difference between driving lamps & fog lights?

[Thorburn]

I did notice on some Peugeot (106 GTI perhaps) that I used to ALWAYS see driving round with his fog lights on that they'd automatically switch off when he turned on his main beams.

Don't know if that's standard behaviour across all cars, but made a lot of sense really.

[Mars]

davethebunny said:

So if you want to drive around with your fogs on, do so, i don't care, but you do look a nob

... and that's the crux of it. You don't like them because you think they look stupid. On a clearly lit road I would question why anyone would want them on, but to claim they dazzle, ruin people's night vision (not you, admittedly), don't light up the road far enough ahead, etc is all cock compared with people just not liking them.

[Fluffsri/?]

Every car forum Ive visited always raises this argument. At the end of the day the law states,



The Highway Code Driving in adverse weather conditions (226-237)226
You MUST use headlights when visibility is seriously reduced, generally when you cannot see for more than 100 metres (328 feet). You may also use front or rear fog lights but you MUST switch them off when visibility improves (see Rule 236).


236
You MUST NOT use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced (see Rule 226) as they dazzle other road users and can obscure your brake lights. You MUST switch them off when visibility improves.

The police will pull you for driving with fog lights on if the visibility is good.

[defblade]

Mars said:

They are NOT pointed upwards at an oncoming driver, so I refuse to accept that they dazzle -

You can refuse all you like, but I find them dazzling - and it's a lot worse with wet roads, when the whole lot comes back up at you too. Just feel lucky it doesn't affect you!

(It may be something to do with my glasses' lenses but I'm blind as a bat without them so I don't have a choice (and I can't wear contacts ))

[kambites]

Mars said:

... and that's the crux of it. You don't like them because you think they look stupid. On a clearly lit road I would question why anyone would want them on, but to claim they dazzle, ruin people's night vision (not you, admittedly), don't light up the road far enough ahead, etc is all cock compared with people just not liking them.

I'm quite willing to accept that they don't dazzle you, however they do (sometimes) dazzle me. Frankly if you are arrogant enough to believe that you know everything about the eyesight of every driver in the UK, then I despair and if you use them with dipped headlights in good visibility, I hope you lose your licence for it.

ETA: Admittedly a small subset of LED DRLs and many HIDs are worse, and they're usually legal.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 2nd December 11:23

[thiscocks]

Thing is people who drive with fog lights always on just seem pretty inconsiderate to other drivers. Thats what is annoying. They have the choice to turn them off but must think they are either needed for normal night driving(they're not), or think they look cool(they don't). If you want better visibility buy some propperly mounted spot driving lights which they use quite commonly in scandinavia.

[Bluebarge]

Mars said:

davethebunny said:

So if you want to drive around with your fogs on, do so, i don't care, but you do look a nob

... and that's the crux of it. You don't like them because you think they look stupid. On a clearly lit road I would question why anyone would want them on, but to claim they dazzle, ruin people's night vision (not you, admittedly), don't light up the road far enough ahead, etc is all cock compared with people just not liking them.

Cobblers. I don't give two hoots what other people's cars look like - daft spoilers, drls, leds under the sills - none of this bothers me in the slightest. What does bother me is people driving with high-intensity lights in circumstances which don't justify it, because it does affect my vision.

Do you think the Highway Code rules on fog lights were drawn up for aesthetic reasons? or because fog lights do actually dazzle if used in clear conditions?

[aka_kerrly]

Call me strange but I have never had an issue with people running fog lights at night ecause as stated the range on them is quite short and they should be pointed downwards. I get more fed up of modern cars 4x4s in particular (due to the height of the ligthts) that have HID kits with projectors which make light far too intense.

I used to have a Xr2i and that had both driving and fog lights and on more than one ocassion i was stopped by the police and had to test all the lights to prove the outer pair only came on with full beam and werent on a fog light or seperate switch.

For the record, you would know if i was running my fog lights as they are LHD so light up the opposite side of the road VERY well!

Edited by aka_kerrly on Thursday 2nd December 11:33

[Mars]

Bluebarge said:

Do you think the Highway Code rules on fog lights were drawn up for aesthetic reasons? or because fog lights do actually dazzle if used in clear conditions?

What's your stance on DRLs? Specifically the Audi ones?

[Rawwr]

"Driving lamps aren't used by twots."

[colonel c]

Well apart from possibly being of use by lighting up the verges of dark country roads and really thick fog. What other practical purpose do they serve? Other than making the driver look like a nob.

[munroman]

Here in Central Scotland we can get some real pea souper fogs, my first car had fog lights and one night the fog was extremely dense, the headlights just bounced glare back at me.

I put the fog lights on and the headlights off, what an amazing difference, the fog lights got under the fog and picked out the roadside.

I have fitted foglights to every car I have had since, but only use them when we have thick fog.

If I see another car with them on when they are not required, I just use them as the equivalent to a sign saying 'wker', and give the vehicle a wide berth, as for the poster who says they are Ok, ditto re arrogant tt comments!

[RobM77]

In response to the OP, to be honest money would be better spent on upgrading your headlight bulbs. Driving lights are more about being seen than seeing, and foglights only shine a beam to illuminate the edges of the road when you're crawling along in a pea-souper. The other sort of driving lights are the aforementioned ones fitted to the Elise and other cars, which are wired into the main beam (think of those modded Escorts from the 70s) - they do make a big difference if you can do the wiring to have them come on with the main beam only. As a first step though, I'd upgrade your headlights bulbs and see how you get on with that.

HTH

[Mr Dave]

I have never been dazzled by anyone elses front fog lights, the use of them in good weather isnt illegal in a lot of other countries so I really dont see what the fuss is about. If it dazzles you that much a trip to the opticians is in order or perhaps get a pair of yellow driving glasses as they do cut down glare and if two low aimed fogs dazzle you dangerously then im sure other lights will as well and that isnt safe!

I do find that Puegeot 206 headlights are the only non-hid lights that dazzle me sometimes, you can tell on a dark road what car it is by how glaring their lights can be.

Anyway I use my front fogs down country lanes and rubbish back roads but always do turn them off when an theres an approaching car. Ive never been flashed at or anything like that so I hope im being considerate enough.Sometimes when visibility is bad I would leave them on passing other cars but it seems it would be preferable to leave my main beams on instead.

[kambites]

Obviously there is nothing wrong with having them on if there is no-one in front of you to be blinded by them, although I suppose it's still illegal.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 2nd December 12:47

[LuS1fer]

300bhp/ton said:

LuS1fer said:

I have an old Golf III and with the headlights on in a very dark lane, I can put the fog lights on and off and see a barely detectable difference that simply doesn't justify ever using them for that purpose.

Only car I've had with fitted (or working ) front fogs is my Camaro. On the country lanes I think they make a notable difference. Not for distance, but they light up the sides of the road way better, this is good at all times but especially if lots of tight turns are involved when your normal headlights don't actually shine in the direction the road is going to go.

Don't agree. My Z28 fogs were not only rubbish but in tunnels. They were so poor, I actually removed them to allow more cold air in to the intake. I did upgrade the headlight bulbs which did make a difference. To notice any difference, you'd have to be perched on the lip of your steering wheel. As stated, I have tried this in lanes on the Golf and the difference is so slight to be of absolutely no advantage.

I also don't claim they are inherently dazzling but if every w*nk*r had 4 lights instead of two blazing on their cars, it would double the amount of glare your eyes have to deal with when trying to remain acclimatised to the dark. It does the drivers no gtood and it certainly does the oncoming traffic no good.

So I'm happy for everyone to continue to use their foglights unnecessarily and I will continue to put my headlamps on full beam in response.

[RobM77]

Mr Dave said:

I have never been dazzled by anyone elses front fog lights, the use of them in good weather isnt illegal in a lot of other countries so I really dont see what the fuss is about. If it dazzles you that much a trip to the opticians is in order or perhaps get a pair of yellow driving glasses as they do cut down glare and if two low aimed fogs dazzle you dangerously then im sure other lights will as well and that isnt safe!

I do find that Puegeot 206 headlights are the only non-hid lights that dazzle me sometimes, you can tell on a dark road what car it is by how glaring their lights can be.

Anyway I use my front fogs down country lanes and rubbish back roads but always do turn them off when an theres an approaching car. Ive never been flashed at or anything like that so I hope im being considerate enough.Sometimes when visibility is bad I would leave them on passing other cars but it seems it would be preferable to leave my main beams on instead.

Funny how everyone assumes that their eyes are the same as everyone else's... Everyone has a different sensitivity to noise and light (and smell, taste and touch). Only the other day I had a bunch of people looking at Jupiter through my telescope; one reported it was a bit dim for them to see and one other said it was too bright for their eyes! Same eyepiece, same night, just different eyes. Personally, my eyes are extremely sensitive. I can't look at the moon through my telescope without a filter, and yes, fog lights do dazzle me.

[LuS1fer]

For those, incidentally, who say "I've never been flashed", I am often prevented from doing so by my conscience because I don't want the car in front to think I'm flashing them.

[300bhp/ton]

LuS1fer said:

300bhp/ton said:

LuS1fer said:

I have an old Golf III and with the headlights on in a very dark lane, I can put the fog lights on and off and see a barely detectable difference that simply doesn't justify ever using them for that purpose.

Only car I've had with fitted (or working ) front fogs is my Camaro. On the country lanes I think they make a notable difference. Not for distance, but they light up the sides of the road way better, this is good at all times but especially if lots of tight turns are involved when your normal headlights don't actually shine in the direction the road is going to go.

Don't agree. My Z28 fogs were not only rubbish but in tunnels.

Well logically we either don't agree or our cars were slightly different?

I certainly notice them when I use them, which I do from time to time in some of the county lanes I use a lot near home. I'm not saying it's a night and day difference, but it is certainly noticeable. And as said before hand, on tight turns, I like the fact they light up some of the area I'm about to steer and head towards, and area that would have been dark otherwise. But maybe I look through my side windows more?

I do admit proper spot and driving lamps are vastly different and way better, but I don't have them (nor do I want them) fitted to this car.

LuS1fer said:

They were so poor, I actually removed them to allow more cold air in to the intake.

Had you modified the intake? It's normal feed is not from the bumper at all (it's all blocked off with foam. 4th gens have an air damn under the car that funnels the air up to the underside of the air intake and filter housing.

[Bayeux]

I have driving lamps in mine now, they come on with main beam.

This is perfectly legal as there are no height restrictions, they just have to be equally spaced and in the same location each side.

They fill in the area between dipped and high beams really well.