RE: Skoda Octavia vRS Revo Technik: Driven

[gigglebug]

ORD said:

To everyone sentient on this thread, AER has shown himself to be a knowledgable, articulate and fairly expert poster.

You, by contrast, have reminded me why so few people with actual knowledge post on here these days. People who know their stuff get frustrated with ignorant, small-minded, smart arse chumps like you that cannot even be respectful and pleasant.

I have shown myself to be far from ignorant and small minded as it has been me that has actually done the homework before posting and backed up my argument with facts. Indeed it has been AER who has been disrespectful as he/she has clearly replied before doing any research or applying any personal knowledge to the original post, then proceeded to try and further their position by insinuating and responding to an argument that never was there and finally has had to resort to an act of desperate one-upmanship by falling back on being a professional which in actual fact was irrelevant as his/hers professional knowledge has no bearing on what was being discussed or what he/she was insinuating. If I was arguing any sort of performance criteria between the cars being compared you would have a point but as I wasn't your post is as valid as any of his/hers.

[gigglebug]

Just to clarify my position;

If knowledgeable folks like AER are prepared to engage on an open forum to share a bit of what they have learn't with the view of helping to educate others that don't have the benefit of their experience then that is only a good thing. Long may it continue.

As is often the case though they use their knowledge merely to refute something that has either been implied or claimed by another party. This is fair enough, I have no problem with that either.

What I do have a problem with is this;

AER is quite happy to pull up anyone that claims or insinuates something that he feels/knows is incorrect and uses his knowledge and facts to prove what he/she is saying. This is absolutely fine as if you are willing to post or provide any information on an open forum you have to accept that you might get pulled up on it.

What he/she obviously wasn't happy with was when the shoe was on the other foot and it was him/her being pulled up by someone using facts to show that his/her understanding and information on a particular part of the general conversation was indeed incorrect. Instead of admitting his/her mistake as he/she would so clearly expect any other parties he/she has pulled up him/herself to do he/she actually tried to deflect from his/her misunderstanding by suggesting that the party pulling him/her up was implying things that at no point they were. In his/her attempt to change the subject onto something he/she felt more at home with they completely neglected the fact that it was irrelevant to the point being made and at no point was even being highlighted by the person pulling them up. Then to stoop so low as to have to quote themselves as being a "professional" and implying that because of this they couldn't possibly be wrong (even though they were wrong in the first instance and then carried onto providing irrelevant information to counter non existent claims) is as low as it gets I'm afraid.

If people like ORD and George111 think that someone like AER should be immune from being pulled up when they get something wrong and are proven to be wrong with facts the same as anyone else on an open forum and the same as the person they are blindly defending would do themselves just because they are a "professional" and can provide good information and insight for the most part then it is clearly they themselves that are ignorant and small-minded.

[ORD]

You've won at the Internet. Give yourself 2 points and tell your mum.

[xjay1337]

ORD said:

You've won at the Internet. Give yourself 2 points and tell your mum.

Useful.

[gigglebug]

ORD said:

You've won at the Internet. Give yourself 2 points and tell your mum.

I can only imagine how deflated someone like AER must feel when they get someone as insignificant and immature as you sucking up to them.

[George111]

gigglebug said:

Just to clarify my position;

If knowledgeable folks like AER are prepared to engage on an open forum to share a bit of what they have learn't with the view of helping to educate others that don't have the benefit of their experience then that is only a good thing. Long may it continue.

As is often the case though they use their knowledge merely to refute something that has either been implied or claimed by another party. This is fair enough, I have no problem with that either.

What I do have a problem with is this;

AER is quite happy to pull up anyone that claims or insinuates something that he feels/knows is incorrect and uses his knowledge and facts to prove what he/she is saying. This is absolutely fine as if you are willing to post or provide any information on an open forum you have to accept that you might get pulled up on it.

What he/she obviously wasn't happy with was when the shoe was on the other foot and it was him/her being pulled up by someone using facts to show that his/her understanding and information on a particular part of the general conversation was indeed incorrect. Instead of admitting his/her mistake as he/she would so clearly expect any other parties he/she has pulled up him/herself to do he/she actually tried to deflect from his/her misunderstanding by suggesting that the party pulling him/her up was implying things that at no point they were. In his/her attempt to change the subject onto something he/she felt more at home with they completely neglected the fact that it was irrelevant to the point being made and at no point was even being highlighted by the person pulling them up. Then to stoop so low as to have to quote themselves as being a "professional" and implying that because of this they couldn't possibly be wrong (even though they were wrong in the first instance and then carried onto providing irrelevant information to counter non existent claims) is as low as it gets I'm afraid.

If people like ORD and George111 think that someone like AER should be immune from being pulled up when they get something wrong and are proven to be wrong with facts the same as anyone else on an open forum and the same as the person they are blindly defending would do themselves just because they are a "professional" and can provide good information and insight for the most part then it is clearly they themselves that are ignorant and small-minded.

We need a lower age limit on PH, maybe requiring a credit card number to bill £1 to before an account is activated for posting, or we'll end up with st like this from 7 year olds for the rest of time.

[gigglebug]

George111 said:

We need a lower age limit on PH, maybe requiring a credit card number to bill £1 to before an account is activated for posting, or we'll end up with st like this from 7 year olds for the rest of time.

Is that really the best level of response you can come up with? Is that really all you've got? Trying to be clever but showing that you are anything but as you haven't come up with anything relevant. If you have a genuine response to my post then lets see it. If you have a genuine defence for the actions of the person you are sucking up to lets see it. Otherwise do yourself and AER a favor and don't bother.

[ORD]

You've ruined an interesting thread with your childish ranting, Giggle. I have reported you to the mods. I cannot stand this kind of 'I'm right! I'm right! You're wrong! I'm so clever' bullst that we get from teenage know-it-alls. You couldn't argue your way out of a wet paper bag, incidentally. But that's not the point. There was a decent thread here, and you've completely derailed it because your fragile ego could not tolerate someone (AER) actually knowing his stuff and not being interested in point-scoring nonsense.

[The Vambo]

ORD said:

You've ruined an interesting thread with your childish ranting, Giggle. I have reported you to the mods. I cannot stand this kind of 'I'm right! I'm right! You're wrong! I'm so clever' bullst

Did you even read that post he wrote? That is literally the opposite of it.

I read it as anyone can be right or wrong but for it to be accepted as gospel, you need to provide hard facts and because professional isn't good enough,

The Revo guy was treated pretty rudely IMHO, more so than anyone on this thread. I didn't see him flounce.

Edited by The Vambo on Sunday 21st February 12:38

[gigglebug]

ORD said:

You've ruined an interesting thread with your childish ranting, Giggle.

Where as the sort of response below is obviously very "adult"

ORD said:

You've won at the Internet. Give yourself 2 points and tell your mum.

Can anyone spot the hypocrisy??

[gigglebug]

ORD said:

you've completely derailed it because your fragile ego could not tolerate someone (AER) actually knowing his stuff and not being interested in point-scoring nonsense.

And this is where you have made yourself look really ignorant to the situation!!

As I have shown it was actually AER who couldn't tolerate being wrong and it was because of his/her fragile ego that they tried to take the conversation somewhere where it didn't need to go merely to try and come out on top.

I asked a simple question on a well regarded forum as I thought that someone might be in the know and have good information, there doesn't seem to be any real info online.

What actually happened was that a "professional" didn't bother to give any useful insight but instead belittled the question, the subject matter and implied something that is factually incorrect.

When he/she was pulled up on it they obviously took offence and tried to take the conversation somewhere it was never intended to go just come out on top.

Respect is earn't, not just handed out. If AER had shown any respect and tried to answer the question in an honest helpful manor they would have earned it as well. But they didn't so I don't owe them anything as is stands.

And just because AER has a sad pathetic person like you running to his defence then being a grass when they have no real input to give doesn't make them any more right does it?

Edited by gigglebug on Sunday 21st February 14:48

[AER]

Hey wigglebum, if the Mclaren P1 was as good as the FQ440, how much power and torque would it produce? I'm sure you've got your hands on all the facts for this...

[gigglebug]

AER said:

Hey wigglebum, if the Mclaren P1 was as good as the FQ440, how much power and torque would it produce? I'm sure you've got your hands on all the facts for this...

And AER is back again even though they claimed to have nothing more to add to the debate! I wonder if one of your devoted followers will chime in now and accuse you of childish ranting, trying to be a smart arse and derailing the thread?

Whats the matter AER? You still vainly trying to prove a point that is completely irrelevant and was never once challenged? How very professional you are making yourself look.

Show me once where I have made any suggestion that I believed the performance figures of the FQ series to be accurate. You can't because I haven't. Yet you still seem to be hanging onto this notion for some reason and keep trying to start an unrelated "look how clever I am, I'm much cleverer than you" exercise based on this misassumption? Why is that AER? Do you need to try and make yourself feel that you are king of the hill again? Do you need to prove to all your disciples that you are still the messiah?

I however can point to the multitude of attempts by yourself to suggest that the official Mitsubishi FQ series was no different in concept to an independently produced, non manufacturer supported tuner effort like Revo's. I however have showed with facts that this indeed is not the case, that the FQ series was indeed an official, fully supported product of Mitsubishi much in keeping with any other official effort such as AMG and that you were wrong. That obviously was a problem to you wasn't it AER? Whats the matter? Are you so used to having people like George111 hang off your every word that you just don't know how to deal with someone correcting you when you have got something wrong?

So where will your so called professionalism take you now AER? You don't seem to have anywhere to go with this do you? It's OK though as I'm sure someone like ORD will be along anytime soon to blindly defend you. It must make you feel very important having folks like them to massage your ego!

And it is Gigglebug, not Wigglebum. Do at least make some sort of attempt to be "professional" when you post.

Edited by gigglebug on Monday 22 February 02:21

[Hafod]

rob.e said:

That's a great package, and given the relatively low starting price of the vRS it's overall not badly priced if you look at say an S4 or similar. Even the chassis and wheel upgrades look sensible and appropriate for the car - so often the tuner cars have a great engine but an overall package ruined by too-low ride height or overly stiff coilovers.

I have had S4' in various states of tune and presently have a new std vRS (on 19" optional wheels) and old highly modded s4. Knowing how much good tuning can transform a car I think there is a fab drivers car hiding within the vrs, it needs some far more sophisticated damping to improve secondary ride, but there is no denying it handles the weight in its nose very very well for a car built down to a price. My Std ones isn't what you,d call feelsome or exciting but I've had a few Welsh B road night drives where you settle into a really lovely 7/10th sort of smooth rhythm with gentle little inputs, stragely satisfying.

Ride height wise it's a dream compared to lowered cars.

[AER]

Keep banging that drum, wigglebum. How many ad hominem posts do you have to make before you actually contribute meaningfully to this thread?

[gigglebug]

AER said:

Keep banging that drum, wigglebum. How many ad hominem posts do you have to make before you actually contribute meaningfully to this thread?

And a limp response like this is clearly the only direction you could go in. Cements everything I have said.

[Colonial]

ORD said:

To everyone sentient on this thread, AER has shown himself to be a knowledgable, articulate and fairly expert poster.

You, by contrast, have reminded me why so few people with actual knowledge post on here these days. People who know their stuff get frustrated with ignorant, small-minded, smart arse chumps like you that cannot even be respectful and pleasant.

Absolutely. People should engage in a higher level of discourse, avoid cheap throwaway cliche lines and actually contribute something of note.

ORD said:

What's the point in 400bhp from a nasty turbo 4, though? No pleasure in revving out something like that, so no joy in actually using the power. Crappy throttle response. Horrid sound. Pub talk car, in my view. The fact that the power is completely unusable because of it being wrong wheel drive just hammers the point home!

Yourself included.

[egor110]

ORD said:

What's the point in 400bhp from a nasty turbo 4, though? No pleasure in revving out something like that, so no joy in actually using the power. Crappy throttle response. Horrid sound. Pub talk car, in my view. The fact that the power is completely unusable because of it being wrong wheel drive just hammers the point home!

Strange that honda,renault and seat beat a lot of rwd cars around nurburgring despite being wrong wheel drive.

[xjay1337]

This is Pistonheads. Where everyone drives 500bhp+ V8 which they drive everywhere sideways which have no modifications because manufacturers know best.

[neil1jnr]

The Vambo said:

ORD said:

You've ruined an interesting thread with your childish ranting, Giggle. I have reported you to the mods. I cannot stand this kind of 'I'm right! I'm right! You're wrong! I'm so clever' bullst

Did you even read that post he wrote? That is literally the opposite of it.

I read it as anyone can be right or wrong but for it to be accepted as gospel, you need to provide hard facts and because professional isn't good enough,

The Revo guy was treated pretty rudely IMHO, more so than anyone on this thread. I didn't see him flounce.

Edited by The Vambo on Sunday 21st February 12:38

The thread hasn't been ruined at all. AER has put some very interesting points across which really puts a big question mark on Revo's claims, but and like Vambo has said above, the Revo guy has not flounced.

The arguments all started from this below:

gigglebug said:

AER said:

gigglebug said:

ORD said:

Just from reading what people who know what their onions say, it seems like 200bhp per litre is a high enough specific output to give rise to reliability concerns. To put it in context, that would be a 600bhp M4 or a 720bhp 911.

I wonder what the measurable stats are for the FQ440?

The FQ-series are just the importer playing the same games as RevoTechnik. I'll bet the Japanese are mortally embarrassed that their name is used on such products.

The FQ400 and the FQ440 were developed by Mitsubishi UK and sold as official Mitsubishi products including manufacturer warranties. Not really the same thing is it?

Gigglebug asks about measurable stats for the FQ440, he gets a reply not directly related to his question of which he responds with a fact. The arguments begin from there. I haven't seen anything wrong with gigglebug's responses apart from them really getting on AER and ORD's nerves.

The only childish ranting appears to be from ORD. Reporting him to the mods, seriously? It was an enjoyable thread until I read that piece.