RE: Insignia VXR Supersport: 170mph for sub £30K

[Apache]

I'll reserve judgement till I drive it, no one, unless they have a pathological hatred for a brand, csn dismiss such a car out of hand before even sitting in the thing, it's pathetic and something I've found to utterly inaccurate

[300bhp/ton]

Rosscow said:

300bhp/ton said:

Being a good car and being popular are hardly the same thing.

It's good because its powerful and fast, but that also means it has high VED and low mpg. So to many it is bad.

Nissan struggle to sell the 370z does this mean it's a bad car?

Maybe not, but surely a good car would be popular enough to those interested in it to sell.

I don't think the speed is an issue. Yes it can go and stop quickly.

But all the negative comments that I have read say that it is boring, gives no feed back and is not very good at cornering (probably due to the weight).

I guess logic would say you need to not ignore the positive comments that are also posted here.

Maybe go drive it yourself and form an opinion that way.

While understanding the price point, an M5 is a heck of a lot more money, hell an M3 is what double the price. These cars "should" be a lot better.

But if you're in the market for a new car you could have this VXR or consider a £32,000 520i with only 184bhp that despite being RWD probably also lacks steering feel, feed back and certainly the performance.


As for good cars being popular - nope. Just look at how many boring dull Toyota's are sold vs how many Morgans or Corvettes are sold a year.

[Rosscow]

300bhp/ton said:

I guess logic would say you need to not ignore the positive comments that are also posted here.

Maybe go drive it yourself and form an opinion that way.

While understanding the price point, an M5 is a heck of a lot more money, hell an M3 is what double the price. These cars "should" be a lot better.

But if you're in the market for a new car you could have this VXR or consider a £32,000 520i with only 184bhp that despite being RWD probably also lacks steering feel, feed back and certainly the performance.


As for good cars being popular - nope. Just look at how many boring dull Toyota's are sold vs how many Morgans or Corvettes are sold a year.

Yes, I take your point(s)

[RWA441]

Rosscow said:

RWA441 said:

Because the Merc was a stop gap car till early next year when we will be getting another VX. The 4x4 is needed to get to my house in the winter and having tried an Antara I'll admit it was a poor car in comparison to a second hand X5. They don't really do an out and out sports soft top now (did have a VX220 that was great fun) hence the Porsche. Any other model though I will happily have Think it will be a Mokka next year for the Mrs.

So you bought a Merc for a stop gap.

You bought a BMW 'because you needed a 4x4.'

And you bought a Porsche just because Vauxhall don't make a soft top anymore.

And you slag me off for having a 'boring' Audi! You're basically a badge snob who grew up with Vauxhalls and have a soft spot for them.

The Merc was through family so purely ended up with it because of that. It's only an A-Class diesel thing thats 6 years old!
Yes I need a 4x4 as I live up an unadopted lane a fair few metres above sea level - we get a lot of snow. Porsche was simply as I'm a petrolhead, we've just had a baby so it has back seats which makes it usable and I can't have a TVR that does the same.
I've not mentioned once about your Audi being boring, I like Audi's, we had a 2001 TT that was a great car which even coped well getting to the house in all but very bad snow. And I'm not someone who 'grew up' with Vauxhalls as I said, I will be getting another one next year in lieu of the A-class.
A 'badge snob' is something I couldn't be any further from.

[TaylotS2K]

Not for me. Quality wise, it lacks behind other brands.

[Rosscow]

RWA441 said:

The Merc was through family so purely ended up with it because of that. It's only an A-Class diesel thing thats 6 years old!
Yes I need a 4x4 as I live up an unadopted lane a fair few metres above sea level - we get a lot of snow. Porsche was simply as I'm a petrolhead, we've just had a baby so it has back seats which makes it usable and I can't have a TVR that does the same.
I've not mentioned once about your Audi being boring, I like Audi's, we had a 2001 TT that was a great car which even coped well getting to the house in all but very bad snow. And I'm not someone who 'grew up' with Vauxhalls as I said, I will be getting another one next year in lieu of the A-class.
A 'badge snob' is something I couldn't be any further from.

Apologies, it wasn't you with the 'boring' comment.

[RWA441]

Rosscow said:

RWA441 said:

The Merc was through family so purely ended up with it because of that. It's only an A-Class diesel thing thats 6 years old!
Yes I need a 4x4 as I live up an unadopted lane a fair few metres above sea level - we get a lot of snow. Porsche was simply as I'm a petrolhead, we've just had a baby so it has back seats which makes it usable and I can't have a TVR that does the same.
I've not mentioned once about your Audi being boring, I like Audi's, we had a 2001 TT that was a great car which even coped well getting to the house in all but very bad snow. And I'm not someone who 'grew up' with Vauxhalls as I said, I will be getting another one next year in lieu of the A-class.
A 'badge snob' is something I couldn't be any further from.

Apologies, it wasn't you with the 'boring' comment.

No problem. In fact an A6 or A4 Avant quattro is high on my list of potential replacement for the X5 when the time comes.

[JREwing]

The model I like I think is the 2.8T Elite. I think that's the model I'd take.

Actually no, if you're talking about brand new they seem to be more expensive than the VXR with that deal someone posted!
My God, £23,555. I wish I could justify that, because it's a hell of a good price for a car with that spec, lifetime/100,000 mile warranty and so on.

[Pesty]

JREwing said:

The model I like I think is the 2.8T Elite. I think that's the model I'd take.

Actually no, if you're talking about brand new they seem to be more expensive than the VXR with that deal someone posted!
My God, £23,555. I wish I could justify that, because it's a hell of a good price for a car with that spec, lifetime/100,000 mile warranty and so on.

Out of interest anybody know the terms of the 0% finance? £23.555 is an amazing price for a new car like that. How much would that be a month?

Add in 0%, can you get that on a 4 year old S4? A lot of people finance their second hand cars so that is just another saving. And who pays if the S4 engine goes bang because its out or warranty. The buyer does. They forget that financing a depreciating asset makes the cost per mile even more.

http://www.astonvauxhall.co.uk/new-cars/search/226...

Edited by Pesty on Thursday 8th November 16:56

[300bhp/ton]

TaylotS2K said:

Not for me. Quality wise, it lacks behind other brands.

What other brands? And what exactly do you mean by 'quality'? Are you referring to the tactile feel of parts, the fit & finish, durability of components or the reliability of the vehicle?

[JREwing]

Pesty said:

Out of interest anybody know the terms of the 0% finance? £23.555 is an amazing price for a new car like that. How much would that be a month?

Add in 0%, can you get that on a 4 year old S4? A lot of people finance their second hand cars so that is just another saving. And who pays if the S4 engine goes bang because its out or warranty. The buyer does. They forget that financing a depreciating asset makes the cost per mile even more.

http://www.astonvauxhall.co.uk/new-cars/search/226...

Edited by Pesty on Thursday 8th November 16:56

Sorry, I decided not to look at it because I'd probably buy it

[arcticnick]

I seriously considered buying one last year. The lifetime warranty and the discounts available, plus finance, were hard to resist.

Also, I have a family, I enjoy skiing and thought it would be perfect for a fast drive to the Alps and back with a load of gear in the boot / on the roof etc. I think the estate is the best looking of the bunch. Fast, comfy, cheap for a new car. I also agreed to stop changing cars all the time so was looking to keep it for 5-7 years.

I didn't buy one because I am living abroad and didn't fancy having to negotiate with Opel Europe every time I wanted to claim on the lifetime warranty (I was not naive enough to think I wouldn't need it.)

I got a 335i Touring instead - a comparable car, which is smaller, less well equipped, cost more new (I bought mine at 3 years old) and doesn't cope as well in the snow without the winter wheels and tyres I bought. And the badge didn't swing I for me, it was the powertrain. But, I still think a VXR estate would have been a perfect car for the family.

So - there is a private market for these new (albeit it may just have been me), and also those buyers will also compare new and old (I had the S4 and a 530i Touring on the same list).

Not sure where that falls on the debate....

[Pesty]

JREwing said:

Sorry, I decided not to look at it because I'd probably buy it

I'm just thinking I get £550 a month car allowance + 40p a mile.
lifetime warranty keep it for 4/5 or so years its probably still worth a bit(not much with 100k on clock but still) and I've probably made money out of the deal in man maths.


Hmmmmmm damn you PH for bringing this to my attention.

[K5tealth]

Pesty said:

Out of interest anybody know the terms of the 0% finance? £23.555 is an amazing price for a new car like that. How much would that be a month?

Add in 0%, can you get that on a 4 year old S4? A lot of people finance their second hand cars so that is just another saving. And who pays if the S4 engine goes bang because its out or warranty. The buyer does. They forget that financing a depreciating asset makes the cost per mile even more.

http://www.astonvauxhall.co.uk/new-cars/search/226...

Edited by Pesty on Thursday 8th November 16:56

The car is 23,500 - the deal is up to 60 months with no deposit and Vauxhall give a 750 allowance. So about 380 per month

[K5tealth]

Mr Whippy said:

Well if you don't have the cash, but can get 0% finance, but want a car that will cost a lot to run, and end up after those 5 years with a car worth about £5000, then fine.

What is the total projected pence per mile for the intended usage?

I'd buy this.
http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/use...

It'd probably work out cheaper ppm over 5yrs of out of warranty ownership I think.


But as said, if the finance is the attraction then I can see why some people might want one. Pay loads for 60 months and have a worthless fuel guzzling Vauxhall barge at the end. Great!

History repeating, remember what happened to the Carlton and Senator prices at the end of the 90's? You couldn't give them away. Big fuel guzzling non-premium cars are not popular when they are 5yrs old.

And no, this isn't the 'new' Lotus Carlton either so it's not going to go up in value again eventually

Dave

What if I do have the cash but would prefer to invest the money in something more sensible than cars? Even in the bank I would earn 4,000 of interest. Why would you pay cash for a car when you can get 0% finance? I haven't even included the cost of money (inflation) over 5 years.

[prg123]

JREwing said:

Probably for the reason that Opel isn't a premium brand name and I've no idea how they'd transform it overnight into a BMW rival. Apart from which it would involve having to introduce a new non-premium brand across Europe and other areas.

And why-oh-why whenever there's something positive to say about Vauxhall do the "Vauxhall-is-st police" have to wade in to give their uninformed opinions?

Hmmmm wasn't saying vauxhall is st, I was saying that to get around the issue of badge snobs vauxhall should perhaps create a premium sub brand......

[anonymous-user]

Apache said:

unless they have a pathological hatred for a brand

That's me. Vauxhalls do nothing for me, they look so dull and dreary to me no matter how bright and funky they look. There is just something wrong with them in my eyes.

[s m]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Didn't the deathly quick Vectra actually get good reviews?

http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/6518...

Or are you suggesting that the EVO one was a special press car?

[Pesty]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

I think the only person who slagged off teh vectra vxr was Clarkson who for comedy affect always slags off Vauxhalls.

Most reviews I read said it was a very competant car.

[Apache]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

The standard ones were dire but the handling for the SRi was fettled by Lotus and was, for what it was, a fine enough handling repmobile, I drove one for a couple of years and enjoyed it. But what do I know