asap, because I haven't seen any of it."the man on the street" needs to be very careful about this sort of deal. Don't forget, CH is in part getting paid to do this sort of thing (it gives him something to write about) but for the rest of us there is a different equation.
Sorry old bean, I'm just a car-romantic doing his thing in public. It's vicarious-web-car-journalism-stuff: part of a nu-media-experiment. Or something.
You can have the same deal if you want. Just go and ask.
If this is irresponsible, where do you stand on conventional magazines saying the new M5 is a belter, encouraging people to go to a BMW showroom and bung £40k down on a new one? Because by my maths, a new, list-price M5 will cost far, far more between now and next summer.
But, just to make it clear. The following things are dangerous:
Smoking
Talking to strangers
Crossing the road
Drinking beer
Heroin
Asparagus (if you intend to urinate in a public place within 4hrs of eating it)
StottyZr said:
Very true. Maybe in a couple of weeks we could have a write up on the car and early thoughts in a new thread? By then the finance talk should hopefully be concealed in this thread 
I'd love to see some pictures of the interior, currently watching 599 vids on youtube. (Carrera GT is faster
)
Video next week, I hope!!I'd love to see some pictures of the interior, currently watching 599 vids on youtube. (Carrera GT is faster
)Chris Harris said:
Stitch said:
Absolutely, CH is being a bit naughty here and not telling the whole truth - £350pm on £50-odd grand would take 15+ years to pay off.
"the man on the street" needs to be very careful about this sort of deal. Don't forget, CH is in part getting paid to do this sort of thing (it gives him something to write about) but for the rest of us there is a different equation.
Stuart: are you paying me to run a Ferrari? If so, please forward the cash asap, because I haven't seen any of it."the man on the street" needs to be very careful about this sort of deal. Don't forget, CH is in part getting paid to do this sort of thing (it gives him something to write about) but for the rest of us there is a different equation.
Sorry old bean, I'm just a car-romantic doing his thing in public. It's vicarious-web-car-journalism-stuff: part of a nu-media-experiment. Or something.
You can have the same deal if you want. Just go and ask.
If this is irresponsible, where do you stand on conventional magazines saying the new M5 is a belter, encouraging people to go to a BMW showroom and bung £40k down on a new one? Because by my maths, a new, list-price M5 will cost far, far more between now and next summer.
But, just to make it clear. The following things are dangerous:
Smoking
Talking to strangers
Crossing the road
Drinking beer
Heroin
Asparagus (if you intend to urinate in a public place within 4hrs of eating it)
http://www.wisegeek.com/why-does-asparagus-make-so...
LongLiveTazio said:
Find this all a bit odd. Describing a supercar as a 'smoker', decrying a model for having miles that you wouldn't bat an eyelid about and then putting money into Ferrari's coffers, despite having made a lot of noise about their 'practices'. 
Wasn't aware there were rules governing application of adjectives to particular car-genres: happy to consider obeying them if you publish the manual.Don't understand your mileage comment.
The Jalopnik piece explicitly said I have always loved the cars. You should try reading it.
Your odd-feeling is reciprocated.
bertie said:
I'm in a 599 at the moment, bloody love it, great car, epic engine, but I've got a 458 Spider comming soonish, so the question is, do I keep the 599, or swap the 599 for a 612 using my man logic to convince the wife it's got 4 seats so we could go places with the kids.
A 458 Spider and a 612 sat next to each other is perhaps a better bet than 458/599 combo?
What do you reckon having had both?
Yes, yes and yes.A 458 Spider and a 612 sat next to each other is perhaps a better bet than 458/599 combo?
What do you reckon having had both?
Just keep the 599 and have all three. With as much finance as possible.
Congrats on buying an EPIC car Chris. I think the GTB is a bargain, especially when you compare it to the GTO, which would cost at least £350,000 and is basically the same car, but many reckon, worse for the extra horsepower. I've seen a few GTO's on the road, always being driven slowly by someone too scared to use thei power for fear of having very expensive accident.
Additionally, if you actually use the GTB, it willdepreciate far less than if you used a GTO, so more man math justification.
I think you've probably save yourself £100,000 over buying a GTO that you actually use..... but dont tell the missus, she'll want to spend the money you've 'saved'......
Always the problem with man maths, the women want to see the results. They just dont understand.....
Additionally, if you actually use the GTB, it willdepreciate far less than if you used a GTO, so more man math justification.
I think you've probably save yourself £100,000 over buying a GTO that you actually use..... but dont tell the missus, she'll want to spend the money you've 'saved'......
Always the problem with man maths, the women want to see the results. They just dont understand.....
Chris Harris said:
bertie said:
I'm in a 599 at the moment, bloody love it, great car, epic engine, but I've got a 458 Spider comming soonish, so the question is, do I keep the 599, or swap the 599 for a 612 using my man logic to convince the wife it's got 4 seats so we could go places with the kids.
A 458 Spider and a 612 sat next to each other is perhaps a better bet than 458/599 combo?
What do you reckon having had both?
Yes, yes and yes.A 458 Spider and a 612 sat next to each other is perhaps a better bet than 458/599 combo?
What do you reckon having had both?
Just keep the 599 and have all three. With as much finance as possible.
My "sensible" option is a 550 to sit next to the 458 on the basis they aren't loosing money now.
But with 612s at £55k, how much lower can they go before they bottom out?
This man maths gets you into reall trouble!
It’s actually a good buy and a bit of a bargain for what it is; with the exception of the single clutch gearbox and being a bit wide it’s faultless.
Firstly, you’ve got basically an Enzo engine under the bonnet, that’s something to shout about. I don’t think people realise how special the 599 really is, if you could by a sports coupe with a Lambo V12, or BMW V12 in the front people would go nuts for it, because front engine V12 Fezzas have always been, people take them for granted.
Personally I love it Chris, although I don’t think it looks as purposeful as the 575, that looked like a missile, especially from the front. The bonnet and headlights on the 575 is an epic bit of design, the 599 is a little softer, however I suppose for a daily (if you can really call it that) it’s more suitable.
The one area the 599’s looks score big for me is lack of aging, it still looks like a brand new design, and I think it’ll age better than the 550/575. Ferrari’s tendency to age seems to be more prolific than most other supercars/super GTs. There are a few exceptions, the 360CS still looks the nuts for example, I think the 599 will join that group of Fezzas.
Firstly, you’ve got basically an Enzo engine under the bonnet, that’s something to shout about. I don’t think people realise how special the 599 really is, if you could by a sports coupe with a Lambo V12, or BMW V12 in the front people would go nuts for it, because front engine V12 Fezzas have always been, people take them for granted.
Personally I love it Chris, although I don’t think it looks as purposeful as the 575, that looked like a missile, especially from the front. The bonnet and headlights on the 575 is an epic bit of design, the 599 is a little softer, however I suppose for a daily (if you can really call it that) it’s more suitable.
The one area the 599’s looks score big for me is lack of aging, it still looks like a brand new design, and I think it’ll age better than the 550/575. Ferrari’s tendency to age seems to be more prolific than most other supercars/super GTs. There are a few exceptions, the 360CS still looks the nuts for example, I think the 599 will join that group of Fezzas.
Well done Chris for having balls big enough firstly to sink that amount of cash into a Ferrari, and secondly for admitting (again) to finance on PH - don't you know you could've had 13 smokey old beemers for your £40k...etc etc
I agree with the view of owning the car you want today, whilst you can, knowing from the outset that you might lose money and that you won't own it forever, but that you'll have had a hell of a lot of enjoyment along the way.
You only live once and all that..
I agree with the view of owning the car you want today, whilst you can, knowing from the outset that you might lose money and that you won't own it forever, but that you'll have had a hell of a lot of enjoyment along the way.
You only live once and all that..
The new Lovett Ferrari delaership that Chris mentiomed is an amazing place, it's enormous and a very, very nice place to be. I was there last week with my 11 yr old son who was gladly clicking away on the Ferrari configurator, slowly putting together his take on what a 458 should look like. If you get a chance, you really must pull off the M4 at Jct 16 and go take a look - it's stunning!
Oh and Chris's RS 4.0 litre is still in the showroom too along with Harry Metcalfe's classic Ferrari plus an Autokraft Cobra and a gorgeous black SLS and.....well, you get the picture
Oh and Chris's RS 4.0 litre is still in the showroom too along with Harry Metcalfe's classic Ferrari plus an Autokraft Cobra and a gorgeous black SLS and.....well, you get the picture
agreed on the subject of life if for living and take your chances...
However his 40k is not safe. i assume it is a baloon payment situation which means his 40k is the part that will be eaten into when the car depreciates whilst the finance company are guaranteed their return. this whole system works on the basis your equity share is at risk and you guarantee to meet the commitments although I assume there is a limited depreciaton clause to limit the downside but if it goes from 100k to 80k then that is your hit niot the finance companies hit.
the gamble in this equasion is if the car depreciates which would leave him carrying the candle not the bank and losing all or some of his deposit and monthly payments. its a gamble worth taking if you are confident about used car prices in 1-2 yrs time.
Nevertheless life is about living not dreaming so hat off to the man.
However his 40k is not safe. i assume it is a baloon payment situation which means his 40k is the part that will be eaten into when the car depreciates whilst the finance company are guaranteed their return. this whole system works on the basis your equity share is at risk and you guarantee to meet the commitments although I assume there is a limited depreciaton clause to limit the downside but if it goes from 100k to 80k then that is your hit niot the finance companies hit.
the gamble in this equasion is if the car depreciates which would leave him carrying the candle not the bank and losing all or some of his deposit and monthly payments. its a gamble worth taking if you are confident about used car prices in 1-2 yrs time.
Nevertheless life is about living not dreaming so hat off to the man.
Guvernator said:
I really am not sure what some peoples problem with finance is on PH tbh. We are lucky enough to live in a country where credit is relatively easy to come by and very cheap at the moment, yes sometimes this means that people live above their means and get into uneccesary debt but that's really there problem.
The rest of the sensible adults who actually have a basic grasp of maths and what they can afford can use it as a great way to be able to buy the things they want now without having to wait 10 years (you could be hit by a bus tomorrow) or investing their life savings.
Chris has invested £40k of his own money, whether he got this from a very astute Porsche sale or pimping his body is nobodys concern but his, the fact is he has taken a gamble and put his money were his mouth is.
Is it a wise investment? Let's look at the facts. He WILL get his £40k back when he sells the car so very little risk of loosing his initial investment. In the meantime the £350 a month will pay for the depreciation (assuming values don't tank massively) so in effect it is only costing £350 a month to drive a Ferrari supercar capable of 200mph! If that isn't an absolute steal, I don't know what is. He may be "renting" it as some people put it but so what? Every car is "rented" in essence unless you plan on keeping it forever, how many people do that? Most cars are a short to medium term ownership prospect at best so you pay for the ownership of it in one way or the other, be it in monthly payments or depreciation? I'd rather be driving a 599 than almost any other car you'd care to mention including 2 Fiat 500's (I really LOL'd at this comparison), an Audi TDI sh*tbox or anything else you can get for £350 a month.
Well done Chris on having the balls to live the dream, even if it is on tick
The rest of the sensible adults who actually have a basic grasp of maths and what they can afford can use it as a great way to be able to buy the things they want now without having to wait 10 years (you could be hit by a bus tomorrow) or investing their life savings.
Chris has invested £40k of his own money, whether he got this from a very astute Porsche sale or pimping his body is nobodys concern but his, the fact is he has taken a gamble and put his money were his mouth is.
Is it a wise investment? Let's look at the facts. He WILL get his £40k back when he sells the car so very little risk of loosing his initial investment. In the meantime the £350 a month will pay for the depreciation (assuming values don't tank massively) so in effect it is only costing £350 a month to drive a Ferrari supercar capable of 200mph! If that isn't an absolute steal, I don't know what is. He may be "renting" it as some people put it but so what? Every car is "rented" in essence unless you plan on keeping it forever, how many people do that? Most cars are a short to medium term ownership prospect at best so you pay for the ownership of it in one way or the other, be it in monthly payments or depreciation? I'd rather be driving a 599 than almost any other car you'd care to mention including 2 Fiat 500's (I really LOL'd at this comparison), an Audi TDI sh*tbox or anything else you can get for £350 a month.
Well done Chris on having the balls to live the dream, even if it is on tick
Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 8th August 12:04
exaclty right and i agree on every level. which is why your right a 599 at that price is sensible any "mass produced " even M5 bmw is going to drop 30% pretty quickly.
If you want to improve the "curve" in your depreciation liablity then Left Hand Drive for exit route to europe or Middle East is the other way out but you wont get "drip" and will have to buy outright to play that game.
If you want to improve the "curve" in your depreciation liablity then Left Hand Drive for exit route to europe or Middle East is the other way out but you wont get "drip" and will have to buy outright to play that game.
Chris Harris said:
Stuart: are you paying me to run a Ferrari? If so, please forward the cash asap, because I haven't seen any of it.
Sorry old bean, I'm just a car-romantic doing his thing in public. It's vicarious-web-car-journalism-stuff: part of a nu-media-experiment. Or something.
You can have the same deal if you want. Just go and ask.
If this is irresponsible, where do you stand on conventional magazines saying the new M5 is a belter, encouraging people to go to a BMW showroom and bung £40k down on a new one? Because by my maths, a new, list-price M5 will cost far, far more between now and next summer.
But, just to make it clear. The following things are dangerous:
Smoking
Talking to strangers
Crossing the road
Drinking beer
Heroin
Asparagus (if you intend to urinate in a public place within 4hrs of eating it)
Sorry old bean, I'm just a car-romantic doing his thing in public. It's vicarious-web-car-journalism-stuff: part of a nu-media-experiment. Or something.
You can have the same deal if you want. Just go and ask.
If this is irresponsible, where do you stand on conventional magazines saying the new M5 is a belter, encouraging people to go to a BMW showroom and bung £40k down on a new one? Because by my maths, a new, list-price M5 will cost far, far more between now and next summer.
But, just to make it clear. The following things are dangerous:
Smoking
Talking to strangers
Crossing the road
Drinking beer
Heroin
Asparagus (if you intend to urinate in a public place within 4hrs of eating it)
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