Porsche 10% Brexit surcharge
Discussion
berlintaxi said:
Raygun said:
If things weren't bad enough have you seen all the job agencies spring up in the last 15 years who take their cut out of piss poor wages by taking advantage of some EU directive that means all temp workers have to go through these sharks.
Which EU directive would that be?Brooking10 said:
There is a well known EU temp workers directive which was put in place to ensure temp workers receive equal treatment to company employers in similar roles.
Which Trev resulted in all temp workers going through job agencies as it created to much red tape for employers so they farmed it out to job agencies.I should think most people who do temp work would rather have the rate the employer is paying rather than go through a job agency and be £3 an hour lighter and find out you've accumalated half a days holiday pay after 3 weeks.
Anyway we can go on and on about it, we're leaving the eu in 3 weeks and hopefully after that these dabates will decline and we can all move on and look forward to good weather and taking our nice sports cars out.
Raygun said:
Brooking10 said:
There is a well known EU temp workers directive which was put in place to ensure temp workers receive equal treatment to company employers in similar roles.
Which Trev resulted in all temp workers going through job agencies as it created to much red tape for employers so they farmed it out to job agencies.I should think most people who do temp work would rather have the rate the employer is paying rather than go through a job agency and be £3 an hour lighter and find out you've accumalated half a days holiday pay after 3 weeks.
Anyway we can go on and on about it, we're leaving the eu in 3 weeks and hopefully after that these dabates will decline and we can all move on and look forward to good weather and taking our nice sports cars out.
also your point on holiday pay is just plain wrong.
Raygun said:
Brooking10 said:
There is a well known EU temp workers directive which was put in place to ensure temp workers receive equal treatment to company employers in similar roles.
Which Trev resulted in all temp workers going through job agencies as it created to much red tape for employers so they farmed it out to job agencies.I should think most people who do temp work would rather have the rate the employer is paying rather than go through a job agency and be £3 an hour lighter and find out you've accumalated half a days holiday pay after 3 weeks.
Anyway we can go on and on about it, we're leaving the eu in 3 weeks and hopefully after that these dabates will decline and we can all move on and look forward to good weather and taking our nice sports cars out.
The ones made in Europe ?
Mine is British Ron - you traitor !
Raygun said:
If things weren't bad enough have you seen all the job agencies spring up in the last 15 years who take their cut out of piss poor wages by taking advantage of some EU directive that means all temp workers have to go through these sharks.
I’m very much a confirmed ‘outie’ and in favour of a clean Brexit. Having said that you’re comments above are just wrong.Edited by bad company on Friday 8th March 20:28
HM-2 said:
TobyTR said:
So to confirm, you disagree that uncontrolled immigration has had a negative effect on those areas?
I think my statement was pretty unequivocal.A44RON said:
This is a fine example of cognitive dissonance - believing in your opinion so firmly, that it can't be changed by facts.
It's funny you mention "no-go areas" and "facts" in the same sentence given that the only assertions posters have made so far about their presence are completely anecdotal, and no academic consensus exists on them in the context being discussed here (IE extremely deprived parts of major European cities that are effectively free from the influence of the state security apparatus).As I said before, ill-defined, subjective and largely personal, with little consensus amongst people on which zones are indeed "no-go", and therefore I would argue a loaded term often used as a dog-whistle rather than for any reasonable analysis.
Edited by HM-2 on Friday 8th March 08:52
I posted some facts for you on pg.48 of this thread, to re-iterate: German crime statistics for crime suspects have found that immigrants there (overall 12.8% of the population), make up a disproportionate share of crime suspects (34.7%); 74% of total pick-pocketing, 55% of total forgery, 41% of total burglaries, 37% of total rapes, 29.7% of total murder/manslaughter
The number of assault gang-rapes in 2016 increased where the infamous New Year's Eve assaults in Germany nearly doubled the number of cases; the assaults in Cologne on New Year's Eve 2016 nevertheless ended the atmosphere of euphoria earlier in the year when hundreds of thousands of migrants had arrived in Germany. 2010 cases - 224 - share of foreign suspects 31.6% / 2015 cases - 146 - share of foreign suspects 41.3% / 2016 cases cases - 225 - share of foreign suspects 67.8% / 2017 cases - 122 - share of foreign suspects 67.1%.
Alas, uncontrolled immigration is wonderful
A44RON said:
HM-2 said:
TobyTR said:
The term 'no-go' zone is more open, it has no strict guidelines. And it's not only used to describe areas with ethnic minorities, that couldn't be more incorrect - the most popular use is in Brazil with their favelas.
Collins dictionary definition: "areas that have a reputation for violence and crime which makes people frightened to go there."
Which makes it individual, subjective, and frankly pretty hopeless as a descriptor.Collins dictionary definition: "areas that have a reputation for violence and crime which makes people frightened to go there."
TobyTR said:
So just to clarify, do you agree or disagree that uncontrolled immigration has had a negative effect on the aforementioned areas?
I would argue the negative effects are more often than not artefacts of social, political or economic factors than they are a product of uncontrolled immigration in and of itself. That dictionary definition nails it on the head to be fair.Blimey HM-2, you could give Diane Abbott a run for her money
textbook swerving.This is a fine example of cognitive dissonance - believing in your opinion so firmly, that it can't be changed by facts.
The mind doesn’t follow the facts. Facts, as John Adams put it "are stubborn things, but our minds are even more stubborn".
As a result of the well-documented confirmation bias, we tend to undervalue evidence that contradicts our beliefs and overvalue evidence that confirms them. We filter out inconvenient truths and arguments on the opposing side. As a result, our opinions solidify, and it becomes increasingly harder to disrupt established patterns of thinking. Believing in alternative facts only if they support your pre-existing beliefs.
This is the problem with debates like this - those so stubborn in their views and opinions can't (or refuse) to see the wood for the trees.
TobyTR said:
I posted some facts for you on pg.48 of this thread, to re-iterate:
Unlike you, I don't habitually assume causation from correlation. The figures you've cited don't preclude the primary driving factors behind criminality being social and economic, nor do they actually support your assertion that the causal factors is that of migration. After all, ethnic minorities are significantly more likely to be socioeconomically deprived.HM-2 said:
Unlike you, I don't habitually assume causation from correlation. The figures you've cited don't preclude the primary driving factors behind criminality being social and economic, nor do they actually support your assertion that the causal factors is that of migration. After all, ethnic minorities are significantly more likely to be socioeconomically deprived.
Socioeconomically deprived or not, the numbers speak for themselves.I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid those stats are self-explanatory
If you can't (refuse) to see the correlation then you're unable to be helped.
TobyTR said:
HM-2 said:
Unlike you, I don't habitually assume causation from correlation. The figures you've cited don't preclude the primary driving factors behind criminality being social and economic, nor do they actually support your assertion that the causal factors is that of migration. After all, ethnic minorities are significantly more likely to be socioeconomically deprived.
Socioeconomically deprived or not, the numbers speak for themselves.I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid those stats are self-explanatory
If you can't (refuse) to see the correlation then you're unable to be helped.
powerstroke said:
Oilchange said:
There are lies, damn lies and statistics.
How you take them depends on whether or not you understand the fable of the emperors new clothes ...TR has spent an awful lot of time and energy wittering on about an immigration issue he has witnessed in Europe which has no link to our own national stance on the matter and cannot happen here.
Because of his innate concerns on the matter he seems to be citing this as a reason as to why the EU is bad for the U.K.
It seems a classic case of a personal prejudice overriding facts.
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