RE: Tesla Model X | PH Used Buying Guide
Discussion
biggbn said:
Fascinating. I've never considered a Sierra Cosworth to have 'soul'....or a 340 bmw!! Makes your point, if we accept it exists as a concept, it is a personal choice to what we attribute it to, therefore it is as subjective as any other trait.
In those cases it's about relative soul as opposed to sticking 340 estate next to a GTO and considering them equals. 
You'd expect the generic 3 series which had the silliest engine to have more soul than the base car but for me, I found it had nothing to add. Meanwhile the i3 was seemingly supposed to be a shopping car but when slinging it down narrow lanes has real character.
Royal Jelly said:
Don’t tar me with your climate aspersions; you pollute the atmosphere less during your Tesla ownership period.
I've never made any comment now or in the past climate aspirations about EVs or anything else. I'm realistic in accepting my life style is unstainable for 1% of the worlds population let alone 100%.But people always bring up 'environment' on EVs, but your post highlights why worrying about the environment in any context of current human aspirational lifesytles is pretty much pointless.
The best bit is F1 driver now claiming to have environmental concerns
.cerb4.5lee said:
I definitely need to try a high performance EV I reckon. The two EVs that I've driven were slow ones(Merc EQA250/Smart four two) and they were both awful to drive. I do wonder if a performance EV would hook me in a little bit perhaps?
I always read great things about the i3 as well, although I'm miles too shallow to drive around in something that looks as daft as that does though. So it could be the best car in the world to drive...but I still wouldn't want to be seen dead in one though.
The i8 could be a good compromise for me I think, because I love the way they look, but I struggle to get past the fact that a car can look that good but only have a poxy 3 cylinder engine to help move it though.
Just wear a balaclava and park outside the neighbour's house? I always read great things about the i3 as well, although I'm miles too shallow to drive around in something that looks as daft as that does though. So it could be the best car in the world to drive...but I still wouldn't want to be seen dead in one though.
The i8 could be a good compromise for me I think, because I love the way they look, but I struggle to get past the fact that a car can look that good but only have a poxy 3 cylinder engine to help move it though.
I'd just delude myself that everyone assumed I was just borrowing the wife's car.
DonkeyApple said:
biggbn said:
Fascinating. I've never considered a Sierra Cosworth to have 'soul'....or a 340 bmw!! Makes your point, if we accept it exists as a concept, it is a personal choice to what we attribute it to, therefore it is as subjective as any other trait.
In those cases it's about relative soul as opposed to sticking 340 estate next to a GTO and considering them equals. You'd expect the generic 3 series which had the silliest engine to have more soul than the base car but for me, I found it had nothing to add. Meanwhile the i3 was seemingly supposed to be a shopping car but when slinging it down narrow lanes has real character.
DonkeyApple said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I definitely need to try a high performance EV I reckon. The two EVs that I've driven were slow ones(Merc EQA250/Smart four two) and they were both awful to drive. I do wonder if a performance EV would hook me in a little bit perhaps?
I always read great things about the i3 as well, although I'm miles too shallow to drive around in something that looks as daft as that does though. So it could be the best car in the world to drive...but I still wouldn't want to be seen dead in one though.
The i8 could be a good compromise for me I think, because I love the way they look, but I struggle to get past the fact that a car can look that good but only have a poxy 3 cylinder engine to help move it though.
Just wear a balaclava and park outside the neighbour's house? I always read great things about the i3 as well, although I'm miles too shallow to drive around in something that looks as daft as that does though. So it could be the best car in the world to drive...but I still wouldn't want to be seen dead in one though.
The i8 could be a good compromise for me I think, because I love the way they look, but I struggle to get past the fact that a car can look that good but only have a poxy 3 cylinder engine to help move it though.
I'd just delude myself that everyone assumed I was just borrowing the wife's car.
Pusikurac said:
The main problem is, when something important will go wrong, it will cost you. A lot.
You can not just hop to a local shop and fix it. And even if they could, Tesla will not sell them parts (or will, not sure about that issue at the moment, but if they will, it will cost you. A lot).
And the battery. It will fail, it is just a question, when. And it is not just the mileage, that wears it out, it is also the time. And temperature. And charging habits.
And when it will die (could be just one cell), it is what, 15k?
Those cars are to be bought new and keep them untill warranty runs out. Not a day more.
There's literally million mile cars out there over a decade old and the associated battery degradation data to go with them. You can not just hop to a local shop and fix it. And even if they could, Tesla will not sell them parts (or will, not sure about that issue at the moment, but if they will, it will cost you. A lot).
And the battery. It will fail, it is just a question, when. And it is not just the mileage, that wears it out, it is also the time. And temperature. And charging habits.
And when it will die (could be just one cell), it is what, 15k?
Those cars are to be bought new and keep them untill warranty runs out. Not a day more.
Battery degradation is impressively low across the board and certainly not something owners need to worry about.
I strongly suspect many of the battery failure tales are actually propaganda from the anti EV mob, because the reality does not mirror the nonsense echoed online on a daily basis.
I say this as a purely petrol (and one diseasel) motorist.
Google is your friend. With everything you share online or in person, get in the habit of validating what you share before sharing. We'll all learn something and there will be less nonsense doing the rounds. We all need to get in the habit of stopping repeating rubbish unless we have first hand experience or have verified what we are saying.
carlo996 said:
mrclav said:
Not tenuous at all - fact is, when Nissan posted their Nurburgring times, Porsche got their knickers in a twist at the fact their best work at the time been out-gunned by the Japanese with a car that weighed more than theirs.
Also there was simply no need for the designer to defend anything when he'd beaten everything that rivalled his work at the time.
Finally, you're wrong with your BIK comment; one thing that BEVs are FAR better at controlling than any ICE car is traction, particularly in slippery conditions:-I
1. I love the GTR. But it’s a heavy lump. As for besting Porsche, let’s not mention reliability Also there was simply no need for the designer to defend anything when he'd beaten everything that rivalled his work at the time.
Finally, you're wrong with your BIK comment; one thing that BEVs are FAR better at controlling than any ICE car is traction, particularly in slippery conditions:-I
2. What has traction got to do with personal taxation?
2. You stated "Anyone who enjoys driving would only use EV for what it's best at. Reducing BIK" - I was pointing out that's not necessarily the case.
Royal Jelly said:
Don’t tar me with your climate aspersions; you pollute the atmosphere less during your Tesla ownership period. By the time you took delivery, significant environmental damage has already been done. Alongside supporting child slavery in African cobalt mines and the like. Brilliant.
When you choose to order a new car, you set in motion the entire lifetime emissions of the thing. To build it, and to fuel it through your ownership and that of subsequent owners. You choose. Once it’s built the deal is done, someone will run it until it dies and it’s lifetime impact will be x tonnes of CO2. If you choose to order an electric car over an equivalent ICE car, that number will be appreciably smaller.
When you choose to buy an existing car, it makes no difference to overall emissions whether you buy an EV or ICE. If you buy one, someone else will buy the other.
Arsecati said:
Nomme de Plum said:
So you drive 9 or 10 hours with only a 5 minute break.
Amazing.
Do you anaesthetise you family during this trip?
It takes you ten hours to drive 500 miles? Who you driving..... Miss Daisy??Amazing.
Do you anaesthetise you family during this trip?
mrclav said:
1. Reliability wasn't the issue, performance was as the GTR is a heavier car than the 997 but it out-performed it at the time of release.
2. You stated "Anyone who enjoys driving would only use EV for what it's best at. Reducing BIK" - I was pointing out that's not necessarily the case.
Many of us cannot receive any tax breaks associated with BIK. 2. You stated "Anyone who enjoys driving would only use EV for what it's best at. Reducing BIK" - I was pointing out that's not necessarily the case.
The decision to go EV is that they can be a more pleasant environment in which to carry out a journey.
Nomme de Plum said:
The decision to go EV is that they can be a more pleasant environment in which to carry out a journey.
Just make sure that the brake regeneration is turned off though. The brake regeneration ruins the smoothness of how the car feels for me, and I really disliked it. It was at odds with how everyone praises how smooth EVs are I reckon. It was properly annoying I thought. cerb4.5lee said:
Nomme de Plum said:
The decision to go EV is that they can be a more pleasant environment in which to carry out a journey.
Just make sure that the brake regeneration is turned off though. The brake regeneration ruins the smoothness of how the car feels for me, and I really disliked it. It was at odds with how everyone praises how smooth EVs are I reckon. It was properly annoying I thought. Brake regeneration is part of the appeal for me.
My experience is BMW i3, limited, but several months in a Taycan 4S
mrclav said:
one thing that BEVs are FAR better at controlling than any ICE car is traction, particularly in slippery conditions:-
The electric Kona certainly isn’t. Edited by mrclav on Tuesday 11th April 10:08
I had one on a short lease a couple of years ago, when it got to November and greasy/wet roads it wheel span like buggery. Was much worse than an Astra I had at the time despite similar power output/size/ fwd etc.
Nomme de Plum said:
Many of us cannot receive any tax breaks associated with BIK.
The decision to go EV is that they can be a more pleasant environment in which to carry out a journey.
I’m sure 130K of Taycan is…apart from the usual charging problems on the move. It depends if you enjoy the process of driving, I know having to change gear and, heaven forbid, heal and toe are largely things that enthusiasts do, but I just find all EVs terminally boring. Just the thing for older drivers I guess, but given the costs of buying the ‘best’ out there (imho Taycan) they are still irrelevant. I3’s are horrible on a longer drive, choppy ride. Hybrids are a total joke. The decision to go EV is that they can be a more pleasant environment in which to carry out a journey.
Russ T Bolt said:
mrclav said:
one thing that BEVs are FAR better at controlling than any ICE car is traction, particularly in slippery conditions:-
The electric Kona certainly isn’t. Edited by mrclav on Tuesday 11th April 10:08
I had one on a short lease a couple of years ago, when it got to November and greasy/wet roads it wheel span like buggery. Was much worse than an Astra I had at the time despite similar power output/size/ fwd etc.
biggbn said:
DonkeyApple said:
biggbn said:
Fascinating. I've never considered a Sierra Cosworth to have 'soul'....or a 340 bmw!! Makes your point, if we accept it exists as a concept, it is a personal choice to what we attribute it to, therefore it is as subjective as any other trait.
In those cases it's about relative soul as opposed to sticking 340 estate next to a GTO and considering them equals. You'd expect the generic 3 series which had the silliest engine to have more soul than the base car but for me, I found it had nothing to add. Meanwhile the i3 was seemingly supposed to be a shopping car but when slinging it down narrow lanes has real character.
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