RE: Check out the most valuable Ferrari ever auctioned

[Muzzer79]

Julian Scott said:

jason61c said:

As before, not as pretty or interesting as a toyota 2000GT.

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

Quite

Looks are subjective - I happen to think the Toyota is only average looking.

But to say a race-historied 60 year old V12 Ferrari is less interesting than a 2.0 straight-6 Toyota that only raced in Japan and was produced in ten times the volume is...........thin.

[NGK210]

esixtythree said:

Indeed. It's no longer a car. It's an instrument of wealth. The whole "this result achieved in collaboration with Ferrari" etc is such a turn off. It's all so money grubbing and vulgar.

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

[LotusOmega375D]

NGK210 said:

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

Yuk.

[Muzzer79]

NGK210 said:

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

That’s like saying you’ll commission a modern artist to paint a replica of a masterpiece.
It may be objectively ‘better’ but it’s not the same thing.

[JJJ.]

NGK210 said:

esixtythree said:

Indeed. It's no longer a car. It's an instrument of wealth. The whole "this result achieved in collaboration with Ferrari" etc is such a turn off. It's all so money grubbing and vulgar.

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

Can totally understand somebody commissioning GTO Engineering. But I could also understand somebody deciding instead to take their two mil or less and buy a Miura SV.

[jason61c]

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

[Muzzer79]

jason61c said:

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

Because a GTO wasn’t there?

[Neil1323bolts]

I showed this car to my 8 year old daughter and asked her to guess the price , £8000 she said , if only

[esixtythree]

ettore said:

You're making assumptions about all those who own GTO's unless you know them all?

The only thing one can say that they have in common is wealth - is that your issue?

If you don't agree with what I'm saying, you must be making assumptions, too, must be taking a view, too.

And it's obviously expedient for you to imply aspersions of jealousy or whatever to deflect rather than actually confront what motivates someone to pay $50 for a car that's barely if ever going to be driven.

[esixtythree]

NGK210 said:

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

Exactly. And it would drive better out of the box and keep driving better. Well, nearly exactly. I wouldn't go with the 17s. Can't stand oversized wheels on old cars.

[Jon_S_Rally]

esixtythree said:

No, but that's the obvious go-to, isn't it, when your position is weak, to cast aspersions like that? I'm entirely comfortable with my financial position and wouldn't be terribly interested in a GTO at a price I can afford.

Prefer my sports cars a bit more sophisticated and usable. Most driving enthusiasts have preferences re driving dynamics. A 60s shed with a live axle and carbs that fall out of tune all the time isn't really my thing. My favourites are from a more modern era with electronic ignition, independent suspension and sophisticated chassis engineering but before the driver aids became overwhelming. That's just a preference, but it's based on driving not values and status, which are irrelevant to driving.

But of course, it's laughable to talk about such issues on the context of a GTO. Because the thing has long since stopped being a car or defined by its driving characteristics. It's an instrument of wealth, and offers outstanding performance for that remit, no question.

It's the obvious go-to if you've got a problem with other people's wealth. Judging by the way you keep coming back to the topic; making negative assumptions about the owners of such cars and their reasons for buying them, I'd suggest that you're not actually very comfortable with it at all. If you were, why would it bother you that other people can afford to spend 50m on a car, or what they choose to do with it?

I note you have also switched from suggesting that they're not "car enthusiasts" to saying they're not "driving enthusiasts", because driving is clearly not a prerequisite of being a car enthusiast. That in itself is slightly ridiculous of course as, unless you know the individual owners personally, you have no idea what they are. The person that bought this car might be out racing every weekend for all you know but, just because they might not drive their 250, you've assumed that they're only buying such cars to project wealth, or because of their ego. Again, it all smacks of you having a problem with the fact that they are in the position that they are.

Ultimately, the 250 GTO is a car. It's got four wheels, an engine, it's the right size, it's got the right number of seats. It doesn't matter if it's driven or not, or how you personally define a car or driving enthusiast, it is a car in every crucial definition of the term, and it will continue to be so until it is crashed, crushed or the world ends. The owners might not use it as you think it should be used, but that's just your narrow definition based on your personal preferences. They have their own definition based on their own preferences. You might think that's "silly", but that doesn't make you right any more than it makes them right. People are just different.

What's sad is that, thanks to everyone now having a voice through the internet, we spend far too much of our time judging how others live their lives, and making weird assumptions based on snapshots of information presented to us through social media (which, ironically, this very response could be accused of in itself). Ultimately, if someone can afford to spend 50m on an old Ferrari, good luck to them. If they want to drive it, put it on a plinth, or stick their cock up the tailpipes, good for them.

NGK210 said:

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

Have you met the owner, or are you just assuming he's smarmy and pretentious?

[another 3 points]

Very expensive track car

[jason61c]

Muzzer79 said:

jason61c said:

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

Because a GTO wasn’t there?

Its goodwood, there were 2 GTO's.

[ettore]

esixtythree said:

ettore said:

You're making assumptions about all those who own GTO's unless you know them all?

The only thing one can say that they have in common is wealth - is that your issue?

If you don't agree with what I'm saying, you must be making assumptions, too, must be taking a view, too.

And it's obviously expedient for you to imply aspersions of jealousy or whatever to deflect rather than actually confront what motivates someone to pay $50 for a car that's barely if ever going to be driven.

Your first point is illogical. I was asking a question, not taking a view. Your second point is somewhat tortuous but you're doubling down on your rather basic and pejorative position.

The fact is that you can have no idea because there are 35 owners of the 36 original cars and they will all have different reasons and motivations for their ownership. I have no idea what they all are but I have had dealings with a few of them. Of those, beyond the fact that they could afford one, the most obvious common thread was that they were all real and genuine enthusiasts with a passion for the history, the romance and the mechanical deliciousness of their cars. One person has two and you'd find it difficult to find a more genuine enthusiast.

Sorry if this doesn't fit your prejudice, but there you go! (that's me taking a view).

[Muzzer79]

jason61c said:

Muzzer79 said:

jason61c said:

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

Because a GTO wasn’t there?

Its goodwood, there were 2 GTO's.

Not to labour this, but you're suggesting that at Goodwood there were people tripping up to look at a Toyota whilst two Ferrari 250 GTOs were sat there being ignored by everyone like they were Ford Mondeos?

Please......

[Julian Scott]

jason61c said:

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

Parked near a 250GTO?


I've been to car parks where a large bunch of lads were creaming themselves over a chav'd up Clio with neon lights underneath, doesn't make it more popular than a £55m Ferrari

[Julian Scott]

Jon_S_Rally said:

NGK210 said:

^This. Ghastly, smarmy and pretentious bunch. Ironically, it perfectly illustrates why Enzo vetted owners.

Provenance be damned: I'd commission GTO Engineering to make a replica, but with a 4.4-litre Colombo converted to run on a Motec ECU with fuel-injection and ITBs; fabricate double-wishbone IRS; ditto 17in Borranis (to allow a brake upgrade and modern 65-profile tyres). And the bloody tail pipes will have an upsweep and a couple of brackets.

Cost? I reckon c. £2 million will suffice. Bargain.

Have you met the owner, or are you just assuming he's smarmy and pretentious?

PH, where green-eyed stereotypes are king.

[Julian Scott]

Muzzer79 said:

jason61c said:

Muzzer79 said:

jason61c said:

Julian Scott said:

Not as interesting as a Toyota 2000GT? You think?

Both parked outside an F1 paddock. You think the Toyota would gain greater interest?

I don't care what people at an f1 paddock thinks.

I've been at good wood meets where people were tripping up to look at the 2000GT.

Because a GTO wasn’t there?

Its goodwood, there were 2 GTO's.

Not to labour this, but you're suggesting that at Goodwood there were people tripping up to look at a Toyota whilst two Ferrari 250 GTOs were sat there being ignored by everyone like they were Ford Mondeos?

Please......

Shhhh.. Jason's having a nice dream, don't wake him up.

[cidered77]

Is it going to annoy everyone if I say I would also go straight to the 2000 GT if it was parked alongside a 250 GTO ?

In my case - never seen one for real in my life, gets much less media coverage so don't see them so often in print or electronic form - and, it's just cool, isn't it? And I've seen several of the 36 GTOs several times - some of them maybe tool room copies, but not all.

But - that doesn't make a 250 GTO "not worth" $50m; by definition it is. Does make 2000 GT owners cool as **** in my eyes, but - but just one nerd's subjective opinion.

[garypotter]

Great looking car, one of the best from that era, well done to the new owner i hope they get to enjoy it.