E5 99RON petrol prices
Discussion
ATM said:
So with the home brew extra ethanol mix do they need to pump and inject more volume of fuel to make it work?
That is normal practice, yes. Which you can do to some extent via the map, but only up to the point where you start maxing out any or all of: the injectors, fuel pressure regulation, the fuel pump itself. You always want some headroom in all three of those for a happy life. How much headroom you have with any given car is of course a lot to do with how it was specified in the first place, and also component deterioration over time.TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
I agree. If anyone could give a synopsis it'd be much appreciated 
I found a table of the bhp results in the video here https://youtu.be/x0fTGaMkMPU?t=610I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
Glyn84 said:
I found a table of the bhp results in the video here https://youtu.be/x0fTGaMkMPU?t=610
I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
I'm not sure. If they don't waffle about the details then lots of detail oriented people will rip it to pieces saying the results are meaningless if tests are not done properly. So these trolls mean we all get bombarded with unnecessary detail.I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
I agree. If anyone could give a synopsis it'd be much appreciated
I sat through the results bit. The best fuel for power and ignition advance curve was the Tesco 99 RON. Peak was barely any better but the ECU could advance timing noticeably more when it was coming on boost, right at the bit where things go bang if you get it wrong.
Second best was shell 99 ron which made 1bhp less and had a slightly more restricted ignition advance, so basically same peak but a touch less power in the mid range
Esso 99 third, less advance again than the 1st two and it lost 5bhp peak. He wasn't very nice about it.
BP Ultimate 4th and was well off Tesco for ignition, ~15bhp down in the mid range when it came on boost, but had the same peak power as Esso.
The 95 RON was s
te.How relevant this is to a non tuned car is debatable, but the fact that the Tesco fuel performed best and is the cheapest makes it an obvious choice.
It'd be interesting to see an economy test, especially given the zero ethanol content of the Esso, but that's a much much harder and more time consuming test to carry out repeatably and meaningfully.
ATM said:
I'm not sure. If they don't waffle about the details then lots of detail oriented people will rip it to pieces saying the results are meaningless if tests are not done properly. So these trolls mean we all get bombarded with unnecessary detail.
I could, have should have written that a bit better. I love a bit of detail. What I really meant was those videos that are a simple how to on something, but last 20 mins and spend the first 10 mins going over all the tools they are using in excruciating detail.Glyn84 said:
ATM said:
I'm not sure. If they don't waffle about the details then lots of detail oriented people will rip it to pieces saying the results are meaningless if tests are not done properly. So these trolls mean we all get bombarded with unnecessary detail.
I could, have should have written that a bit better. I love a bit of detail. What I really meant was those videos that are a simple how to on something, but last 20 mins and spend the first 10 mins going over all the tools they are using in excruciating detail.They can add chapters to the details
So you just choose the chapter to watch
A chapter called results could have been maybe 2 mins long
I think they get paid based on time watching so if their motive is profit the more the better for them
Uncle Meat said:
Just had this email from Shell. Anyone know what changes they are making?
I was going to ask this, just seen the email. All I could find is they've added "Dynaflex" (whatever that is), and that it now helps to clean the engine even more? - New and Improved Shell V-Power: Compared to previous generation Shell V-Power.
ATM said:
Glyn84 said:
I found a table of the bhp results in the video here https://youtu.be/x0fTGaMkMPU?t=610
I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
I'm not sure. If they don't waffle about the details then lots of detail oriented people will rip it to pieces saying the results are meaningless if tests are not done properly. So these trolls mean we all get bombarded with unnecessary detail.I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
However written material is harder to monetize.
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 16th February 15:12
stickleback123 said:
ATM said:
Glyn84 said:
I found a table of the bhp results in the video here https://youtu.be/x0fTGaMkMPU?t=610
I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
I'm not sure. If they don't waffle about the details then lots of detail oriented people will rip it to pieces saying the results are meaningless if tests are not done properly. So these trolls mean we all get bombarded with unnecessary detail.I do agree though - too many waffling videos these days to explain something simple!
However written material is harder to monetize.
Edited by stickleback123 on Thursday 16th February 15:12
I enjoyed the whole video content - I guess you have to be in the mood.
As I watched the start I was wondering how they would deal with the ECU memory and ensuring a controlled experiment with the fuels. It didn't go into that detail, perhaps the reset the tuning each time. Otherwise, should they be running 95RON between each runs.
I didn't appreciate the advance ignition would be that different across the rev range for the different fuels.
anarki said:
I have absolutely no affiliation to the content creator - but I respect the effort put into this clip;
Personally I've always favoured Tesco Momentum 99 years ago when running my petrol cars, and will continue to use it in my current SLK55 AMG, the video above indicates why.
If that's an R172 then you are talking about 414bhp so not too far of the range from this power test. It would be interesting to see those advanced ignition curves for a large natural aspirated engine.Personally I've always favoured Tesco Momentum 99 years ago when running my petrol cars, and will continue to use it in my current SLK55 AMG, the video above indicates why.
Would the difference be less than that in the test i.e. smaller highly tuned boosty engine emphasises the differences?
I just searched new Shell V-Power 2023, and it's already launched in Asia. Basically a new additive pack, which can restore engines to 'as new' for the first time, removing 100% of deposits. It didn't say which ones, mind...
https://www.zigwheels.ph/car-news/shell-launches-b...
https://www.zigwheels.ph/car-news/shell-launches-b...
Yex GTR said:
I appear to be very lucky where I am (North Essex just outside Colchester) as all stations have E5 and I can choose between Esso, Shell, BP and Tesco very easily. I also discovered the village petrol station has a dedicated E5 Esso pump in it which is always kept topped up according to the guy behind the till as it gets hit by bunches of bikers and drivers nearly every Sunday in Spring and Summer heading out to the coast on some of the rather agreeable roads we have around here.
Are you guys struggling to get E5 all in the same part of the country and victims of a local refinery issue ?
which one is this and do you mean topped up with synergy supreme?Are you guys struggling to get E5 all in the same part of the country and victims of a local refinery issue ?
Agreeable driving roads on the coast around colchester?? do tell. all the roads to clacton, frinton, walton and mersea are terrible driving roads for cars at least!
stickleback123 said:
I sat through the results bit.
The best fuel for power and ignition advance curve was the Tesco 99 RON. Peak was barely any better but the ECU could advance timing noticeably more when it was coming on boost, right at the bit where things go bang if you get it wrong.
Second best was shell 99 ron which made 1bhp less and had a slightly more restricted ignition advance, so basically same peak but a touch less power in the mid range
Esso 99 third, less advance again than the 1st two and it lost 5bhp peak. He wasn't very nice about it.
BP Ultimate 4th and was well off Tesco for ignition, ~15bhp down in the mid range when it came on boost, but had the same peak power as Esso.
The 95 RON was ste.
How relevant this is to a non tuned car is debatable, but the fact that the Tesco fuel performed best and is the cheapest makes it an obvious choice.
It'd be interesting to see an economy test, especially given the zero ethanol content of the Esso, but that's a much much harder and more time consuming test to carry out repeatably and meaningfully.
youtube is blocked where i am currently so cannot view but bp is 97 ron is it not, they dont do a 99.The best fuel for power and ignition advance curve was the Tesco 99 RON. Peak was barely any better but the ECU could advance timing noticeably more when it was coming on boost, right at the bit where things go bang if you get it wrong.
Second best was shell 99 ron which made 1bhp less and had a slightly more restricted ignition advance, so basically same peak but a touch less power in the mid range
Esso 99 third, less advance again than the 1st two and it lost 5bhp peak. He wasn't very nice about it.
BP Ultimate 4th and was well off Tesco for ignition, ~15bhp down in the mid range when it came on boost, but had the same peak power as Esso.
The 95 RON was s
te.How relevant this is to a non tuned car is debatable, but the fact that the Tesco fuel performed best and is the cheapest makes it an obvious choice.
It'd be interesting to see an economy test, especially given the zero ethanol content of the Esso, but that's a much much harder and more time consuming test to carry out repeatably and meaningfully.
theplayingmantis said:
slightly OT, but anyone have a clue why Jet (phillips 66 owned) is, at least in east anglia/essex, is so very cheap, on par if not cheaper than tesco?
I've no idea, but Jet have always been one of the cheapest for Regular petrol since the 70s - there just aren't too many of them about now. Although their E5 is only 97 RON like BP, etc.
I certainly didn't want to spark (pardon the pun) up a debate on the virtues of videography with my post, I'm personally after thoroughness when it comes to testing.
Agreed it was a 20 minute video, and while some of it was "fluff" to a degree, I thought it was a decent analysis into fuels. At least with that video you can actually see their methodology - draining the tank and fuel pump before dyno runs. The analysis into what the car is telling you via its ECU, etc, its all helpful in my opinion. I personally appreciated that.
As some have said, yes a quick <2 minute synopsis would have got to the point, but at least by seeing the context of their testing throughout, the video has some merit.
You can't win them all as they say, if the video was just 2 minutes long, you'd have people questioning the validity of said video, make it more than 2 minutes long its boring...
Agreed it was a 20 minute video, and while some of it was "fluff" to a degree, I thought it was a decent analysis into fuels. At least with that video you can actually see their methodology - draining the tank and fuel pump before dyno runs. The analysis into what the car is telling you via its ECU, etc, its all helpful in my opinion. I personally appreciated that.
As some have said, yes a quick <2 minute synopsis would have got to the point, but at least by seeing the context of their testing throughout, the video has some merit.
You can't win them all as they say, if the video was just 2 minutes long, you'd have people questioning the validity of said video, make it more than 2 minutes long its boring...
I don't want a 2 minute video, I want an article I can read at my own pace containing all the same data in the far more useful table and chart format than some bloke talking.
I think it's fair to say that 20 minutes of wiffling video could easily be turned into something that can be read in a couple of minutes, back in the day Doug Demuro's squealing hysterical videos were available in written form on some US website and were far more interesting in that format.
I feel the same way about lectures and seminars, I personally get zero value over and above reading a book. I also appreciate that different people digest information in different ways.
As you say it looked like a decent and well performed analysis, I'm just whinging about the format of the delivery.
I think it's fair to say that 20 minutes of wiffling video could easily be turned into something that can be read in a couple of minutes, back in the day Doug Demuro's squealing hysterical videos were available in written form on some US website and were far more interesting in that format.
I feel the same way about lectures and seminars, I personally get zero value over and above reading a book. I also appreciate that different people digest information in different ways.
As you say it looked like a decent and well performed analysis, I'm just whinging about the format of the delivery.
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