RE: Toyota Celica GT-Four: PH Used Buying Guide

RE: Toyota Celica GT-Four: PH Used Buying Guide

Author
Discussion

andymac

112 posts

285 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
eybic said:
Guvernator said:
Never really understood why these never got the same love as the Subaru Impreza's and Mitsubshi Evo's, despite having similar rally heritage. Decent versions of the former two seem to be rapidly moving into collector territory, see the £50k Impreza P1 and 6 figure 22b's as an example and yet even the most rarest and most hardcore WRC version of the Celica can still be had for relative peanuts. What gives?
This version of the GT-Four didn't get too much exposure as Toyota got banned for cheating with it ( inlet restrictor opened up when the head was bolted on) in it's first year in the WRC so in terms of rally success and TV exposure it was very minimal.
amazing ..the design risks taken to win

SonicShadow

2,452 posts

156 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Guvernator said:
Never really understood why these never got the same love as the Subaru Impreza's and Mitsubshi Evo's, despite having similar rally heritage. Decent versions of the former two seem to be rapidly moving into collector territory, see the £50k Impreza P1 and 6 figure 22b's as an example and yet even the most rarest and most hardcore WRC version of the Celica can still be had for relative peanuts. What gives?
True - https://rallycarsforsale.net/ads/toyota-celica-gt4...

J4CKO

41,802 posts

202 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Been rattling on about these being a conspicuous bargain, relative to their peers for ages, Nothing wrong with an Escort Cosworth or Integrale but are they really worth ten times more ?

These havent ascended to the rarefied realm of those cars yet, still got a slight whiff of Baz-tastic 90s Jap mod scene, massive smokey "Zorsts", big wheels and the like, a standard one in good nick is a fine thing, and modded ones can be returned to something nearer original if you want.

Much as I love watching Project Binky develop, why would that be the best use of one of these, its a good use of that, broken one but seems a rather dismissive comment about a pretty significant car.

I should buy one but I need a daily and dont have the time, space or cash for another car.




dufunk

182 posts

125 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
JDM GT4 made 255bhp actually as it had a better intercooler than the MR2 Turbo but was based on 100 RON fuel. Their good for 320bhp before changing internals and the standard turbo was noticeably smaller than the later evo & scoobies that's how they pulled the 280bhp.

Edited by dufunk on Thursday 2nd August 11:22

Guvernator

13,204 posts

167 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
That's a full spec Grp A car with some VERY trick (read expensive bits on it). Not the same as a standard GT-Four, the best examples of which you can still pick up for less than £10k as opposed to a £50k bog standard Impreza P1.

SonicShadow

2,452 posts

156 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Guvernator said:
SonicShadow said:
That's a full spec Grp A car with some VERY trick (read expensive bits on it). Not the same as a standard GT-Four, the best examples of which you can still pick up for less than £10k as opposed to a £50k bog standard Impreza P1.
That was the point - you can get a Group A GT4 for similar money to a P1.

Group A GT4 *could* be road legal in the UK too.

SonicShadow

2,452 posts

156 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
dufunk said:
JDM GT4 made 255bhp actually as it had a better intercooler than the MR2 Turbo but was based on 100 RON fuel. Their good for 320bhp before changing internals and the standard turbo was noticeably smaller than the later evo & scoobies that's how they pulled the 280bhp.

Edited by dufunk on Thursday 2nd August 11:22
PS. Slightly different to BHP!

Krikkit

26,652 posts

183 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Guvernator said:
SonicShadow said:
That's a full spec Grp A car with some VERY trick (read expensive bits on it). Not the same as a standard GT-Four, the best examples of which you can still pick up for less than £10k as opposed to a £50k bog standard Impreza P1.
Probably the best example of a standard P1 you mean? That was hardly representative of the general pricing for a P1, which is about £15k for a reasonable one...

A minty ST205 is now over £10k even for a Jap import.

Part of me thinks that the reputation for this car was sullied by the cheating, the rest by the exorbitant pricing when new. £10k more than the Impreza? You'd have to be really keen to buy it.

Edited by Krikkit on Thursday 2nd August 11:41

Guvernator

13,204 posts

167 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
That was the point - you can get a Group A GT4 for similar money to a P1.

Group A GT4 *could* be road legal in the UK too.
Ahh fair enough. Imagine having that in your garage. thumbup

cerb4.5lee

31,077 posts

182 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
A mate of mine had one and I liked it when I had a go in it. My tuned S14 200sx always pulled away from him, so he started to fettle it and we had some really good fun after that.

Good memories and I miss having a Jap car because they've always had a strong following, and there are plenty of meets/shows to go to.

greenarrow

3,659 posts

119 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Test driver said:
rodericb said:
You forgot to say that they'd be shown a clear set of heels by a diesel Golf at the traffic light Grand Prix.
I can’t stand diesels or traffic light Grand Prix. Toyota seem to overprice and under deliver here.
You can buy them from £3K upwards and the car does 0-60 in around 5.9 seconds. I am trying to understand in what way this car is overpriced and under-delivering? Cant think of too many other 90s classics you can buy now for that money with that performance...classic Subaru impreza turbo is the only one coming to mind...

Beejayhay

120 posts

108 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
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Some strange comments on here tbh......240-255bhp in 1994?? I was ragging about in Astra 8v GTE thinking it was quick (115ish bhp?), The 16v got 150bhp, likewise the Golf GTI. Perspective people!

I think they're about to become 'importable' to the US which might raise prices?

SonicShadow

2,452 posts

156 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
greenarrow said:
Test driver said:
rodericb said:
You forgot to say that they'd be shown a clear set of heels by a diesel Golf at the traffic light Grand Prix.
I can’t stand diesels or traffic light Grand Prix. Toyota seem to overprice and under deliver here.
You can buy them from £3K upwards and the car does 0-60 in around 5.9 seconds. I am trying to understand in what way this car is overpriced and under-delivering? Cant think of too many other 90s classics you can buy now for that money with that performance...classic Subaru impreza turbo is the only one coming to mind...
It's stablemate, MR2 Turbo. In the dry it can launch just as hard as a GT4 can as long as you haven't got LingLongs on it!

Mr E

21,779 posts

261 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
PS. Slightly different to BHP!
Slightly smaller, metric horses.

rossub

4,542 posts

192 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
Test driver said:
Disappointing power figures and potential money pit. Oil change at 4500 miles?! For a 2.0 4pot turbo only making 239bhp? Nice cars though they are not worth the money imo.

Edited by Test driver on Thursday 2nd August 09:44
239bhp was very competitive in 1994. Lets put that into context. Also, the Japanese market version made ~250bhp.

1993 Impreza Turbo 2000 - 208bhp.
1994 Impreza WRX - 236bhp.
1993-1995 Lancer Evo II - 252bhp
1993 S13 Silvia - 205bhp
1995 S14 Silvia - 217bhp
Can you apply the weight of those cars to your summary though? These things are nearly 200 kg more than the Impreza of that era.

I love the look of them, but that weight puts me off. They're more in line with the following generation of Rally Reps from 2001 in that respect really.

Dave Hedgehog

14,599 posts

206 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Robbidoo said:
cookie1600 said:
Only two words really.

Project Binky.
Yep I came here to say best use for these is turning them into a Mini.
binky is a ST185

howardhughes

1,034 posts

206 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
Fast Forward twenty four years

Porsche 968 Club Sport £36K +

Toyota Celica GT-Four £3K +

The Toyota Celica GT-Four was way overpriced to begin with.

Dave Hedgehog

14,599 posts

206 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
Test driver said:
Disappointing power figures and potential money pit. Oil change at 4500 miles?! For a 2.0 4pot turbo only making 239bhp? Nice cars though they are not worth the money imo.

Edited by Test driver on Thursday 2nd August 09:44
239bhp was very competitive in 1994. Lets put that into context. Also, the Japanese market version made ~250bhp.

1993 Impreza Turbo 2000 - 208bhp.
1994 Impreza WRX - 236bhp.
1993-1995 Lancer Evo II - 252bhp
1993 S13 Silvia - 205bhp
1995 S14 Silvia - 217bhp

As for the oil change interval - oil tech has moved on a lot in the past 25 years. You could safely double that interval using a good quality modern synthetic oil, depending on usage.
also you need to compare that performance to the avg road car of the time, they where monsteroulsy fast compared to what joe avg was driving, very few cars at the time had anything like this performance there where no 6 second oil burners about biggrin

they where great GT cars, i like it so much i bought 3 of them despite the steep price at the time


cerb4.5lee

31,077 posts

182 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
SonicShadow said:
It's stablemate, MR2 Turbo. In the dry it can launch just as hard as a GT4 can as long as you haven't got LingLongs on it!
I can agree with this as well, I've always enjoyed the traffic light GP(its surprising how many are up for it too!). The MR2 Turbo was the only car I had fun with in my 200sx that had me off the line! When I eventually got some grip I was pinned to its rear bumper though.

All this Jap chat is making me want another!...a Supercharged/Turbocharged GT86 would do me nicely! cooldriving

Dave Hedgehog

14,599 posts

206 months

Thursday 2nd August 2018
quotequote all
howardhughes said:
Fast Forward twenty four years

Porsche 968 Club Sport £36K +

Toyota Celica GT-Four £3K +

The Toyota Celica GT-Four was way overpriced to begin with.
if they had made the other car the results would be the same

Porsche GT-Four £36k

Toyota 968 CS £3k

in fact a porsche GT-Four with the limited numbers of the CS and its rally history would probably be £60k

if your going to have fanboys make sure they have deep pockets biggrin