Porsche 10% Brexit surcharge

[HM-2]

TobyTR said:

Socioeconomically deprived or not, the numbers speak for themselves.

And, as the poster above me quite astutely pointed out, the decline of swashbuckling piracy caused global warming.

TobyTR said:

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid those stats are self-explanatory

You can assert this until you're blue in the face; it doesn't make it true. Until such a time as you can demonstrate a direct causal relationship, that is. If it's as clearly evident as you claim it shouldn't be hard to do.

A44RON said:

You're wasting your time trying to explain those stats

Instead of circle-jerking with Toby and throwing around ad hominems, why don't you cite some evidence of the actual causal relationship he's been so unwilling to?

Edited by HM-2 on Monday 11th March 07:54

[TobyTR]

HM-2 said:

TobyTR said:

Socioeconomically deprived or not, the numbers speak for themselves.

And, as the poster above me quite astutely pointed out, the decline of swashbuckling piracy caused global warming.

TobyTR said:

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid those stats are self-explanatory

You can assert this until you're blue in the face; it doesn't make it true. Until such a time as you can demonstrate a direct causal relationship, that is. If it's as clearly evident as you claim it shouldn't be hard to do.

So in your view Germany's own government stats are not true and you've compared them to a tongue-in-cheek graph... You're making yourself look rather silly now.

Your self-denial is actually quite alarming. As another poster quite astutely pointed out above, you suffer from horrific cognitive dissonance.

[TobyTR]

Brooking10 said:

Or indeed how you feel about the subject being analysed.

TR has spent an awful lot of time and energy wittering on about an immigration issue he has witnessed in Europe which has no link to our own national stance on the matter and cannot happen here.

Because of his innate concerns on the matter he seems to be citing this as a reason as to why the EU is bad for the U.K.

It seems a classic case of a personal prejudice overriding facts.

You haven't read my posts then, because nowhere have i directly linked uncontrolled immigration to the UK and EU. Merely the impact it's had on Germany and Sweden, due to a couple of posters arguing there's nothing much wrong with it. As you were.

[anonymous-user]

TobyTR said:

Brooking10 said:

Or indeed how you feel about the subject being analysed.

TR has spent an awful lot of time and energy wittering on about an immigration issue he has witnessed in Europe which has no link to our own national stance on the matter and cannot happen here.

Because of his innate concerns on the matter he seems to be citing this as a reason as to why the EU is bad for the U.K.

It seems a classic case of a personal prejudice overriding facts.

You haven't read my posts then, because nowhere have i directly linked uncontrolled immigration to the UK and EU. Merely the impact it's had on Germany and Sweden, due to a couple of posters arguing there's nothing much wrong with it. As you were.

And yet it’s pretty much all you have talked about in a thread that is clearly about Brexit ?

Move on.

[TobyTR]

If you want to debate on a topic, then do it fairly. Don't go falsely mis-quoting posters on a forum to make yourself feel better.

[anonymous-user]

TobyTR said:

If you want to debate on a topic, then do it fairly. Don't go falsely mis-quoting posters on a forum to make yourself feel better.

Eh ?

[HM-2]

TobyTR said:

So in your view Germany's own government stats are not true

Point to where I said anything remotely resembling this.

If you're going to respond, at least do me the courtesy of not completely misrepresenting what I've said. Straw men like these are simply pathetic.

TobyTR said:

If you want to debate on a topic, then do it fairly.

Physician, heal thyself.

Edited by HM-2 on Monday 11th March 11:42

[TobyTR]

HM-2 said:

TobyTR said:

Socioeconomically deprived or not, the numbers speak for themselves.

And, as the poster above me quite astutely pointed out, the decline of swashbuckling piracy caused global warming.

TobyTR said:

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I'm afraid those stats are self-explanatory

You can assert this until you're blue in the face; it doesn't make it true. Until such a time as you can demonstrate a direct causal relationship, that is. If it's as clearly evident as you claim it shouldn't be hard to do.

A44RON said:

You're wasting your time trying to explain those stats

Edited by HM-2 on Monday 11th March 07:54

highlighted above for you.

[ashleyman]

I've recently purchased a vehicle and most manufacturers were asking me to sign a waiver.

It said that the manufacturer could not guarantee the final price and if the price was to end up being greater than the agreed purchase price you could walk away without penalty and receive your deposit back. This only applied to vehicles landing in the UK after April 1st.

Because of that, we chose to avoid a factory order and purchased an in stock car.

[HM-2]

TobyTR said:

highlighted above for you.

Stating that the apparently "self-explanatory" assumption you've made from a set of statistics is not supported by those statistics is not the same thing as stating the statistics are wrong.

The mind boggles.

Edited by HM-2 on Monday 11th March 23:11

[A44RON]

HM-2 said:

Stating that the apparently "self-explanatory" assumption you've made from a set of statistics is not supported by those statistics is not the same thing as stating the statistics are wrong.

The mind boggles.

Edited by HM-2 on Monday 11th March 23:11

Germany opens the gates to uncontrolled immigration > crime rates go up > immigrants there making up disproportionate share of crime suspects > number assault gang rapes go up & share of immigrant suspects increases... it's all there in those stats. Get it?

But "it's not supported" haha. Well, it is.

Are you Diane Abbott?

Instead of using buzzwords and meaningless dross, why don't you post some stats to counteract TR's? You thought no-go zones was strictly only used for immigrants

Edited by A44RON on Tuesday 12th March 04:08

[HM-2]

A44RON said:

Germany opens the gates to uncontrolled immigration

Which it didn't, unless you're extrapolating a specific policy addressing refugees from warzones as "uncontrolled immigration". Which would be frankly idiotic as it's not.

A44RON said:

crime rates go up

Except as of 2017 total reported crimes are at the lowest level since at least 2008, despite both a growing population and a growing immigrant population:

A44RON said:

immigrants there making up disproportionate share of crime suspects

Which I don't recall disputing, despite both your and Toby's insistence that I did. My contention has always been that the assertion that the mere fact they're immigrants is a direct causal factors in criminality is not supported by the evidence, and that other factors such as socioeconomic deprivation (which happen to disproportionately affected immigrants) are more likely to drive offending.

A44RON said:

Get it?

I "get" that your argument is so weak and incoherent you've got to use two outright lies, one irrelevance and an appeal to emotion to try and make it work.

And you've got the audacity to accuse me of factual inaccuracy when you post drivel like that.

A44RON said:

Are you Diane Abbott?

You've used that one already. If you're going to try insults, at least make them imaginative.

[RobM77]

ashleyman said:

I've recently purchased a vehicle and most manufacturers were asking me to sign a waiver.

It said that the manufacturer could not guarantee the final price and if the price was to end up being greater than the agreed purchase price you could walk away without penalty and receive your deposit back. This only applied to vehicles landing in the UK after April 1st.

Because of that, we chose to avoid a factory order and purchased an in stock car.

That's interesting, thanks I was in a BMW dealer this morning and wondering why it was just Porsche.

[bungle]

ashleyman said:

I've recently purchased a vehicle and most manufacturers were asking me to sign a waiver.

It said that the manufacturer could not guarantee the final price and if the price was to end up being greater than the agreed purchase price you could walk away without penalty and receive your deposit back. This only applied to vehicles landing in the UK after April 1st.

Yep, that's what Skoda (and therefore I assume all VAG) are doing.

[ashleyman]

bungle said:

ashleyman said:

I've recently purchased a vehicle and most manufacturers were asking me to sign a waiver.

It said that the manufacturer could not guarantee the final price and if the price was to end up being greater than the agreed purchase price you could walk away without penalty and receive your deposit back. This only applied to vehicles landing in the UK after April 1st.

Yep, that's what Skoda (and therefore I assume all VAG) are doing.

Yep! We were looking at VW Polos and Audi A1s. In the end we bought a stock car to avoid any potential complications.

[TobyTR]

HM-2 said:

A44RON said:

Germany opens the gates to uncontrolled immigration

A44RON said:

crime rates go up

Except as of 2017 total reported crimes are at the lowest level since at least 2008, despite both a growing population and a growing immigrant population:

A44RON said:

immigrants there making up disproportionate share of crime suspects

Which I don't recall disputing, despite both your and Toby's insistence that I did. My contention has always been that the assertion that the mere fact they're immigrants is a direct causal factors in criminality is not supported by the evidence, and that other factors such as socioeconomic deprivation (which happen to disproportionately affected immigrants) are more likely to drive offending.

That graph shows overall crime has decreased in 2017 from record highs in 2015 and 2016 - funnily enough about the same time hundreds of thousands of refugees began entering Germany...

So overall crime has decreased in 2017, migrant crime still trends disproportionately high, therefore German nationals are committing less crime, hence the overall reduction.




Unfortunately, socioeconomic deprivation is a by-product of refugees/asylum seekers etc; they are linked.

My point that uncontrolled immigration isn't positive still stands - something I was originally shot down for.

Edited by TobyTR on Tuesday 12th March 22:15

[silentbrown]

Anyhoo, back to the actual topic, May's "plan" is that if we leave with no deal, WTO tariffs on imported cars will apply. But not on components.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47551266

[sorrel]

Anyone taking bets on Brexit not actually happening after all?.....

What a chaotic mess!

[Rawwr]

sorrel said:

Anyone taking bets on Brexit not actually happening after all?.....

It'll certainly be interesting to see what happens from this point.

[Rick1.8t]

I believe I just heard confirmed that in a no-deal situation cars imported from the EU will see just over 10% import duty. I wonder how much this would dent Audi / Mercedes / BMW's market in the UK - Will people care / notice their PCP deal going from £400 to £440 per month?}

Interestingly, not sure if this has been previously discussed they would scrap import duty on most other products from outside of the EU, does anybody know the current import duty the EU charge on import of cars? - I think its the same at around 10% though I cant see us getting our imported Fords or Nissans at a 10% reduced rate in this situation.

Edited by Rick1.8t on Wednesday 13th March 09:41