RE: PH poll: best hot hatch
Discussion
StoatInACoat said:
How can the stock 172 (not the cup) be so far above the 182?
And why aren't the cup and and standard one split into two categories if the 205 is? Not fussed by the results but some of the groups look a bit strange.
Because this is a poll by 300BHP/TON and he is a law unto himself. And why aren't the cup and and standard one split into two categories if the 205 is? Not fussed by the results but some of the groups look a bit strange.
Sorry, but I have to completely disagree with the winner, great car the Lancia Delta is, I would have put the Renaultsport Megane R26.R, or Renaultsport Clio 2.0 R.S as the best hot hatch ever made, and properly the last of it's breed as todays cars are going. And what the hell happened to the Honda Civic Type R (EP3), that should have easily made it into the top 10.
Edited by BBS-LM on Wednesday 3rd October 15:04
Hot hatch??
very odd list of cars..
the no1 is right Mk1 GTi (which I haved owned!)
But the rest? Escort Coworth, Lancia Integrale, Pulsar GTiR etc etc, they are all rally slags and should not be put on the same list.
My idea of a hot hatch is FWD and modest power. Not 4WD and huge turbos!
I wonder maybe a thread of the top rally slag list?
Audi Quattro
Lancia Integrale
Escort Cosworth
Subaru Impreza
Mitsi Evo
Celica GT4
Subaru Legacy
and many more
very odd list of cars..
the no1 is right Mk1 GTi (which I haved owned!)
But the rest? Escort Coworth, Lancia Integrale, Pulsar GTiR etc etc, they are all rally slags and should not be put on the same list.
My idea of a hot hatch is FWD and modest power. Not 4WD and huge turbos!
I wonder maybe a thread of the top rally slag list?
Audi Quattro
Lancia Integrale
Escort Cosworth
Subaru Impreza
Mitsi Evo
Celica GT4
Subaru Legacy
and many more
Scrambled said:
StoatInACoat said:
How can the stock 172 (not the cup) be so far above the 182?
And why aren't the cup and and standard one split into two categories if the 205 is? Not fussed by the results but some of the groups look a bit strange.
Because this is a poll by 300BHP/TON and he is a law unto himself. And why aren't the cup and and standard one split into two categories if the 205 is? Not fussed by the results but some of the groups look a bit strange.
But you're welcome all the same
Some cars that I thought deserve a top 50 shout and didnt get a look in:
Escort XR3i: not even mentioned in mk3 or mk4 form and it was probably the best selling hot hatch of the 80s, RS2000
Astra GSI, GSI TURBO or VXR, not a sniff for any of them
Fiesta XR2 MK2, RS TURBO OR RS 1800 nothing
Citroen saxo vts/r???
Honda civic vti?
Almera gti?
Golf vr6?
punto gt?
Escort XR3i: not even mentioned in mk3 or mk4 form and it was probably the best selling hot hatch of the 80s, RS2000
Astra GSI, GSI TURBO or VXR, not a sniff for any of them
Fiesta XR2 MK2, RS TURBO OR RS 1800 nothing
Citroen saxo vts/r???
Honda civic vti?
Almera gti?
Golf vr6?
punto gt?
anything fast said:
Hot hatch??
very odd list of cars..
the no1 is right Mk1 GTi (which I haved owned!)
But the rest? Escort Coworth, Lancia Integrale, Pulsar GTiR etc etc, they are all rally slags and should not be put on the same list.
My idea of a hot hatch is FWD and modest power. Not 4WD and huge turbos!
I wonder maybe a thread of the top rally slag list?
Audi Quattro
Lancia Integrale
Escort Cosworth
Subaru Impreza
Mitsi Evo
Celica GT4
Subaru Legacy
and many more
And the Delta would come first in that list too, what's your point?very odd list of cars..
the no1 is right Mk1 GTi (which I haved owned!)
But the rest? Escort Coworth, Lancia Integrale, Pulsar GTiR etc etc, they are all rally slags and should not be put on the same list.
My idea of a hot hatch is FWD and modest power. Not 4WD and huge turbos!
I wonder maybe a thread of the top rally slag list?
Audi Quattro
Lancia Integrale
Escort Cosworth
Subaru Impreza
Mitsi Evo
Celica GT4
Subaru Legacy
and many more
A very good list and results
The End
BBS-LM said:
LukeyLikey said:
Subaru Impreza Cosworth would be much higher in my list (I've had quite a few from the top 50. Very underrated car, and certainly better than the 08 STI above it.
I just do not class the Subaru Impreza as a hot hatch, or the Ford Escort RS Cosworth. In terms of product placement a Focus RS500 is no different to the RS Escort. And the Escort in small turbo form wasn't a rally homologation car at all but a road car with over 7200 examples in existence (isn't that more than there Clio 182 Trophy's).
Not too mention the fact that the GE, GH, GR, GV Impreza's haven't been rallied like past models. And as one final note cars like the Clio Williams were built to homologate the model for circuit racing.
I certainly wouldn't despite that the likes of the Cosworth, Integrale are different from a 205 or a Metra GTa, but they still fill the brief of a hot hatch unless you want to exclude far too many hatchbacks that you end up with a list missing most of the greatest ones.
Have to agree with what a lot of other posters have already said, sorry but the Cossie and the Grale aren't hot hatches.
My list in no particular order would be
Clio Williams - The original hot Clio and still the best.
Peugeot 205 1.9 GTI - A genre redefining hot hatch
Golf GTI Mk1 - Arguably the hot hatch that started it all.
Honorable mentions go to the 5 GT turbo for showing what could be done with a small capacity turbo engine in a light body 30 years ago and the Megane R26.R which surprisingly doesn't get a mention despite being the quickest hot hatch to ever lap the Ring.
My list in no particular order would be
Clio Williams - The original hot Clio and still the best.
Peugeot 205 1.9 GTI - A genre redefining hot hatch
Golf GTI Mk1 - Arguably the hot hatch that started it all.
Honorable mentions go to the 5 GT turbo for showing what could be done with a small capacity turbo engine in a light body 30 years ago and the Megane R26.R which surprisingly doesn't get a mention despite being the quickest hot hatch to ever lap the Ring.
Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 3rd October 15:38
dean350z said:
Yup....thats how great a car they are....spend some quality time behind the wheel of one and you'll see why.
No doubt about a clio williams being in the top ten. Drove one, as well as a few "valvers". Brilliant cars!! But vs the proven escos...no way its better. Then again as someone said an escos shouldnt be there...as its a rally slag. That i also agree with!! Megane R26.R is the clear winner imo!! And what is a S1 RST doing on there?? I have never driven one, but own a S2 and own a Fiesta RST (as well as a few r5 gtts, 4 x saxo vts' and even a 106 gti...hence my questioning in my previous post), and the s2 rst, r5 gtt, fiesta rst all drive like bundles of crap!! Briefly owned a base mk1 golf and it out handled any of them)
I also rate a saxo vts higher than a 106 gti...purely on value for money.
Again i echo what another poster said. Leave out the rally slags/homologation cars and the list would be very different!
RINGMEISTER said:
Some cars that I thought deserve a top 50 shout and didnt get a look in:
Escort XR3i: not even mentioned in mk3 or mk4 form and it was probably the best selling hot hatch of the 80s, RS2000
Astra GSI, GSI TURBO or VXR, not a sniff for any of them
Fiesta XR2 MK2, RS TURBO OR RS 1800 nothing
Citroen saxo vts/r???
Honda civic vti?
Almera gti?
Golf vr6?
punto gt?
The fact they didn't shows what a discerning lot PHers are. Quite a relief.Escort XR3i: not even mentioned in mk3 or mk4 form and it was probably the best selling hot hatch of the 80s, RS2000
Astra GSI, GSI TURBO or VXR, not a sniff for any of them
Fiesta XR2 MK2, RS TURBO OR RS 1800 nothing
Citroen saxo vts/r???
Honda civic vti?
Almera gti?
Golf vr6?
punto gt?
(I realise a couple of them are actually surprisingly good cars, Almera and saxo, but the rest...not so much)
Jacobyte said:
The people voted and were even required to give reasons for thier votes, which means it was the most fair poll ever done.
Naturally, the best car won.
Not at all, it just means that owners of other cars (Integra anyone??) didn't bother to vote or the people that did vote had never driven one. I doubt there are many people who have driven all the cars on that list so they will just vote for the ones they do have knowledge of in order of preference and discount the rest however (subjectively) superior they may be. Naturally, the best car won.
Personally I still think 'hot hatch' means NASP FWD. Nice to see the EK9 make it into the top 10, though it would have been 5th based on my interpretation. If I were to go into fanboi mode, it is also technically a far superior car to the Golfs, Clio and 205, but it's also far, far less well known so it got a commendable position all things regarded.
Guvernator said:
...
Honorable mentions go to the 5 GT turbo for showing what could be done with a small capacity turbo engine in a light body 30 years ago ...
Indeed and also include the venerable and hedge-hungry Uno turbo in that mentions too!Honorable mentions go to the 5 GT turbo for showing what could be done with a small capacity turbo engine in a light body 30 years ago ...
Glad to see someone also ++'d the Ritmo 130TC; another founding "hot hatch" member.
Not sure the delta should have won, tho.
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