RE: Goodbye STI - Subaru calls time on the WRX

[MuscleSaloon]

WCZ said:

Bright Halo said:

Had to happen I suppose.
I wonder if this announcement will bolster STI values?

erm

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...

wtf!

Strong money maybe .. but if my numbers came up its on the list.

Only £11k more than the final edition UK car .. epic spec .. plus an engine that's not made of chocolate is always advantageous.

[Iceicebaby1980]

New subarus have had there day. There's used to be nothing that could touch them for the money (evo not included) Not talking on a motorway. But now every hot hatch offers comparable performance and handling. Better build quality more prestigious badge etc. Didn't stop me selling my e90 m3 and buying a Hawkeye thought I'd see what the fuss is about

[daemon]

paranoid airbag said:

daemon said:

Thats exactly it. They'd rather sell humdrum standard models than be bothered using up their import quota on STis.

How do they plan on doing that?

Punters for cooking models still want refinement, brand image etc - the things subaru can't give them. If they could, they could do so for the WRX.

They could give them away with cereal boxes I suppose, but long term - unless they acquire a party trick (only electric car with >500 mile range?) or become very good all-rounders, it's not just the WRX that's on borrowed time.

I think their import quota is small and they pretty much sell it anyway with no hassle so why give themselves the hassle of trying to flog STis to motoring enthusiasts?

I remember speaking to our local Subaru main dealer some years ago when we had our WRX-S and he said that total UK sales for an entire year for Subaru was something like 1/2 days production of one factory so its not like we're on their radar as a major player.

[mrnoisy78]

paranoid airbag said:

How do they plan on doing that?

Punters for cooking models still want refinement, brand image etc - the things subaru can't give them. If they could, they could do so for the WRX.

They could give them away with cereal boxes I suppose, but long term - unless they acquire a party trick (only electric car with >500 mile range?) or become very good all-rounders, it's not just the WRX that's on borrowed time.

Disagree.
When I had an Impreza I didn’t yearn for it to be dull, unexciting and very middle of the road like a Golf R. It was exciting to drive, something that so many “hot” hatches lack in spades today.
The real issue in my eyes is that subaru haven’t updated their powerplant - it’s had the same 2.5 engine for the last 12 years and it’s tired - they needed a twin scroll modernised unit, and they haven’t delivered on that, instead the car has gotten heavier and they’ve tried to make it more refined without addressing the terrible mpg and emissions which is the more likely candidate putting people off!

The Impreza has “proper” AWD, not part time mostly FWD etc. It sounded better than any Focus RS or Golf.
The new Honda Type R was the only thing I found truly exciting to drive in the *affordable* new hot Hatch sector but it looked like a dogs dinner - the FK2 was better looking but rode too hard.
The manufacturers need to stop dumbing down and adding weight - I prefer the back to basics myself!

[Zed Ed]

So this is International Motors no longer importing; i’m sure we have had this before.

That said, Subaru has failed to move this car forward, even for the Japan domestic market.

Focus, Golf, Audi 3 etc they’ve all managed to move with the times for their performance offerings.

Such a shame, as my 99 Impreza Turbo PPP which I bought new is still the best car i’ve owned, and sad to see such a great UK performance franchise pissed away.

[amgmcqueen]

No idea why they still continue to use the terrible 2.5 engine? Also 305hp does not cut it in 2017 amongst the uber hatches.

[Yipper]

As others have said, the competition, like Golf R or Audi S3, has caught up and gone past Subaru. Few decent lease deals. And the badge snobbery means most people with 30k to spend want German.

Shame, really. Saw a black one over the Summer and it defo stood out in the sea of bland euroboxes.

[Valgar]

Always loved the Impreza, I've owned 3 and would do again, sadly like most of the Subaru range, it's too damn expensive for what it is.

I agree with many here, it's the engine that's let it down, back when the STi was new in 1994 (23 bloody years ago!) it came with 275PS in Type-R guise and soon after standard STi's, and largely that figure has not changed in all that time, there were a few special edition models that went beyond 300 but not much more apart from the Cosworth and many rivals from that time period have almost doubled power output for their top of the line models where as the Impreza barely went up 10%. Add in the 90s fuel economy and it was always going to be a hard sell

Back in the mid 90's the Impreza basically gave contemporary supercar performance that was affordable, practical and controllable which is why it appealed, they basically out gunned the competition by quite some margin and it became the yardstick to beat. The fact the interior was a bit basic was totally forgivable because it offered great value.

But they never really developed their advantage, they're still getting away with using an engine whose original specification stretches back to 1989 which is both shocking and worthy of merit considering it's stayed legal this long. While they were engineering the old EJ to stay legal, everyone else developed superior engines and by the mid 2000s the advantage they had was gone.

The value the Impreza or WRX simply isn't there anymore, if they stuck 450hp on it as standard and the same price tomorrow it'd be brilliant again but as it is, it looks crude compared to the rivals and to the vast majority of buyers, looks are everything.

[DanielSan]

The annoying thing is they have access to the direct injection system from Toyota, it’s fitted to the 86/BRZ boxer lump. So surely going back down to the 2 litre engine and having the direct injection would improve economy and it could still produce 300-350bhp.

[BlackPrince]

PK0001 said:

Having bought a new 2017 STi in May I am slightly annoyed as Subaru told me that this facelift car would never be coming to the UK.

I knew the end was coming but as many posters have already said, there is nothing like this car in the market anymore and never will be again.

This will be my last petrol car before I go electric next time. That's inevitable.

But for now I am enjoying a car that goes, grips, stops, handles like no other car I have driven before. I have yet to find its limit and I don't think I will on the public roads.

It's marvellous. I was so fed up with sanitised electric steering, detached handling and clinical personalities from previous cars such as Golf R, GTi's, 5 series etc.

RFL is only £140 as well and yesterday I did a 400 mile round trip at 37 mpg, so running costs are perfectly acceptable.

Residuals have always been strong, now they will be even better.

Why would you go electric? Don't get me wrong, the only electric car I've driven - Tesla Model S P85 was as quick as a superbike, and super techy inside, but a bit anodyne at the end of the day.

Anyway, to counter some PHers' criticisms of the STI:

1) Yes the engine is made of chocolate, but sounds amazing imho (not compared to a Ferrari V8 of course, but certainly compared to EVOs are RS'). It "only" makes 305 hp but is only a tenth or two slower to 60 than a Focus RS or Golf R.

2) Its the only car in its class that has proper AWD and not a crappy Haldex based system. Plus in my STI I can use the centre differential switch to shunt the power to the rear

Here's my 2016 in Lapis Blue. Not sure what I'd replace it with eventually, either the next STI (presuming they keep making them for N America) or perhaps a manual M3 saloon (presuming M3s still come in manual in 10 years time)

[culpz]

Yipper said:

As others have said, the competition, like Golf R or Audi S3, has caught up and gone past Subaru. Few decent lease deals. And the badge snobbery means most people with 30k to spend want German.

Yupp. However, even in non-performance terms, i reckon Subaru will still struggle. How many cooking models and variants do you see on the road? I just worry for them as a company.

Even if they're going to do what Mitsubishi appear to be doing, which is mainly hybrid SUV's, i'm sure their little niche will be overridden by ze Germans soon after.

[PorkRind]

Catatafish said:

The UK market is microscopic for these. No surprise really

1100 compared to 9100 golf r's..

[daemon]

culpz said:

Yipper said:

As others have said, the competition, like Golf R or Audi S3, has caught up and gone past Subaru. Few decent lease deals. And the badge snobbery means most people with 30k to spend want German.

Yupp. However, even in non-performance terms, i reckon Subaru will still struggle. How many cooking models and variants do you see on the road? I just worry for them as a company.

Even if they're going to do what Mitsubishi appear to be doing, which is mainly hybrid SUV's, i'm sure their little niche will be overridden by ze Germans soon after.

There is no need to worry. They sell like hot cakes in AUS, JDM and the US, not so much in a German car obsessed market like ours.

[Sylvaforever]

DanielSan said:

The annoying thing is they have access to the direct injection system from Toyota, it’s fitted to the 86/BRZ boxer lump. So surely going back down to the 2 litre engine and having the direct injection would improve economy and it could still produce 300-350bhp.

Indeed!!!!

Edited by Sylvaforever on Thursday 2nd November 14:59

[Krikkit]

As noted above I think this is engine-related in terms of their poor sales more than anything - reliability woes on the 2.5 are relatively high, a decent twin-scroll closed deck 2.0 would be much more in keeping with the market's desires.

[culpz]

daemon said:

There is no need to worry. They sell like hot cakes in AUS, JDM and the US, not so much in a German car obsessed market like ours.

Ahh, yes, my bad. I do need to stop assuming that the UK are the predominant market for these.

[fido]

Sylvaforever said:

DanielSan said:

The annoying thing is they have access to the direct injection system from Toyota, it’s fitted to the 86/BRZ boxer lump. So surely going back down to the 2 litre engine and having the direct injection would improve economy and it could still produce 300-350bhp.

Indeed!!!!

They have a 200bhp 2 litre direct-injection unit in the Levorg (JDM). Shame it's CVT and not likely to be sold in the UK - rather short-sighted in my opinion as there a large enough market for performance wagons.

[MDMA .]

culpz said:

daemon said:

There is no need to worry. They sell like hot cakes in AUS, JDM and the US, not so much in a German car obsessed market like ours.

Ahh, yes, my bad. I do need to stop assuming that the UK are the predominant market for these.

Subaru sold over 600,000 cars in North America last year with a year on year increase for the previous 10 years. Pulling the STI from the UK is not a big deal for them unfortunately.

[Ares]

daemon said:

culpz said:

Yipper said:

As others have said, the competition, like Golf R or Audi S3, has caught up and gone past Subaru. Few decent lease deals. And the badge snobbery means most people with 30k to spend want German.

Yupp. However, even in non-performance terms, i reckon Subaru will still struggle. How many cooking models and variants do you see on the road? I just worry for them as a company.

Even if they're going to do what Mitsubishi appear to be doing, which is mainly hybrid SUV's, i'm sure their little niche will be overridden by ze Germans soon after.

There is no need to worry. They sell like hot cakes in AUS, JDM and the US, not so much in a German car obsessed market like ours.

So it'll just got back to the 1990s where if you wanted the hot model, you had to import it yourself, or buy it from an importer.

Way better value too . P1

[daemon]

Part of the problem here is the pricing strategy they have adopted.

Even for their cooking models, the pricing is daft. You can pay £18,995 for their decidedly average 114bhp petrol Impreza

https://broadspeed.com/new_cars/Subaru/Impreza/Cho...

OR VW will sell you a discounted Golf 110BHP Golf S for £16,500

https://broadspeed.com/new_cars/Volkswagen/Golf/Ch...